Neck, scalene, brachial plexus spasms, trigeminal neuralgia

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34
Hi,

I’ve had fatigue since being injured by a chiro adjustment in 2012 (was treating injury of SI joint). My entire back went into spasms.
I did not realize I had Ehlers Danlos, at the time. I was prescribed clonzapam first, doses only at night. Was then prescribed Lyrica and baclofen one year later. It controlled the spasms which were only in my back.

For the past year , I have had terrible muscle spasms in my neck and brachial plexus. Now my scalenes. No chiari or structural instability was seen on dynamic MRI. Does anyone else have this? Trying to sort out if they are related to meds in any way, or something else.Thanks in advance.
 

PatJ

Forum Support Assistant
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5,288
Location
Canada
I don't know about your spasms but you mention trigeminal neuralgia in the title. Here are some suggestions for it:
EarthClinic
https://www.earthclinic.com/cures/trigeminal-neuralgia-treatment.html

RALA, from a comment on CureZone:
For trigeminal neuralgia I cannot recommend R-lipoic acid enough. It's a nerve soother and has worked a wonder for mine. People use it for various neuropathies. [Doctor's Best is a good brand.]

Clove oil, from http://oilhealthbenefits.com/clove-oil/:
Clove oil also relieves neuritis. A special kind of neuralgia, called trigeminal neuralgia is a troublesome condition which causes pain in the face. This pain has a pattern. It goes from the temples into the ears, eyes and down to the cheek and sometimes in the tooth as well. This pain follows the path of the trigeminal nerve which is a major facial nerve. Applying clove oil on this nerve can relieve the symptoms of trigeminal neuralgia. It reduces inflammation and pain in the source, creates a numbing sensation and pain gets dulled. Do not apply clove oil directly. Dilute it in olive oil by adding 3 – 4 drops of clove oil in 100 ml olive oil and using this as your stock oil.
 

junkcrap50

Senior Member
Messages
1,415
Sorry, I don't have much to add or contribute. Just want to add that ME/CFS patients should be very cautious visiting chiropractors as the incidence of Ehler's Danos Syndrom & Cervical Instability is high (apparently, see Jen Brea & others) and often unknown & undiagnosed. I've been temped to see a chiro for muscle knots in neck & shoulders, but am wary of them in general - more so w/ EDS & Jen Brea's neck experience.

Have you had any nerve conduction testing done? What doctors have you gone to? Neurosurgeons? Orthopedic surgeons? Spine specialists? Perhaps you could try visiting other chiropractors purely for consultation & diagnosis- without any chiro treatments or adjustments done (which would make things worse). They may be more open to other explanations than regular spine doctors or orthos.

What drugs are you on? Try looking up their side effects online. Also, there are online drug interaction calculators you can compare all your drugs to.

Also, ME/CFS can be triggered by physical insult & injury, e.g. surgeries, car accidents, falls, etc. However, the incidence of CFS by these triggers is low compared to more common triggers. See "Physical trauma" here: https://mecfsroadmap.altervista.org/#fourth-round-tests for more info. That's the only source I have, besides my doctor's anecdotes.
 

lenora

Senior Member
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5,056
Hello @junkcrap50....you did a fine job of pulling together all of the presently know info of events leading to ME/CFS/FM. Thank-you for doing so. I'm one of the victims of many of the diagnoses you noted.

I keep forgetting it, but a pituitary tumor led me to my first MRI, which was quickly hijacked by my neurologist who had found Syringomyelia. (He had volunteered in a Third World Country and recognized it). I had also done severe nerve damage to the l. side of my body. The neurosurgeon noted that I also had Arnold-Chiari Malformation. Of these, the easiest solution was bromocriptine for years to control the pituitary tumor.

The week following diagnosis, I had emergency surgery b/c hydrocephalus was dangerously high, and it was caused by one of the cysts caused by my Syringomyelia. I was never even close to normal after that surgery (which is no longer done, by the way).

About 6 mos. later I was informed that the surgery had failed and I was told about a neurosurgeon at one of the Medical Schools, a man from S. Africa who recognized Arnold-Chiari and knew about a new surgery being used to control both the Chiari and the SM. our years later, after he had perfected it, I had the surgery. It was via the brainstem, left me feeling some pain after the first difficult night, but it took about 2 wks. before the skull knitted together and didn't feel squishy. It did clear the hydrocephalus and most of the other symptoms, including severe neck pain, weakness in my legs, the cape like pain of SM, etc., outright disappeared or at least lessened. The insurance was difficult and I went home in 3 days. That was fine....I'd rather be there.

Now this is very important: You should never go for ordinary physical therapy (PT), ask for a myofascial specialist (look up fascia to understand why this is important). Most PT's with a Ph.D. are aware of this specialty, and I'm presently undergoing it again...probably 30 years after the first surgery. It's helping immensely after a series of 11 falls that I sustained over the past 10 mos. or so. It was the last that did me in...I fell against a piano bench and was left in severe pain/more severe pain. I'm told my balance is good, which then leaves seizures as being the cause. It's helping and I would recommend this to those who feel they need it. Talk to your neurologist or rheumatologist (although you really should see a neurologist to rule out other causes), about obtaining a prescription. PT has apprarently undergone tremendous changes since my days. Now myofascial therapy is a given and the patient is checked (supposedly) for trigger points and myofascial problems. I had just about finished with trigger points...they were disappearing on their own when this occurred.

Yes, a car accident, sports injury or any type of trauma can cause SM. However, if you have ACM (Chiari) and SM together, it's because of a congenital condition (you were born with it). An early tip-off is l. sided scoliosis (I was forever told to sit up, as I really couldn't, stand up straight, etc.). My childhood was a series of heavy braces and/or partial body casts and this went on for years. A specialist from a nearby city came in to a locale about once/wk., and we were seen there. I also suffer from the most severe lordosis anyone has ever seen and kyphosis. The myofascial therapy is helping with the latter. I do exercises that I'm give for about 1 hr./day. Ask your child's Pediatrician to do a scoliosis check...they usually do anyway, but to tell you if it's l. sided. Then see a pediatric neurologist or probably even a neurologist. If you have a Shriner's Hospital for Children, all treatment is free, so you may want to bear that in mind. (For children only.) I don't know of the common ways of handling this in children, but the earlier it's attended to, the better. At the very least get a baseline MRI and pick up a copy and a report for your own file. NOTE: The report for me did not pick up on either the SM or ACM. So it's important to have your neurologist and neurosurgeon read the copy you have.

So now I'm 73 yrs. old, and a lot has happened in those years. The pain was uncontrollable in the beginning. We had Elavil, and that was it. Then along came our savior, gabapentin, it was an anti-seizure med that also controlled the pain signals from the brain to the spinal cord. It let me get out of bed and walk again. My arms can't be used b/c of too much nerve damage. Nerve pain is difficult to treat...a burning pain that never ends, although Ace Ice Packs are good for it. Buy the fabric covered large ones and put another tea towel or something over them....20 min. will numb most pain. Lately, I've been getting some relief from a heating pad set on low for about 20 min. Don't overdo it, or you'll end up in worse pain. 20 on, then 20 off is the rule.

We now have a few drugs that can help treat the pain activity from the brain/spinal cord. I'm presently on Lyrica. The pituitary tumor disappeared at some point, I don't know when. I had a very early menopause...started at 42 and hot/cold flashes are still a problem. Anxiety is a major problem for us. Talk to your doctors, starting with your neurologist. There are meds that aren't addicting, and you may/may not need one. I was able to get myself out of the first round of anxiety...attended special meetings and even bought the AA Blue Book and lived by it. No, I've never had a problem with alcohol and now don't drink b/c of meds. After I had shingles three times in a row.....a fourth a no. of yrs. earlier, I had incredible anxiety. I then had to go on meds, and still use them....probably always will. I was taken off the med during my last hospitalization. The drug the doctor wanted to put me on was even more addictive than the one I was on. My neurologist was furious as was my Pain Specialist. Every one of us knows that drugs are reduced very slowly...I'm still annoyed at that doctor.

Recently I was hospitalized 8 times in 10 mos. All different problems; all serious. I have Autoimmune Encephalitis, a relatively new illness, had severe seizures that resulted in a fall of 6" (yes, inches) and I broke my wrist. Now I have pain in both hands. Rib problems, which I've had since this saga began probably 35 yrs. ago, 5 stents in my heart (2 added during recent hospitalizations). even though my diet could be featured in a health magazine, and a serious problem with my carotid artery, which is 98% blocked and I'm supposed to have stented in the near future. ( Genetic hyper-cholesterol). I'lI finish the tests and will talk to the Dr. doing it next week...if he'll touch me, that is. The seizures left me unconscious for 2 days during two separate visits...not good for the brain, as you can imagine. They're under good control with Keppra. I was losing the vision in my l. eye, then suddenly the r. one a few days later, headache and then my l. leg simply wouldn't hold me. I thought I answered the questions my husband asked, but not so. OF NOTE: I did not have the usual symptoms of a stroke and actually didn't have one. Fortunately I was hospitalized before the seizure and the doctors saw them. During the last hospitalization I was so close to death that I could feel it....no, I wasn't afraid. If I'm bedridden for too long, the myofascial problems take over and you feel nothing but pain and a feeling of being locked inside your own body. That's why I wanted to go for therapy...I have a great neurologist and wish that all of you could find one. He has been with me every step of the way since this began.

Sleep problems are severe. It would seem that Steroids combined with the new short-acting anesthetic, is a major culprit. I didn't have proper sleep (and I'm not talking about 8 hrs./night, but 3-4 is great for me) for about 2 mos. after the last procedure. I'm a patient with a lot of conditions, thus making me difficult for doctors, and anyone who is in contact with me. I'm extremely kind and courteous to them and always have a list of questions. Since I forget easily, they're written down. It takes time to learn to focus, sit for a movie and my love...reading, etc. Please bear that in mind. I wish you better days (and they come and go). Lenora. Note to Moderator: Please do not shorten. The information is important to others.
 

lenora

Senior Member
Messages
5,056
Vision Blue: Hello. Early tip-off now know...l. sided scoliosis in children &, presumably, adults.

The reasons was congenital (born with) for me. SM can be caused by accidents, sports injuries and other things...complete MRI from brain to end of spine is needed. If you have SM & Chiari, then it's known that the case is congenital. Some cases never get worse. Bear that in mind, but see a good neurologist (who will rule out all obvious other causes) and a good neurosurgeon. Newest machine is a Tesla (?) Try Medical Schools for names, and always get a new phone no. before you hang-up. Teaching hospitals, Dr. Bolognese in NYC and another in Spain can read MRI series. Most of the ones I knew of, good surgeons, have retired. Mayo is useless in neurology...Miami Institute is good, Barrow Clinic in Phoenix, UCLA had a good reputation as did Stanford, but I can't tell you about today. Others should have some input...we should have a list available and I know there are more than 3 people in the world capable of at least making a diagnosis. Always get copies of discs & reports and make certain you keep one for yourself. Anything else, please contact me. Again, appreciate info about Encephalitis. Depends upon which part of the brain is affected as to what is lost. Yours, Lenora.
 
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