Microcurrent stimulation for Vagus nerve healing (vs TENS)

[tango]

Has anyone used a microcurrent stimulation device for vagus nerve therapy???

I have a TENS machine and ear clips and haven't seen results yet but maybe I am not using it with the right settings or need to give it more time. I am keen on tVNS but haven't had any improvement

I belong to a Facebook group run by Sterling Cooley who talks about rehabilitation of the vagus nerve. He is saying that a TENS machine + ear clips is not as good as using a microcurrent stimulation device which he says are specifically designed to be used on the ears. Can anyone verify this? I don't really get the difference and I tried to Google it and got confused (brain fog day).

Does anyone know if the very expensive Nemechek tech vitality smartcable is a microcurrent device?

Sterling has his own website and free tutorials so he has a vested interest in promoting microcurrent stimulators. That doesn't mean he's wrong but I would like independent verification
You can check it out here https://vaguscure.com/learn

 

[Hip]

You can buy microcurrent therapy machines for around $60 or so. Machines include:

InTENSity Micro Combo TENS & Microcurrent Combination Unit — does TENS and microcurrent. $69

MT-330 Microcurrent Machine — microcurrent only. £40

TENScare Flexistim Multi Mode Electrotherapy Unit — does TENS, microcurrent, EMS and IFT. £140.

You can also spend up to $1000 for an Alpha-Stim microcurrent machine, which does not really offer any benefits over a cheaper device.

Does anyone know if the very expensive Nemechek tech vitality smartcable is a microcurrent device?

Looks to be a microcurrent device.

 

[tango]

Thanks @Hip
It looks like it would be worth giving the microcurrent stimulation a go. I wanted to try the Nemechek device but it's very expensive and the settings are limited to 5 minutes at a time and it's also reliant on compatible ios. When ios versions upgrade the software on the Nemechek device needs to be updated too.

I will give this a try. Not much else is working and tVNS looks promising

 

[vision blue]

I just started a thread on vagal nerve stimulators since i didnt see this one

Have you had a y luck? Tried the microcirrent

Somehow am getting a strong since of dejavu in asking this but do yiu know if i could adapt this to to stimulate via neck rather than ear?

 

[tango]

I just started a thread on vagal nerve stimulators since i didnt see this one

Have you had a y luck? Tried the microcirrent

Somehow am getting a strong since of dejavu in asking this but do yiu know if i could adapt this to to stimulate via neck rather than ear?

I ordered the InTENSity Micro Combo TENS & Microcurrent Combination Unit but international shipping problems have held it up

I want to use it on the ears. What is the advantage of stimulating the neck??

My question is why you need double ear clips rather than a single ear clip as I don't want to fiddle around with the clips. I just want to plug and play as my concentration for fiddly things like that isn't great and I don't want to destroy the ear clips with my clumsiness and lack of focus

 

[niccon]

Hello tango,

Have you used the VNS device? Does it help you? i just started at a center, in Belgium, but only have been once so far.

Thanks

 

[tango]

Hello tango,

Have you used the VNS device? Does it help you? i just started at a center, in Belgium, but only have been once so far.

Thanks

The tens machine is a VNS device and it didn’t help but we are all different

next month I will try the micro current device and see how I go

 

[niccon]

Did you use it every day? For how long? What was the frequency (Hz) and microseconds? I use 20Hz and 250microsec.

 

[Elike]

What happened since, any positive results? I am thinking of buying one as well, but as money is tight I would love to read some positive experiences ... Hoper there are any

 

[BrightCandle]

I tried this a few years ago, I already had a TENs device and I set it to the closest program to the suggested settings with some ear clips and it did nothing of note. Vagus nerve stimulation just didn't do anything for me. I find TENs useful however on my back, it can relieve quite a lot of pain fairly easily.

 

[Elike]

thank you, yeah I am sceptical now, maybe I will skip this try.

 

[BrightCandle]

thank you, yeah I am sceptical now, maybe I will skip this try.

One thing I should note is that I used noise cancelling headphones and vagus nerve soothing music from Youtube to keep my body calm while I moved house. I could block out the noise of the movers while having this continuous calming music and it actually worked well. That level of noise and my sensitivity would have usually kicked off an inappropriate adrenal response but I managed to move house without it happening. I don't know if it definitely calms the system down and rebalances the two sides of the system, that I am skeptical on but it was soothing. There is something in vagus nerve stimulation, nothing as profound as a cure of course but at times it is helpful to me.

 

[Elike]

I will look that up, though my tinnitus is always kind of a hindrance ( it get's louder from "music"), as well as music is not working right now, sound sensitivity is big, so mostly I use falling snow videos to paint over that ...
It is so nice to have this community here to talk about all these "ailments" - the healthy ones can't believe how much does not work in our bodies, but I guess you know that yourself.
Thanks though, I will look up vagus nerve videos

 

[niccon]

Hello all,

I did use a "parasym" device everyday for a month as a rental. The specs were: 30 min/ day of 250 microS, at 25hz. I had a little clip that was attached to the "tragus" area of the left ear. Just one ear, not both.
it didn't do a thing.
i did use for a longer period a tDCS device. I placed the anode on the DLPFC part of the skull and the cathode for a month on the right side of the brainstem. Then on the occiputal area on the right. Then on the right DLPFC. The current was 2 mA. It worked well for about a month and a half, then over the following 2 months it gradually decreased. I felt more awake, focussed with less pains. Unfortunately all those positive feelings dissapeared.

Kind regards

 

[niccon]

Oh I also have a TENS (bluetens) device. I used a program that sends electrical pulses for about a week on an area on the left of my throat, where the vagus nerve passes. I don't know the exact specs of the therapy, but I kept it at low intensity, because otherwise the muscles around the throat contract, and that's not very pleasant. It didn't do anything.
I even tried a Healy device for about 2 months by trying all kinds of programs. i felt a bit better, but it could be placebo effect. I'm willing to sell these devices cheap for who wants them.

Be well

 

[Countrygirl]

A lot of us are trying the Medfit device. You can read about it on A Vagus Adventure, the Facebook page run by Dawn Wiley who has had good results with it.

Physios for ME have just circulated a survey from the results reported by the group:

https://www.physiosforme.com/post/v...06b4&cid=1a15c0dc-914d-4912-82f4-0103ffad4b2a

Vagus Nerve Stimulation Survey – Results

In February we produced "An international survey of experiences and attitudes towards Transcutaneous Vagus Nerve Stimulation for people with Myalgic Encephalomyelitis /Chronic Fatigue Syndrome."


The survey was initiated by Dawn Wiley, founder of the Facebook Group “A Vagus Adventure AVA” and Andrea Parker, an Occupational Therapist in South Australia. Both Dawn and Andrea use Transcutaneous Vagus Nerve Stimulation (tVNS) as part of the management of their ME and linked up with Dr Nicola Clague-Baker to develop the survey through her position at the University of Liverpool.


The aim of this study was to explore the experiences of people with ME who have tried tVNS. More information about the theory behind tVNS can be found in this article or you can watch this presentation by Andrea Parker.


We received 131 responses and want to thank everyone for taking the time to share their experiences. We plan to interview some participants to find out more in-depth detail as the results show a real mix of positive and negative experiences. We now want to explore whether there are identifiable groups of people with ME who would benefit from tVNS, and which settings and parameters are the most effective.


Physios for ME really enjoyed working with ME patient experts and we would be happy to help other people with ME develop their own research ideas. If you’d like to discuss this, please feel free to get in touch.


The study team will be writing up the results and will produce an article and then present them at ME and physiotherapy conferences, but in the meantime we wanted to share a brief overview of some of the results from the survey:


Demographics



86.3% of respondents were female


Age range: 13%: 19 – 34 year olds

37%: 35 – 50 year olds

47%: 51 – 70 year olds

3%: >71 years


How long have had ME symptoms:

21%: 0 – 4 years 27%: 5 – 9 years 22%: 10 – 20 years 30%: > 20 years


Geographic location

60%: UK including N Ireland

15%: Europe

13%: Australia and Oceania

12%: N America


tVNS use 67%: current user

33%: stopped use



What device do you use?

45%: TENs

14.5%: Parasym

2.3%: Nemos

38.2%: other



How long have you been using it?

28%: 0 – 1 month

16%: 1 – 3 months

21%: 3 - 6 months

21%: 6 – 12 months

8%: 1 year +

6%: Other



How would you rate the effect on your ME/CFS?

6.1 %: Unhelpful/made me worse

15.3%: Had no effect

19.1%: Mildly beneficial

17.6%: Moderately beneficial

15.3%: Very beneficial

16%: Too soon to say

10.7%: Don’t know


Would you recommend tVNS to other people with ME/CFS?

64%: Yes

3.8%: No

32.1%: Unsure


Thank you again to everyone who got involved with the survey, and to Dawn and Andrea for making it happen. We will update the website with links to the full write-up when it is published.

 

[marcjf]

I have a cheap microcurrent device (the Intensity one). Currently trying it. Unfortunately I do not have a double electrode ear clip. I use an ear clip with a single electrode, and close the loop on my neck with a skin patch electrode. Do not know if that affects the results.

tVNS is something that the more I read about it, the more confused I feel. Recently there was a story in the Daily Mail about someone who had success: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/...200-device-used-treat-injured-racehorses.html

She used a microcurrent device meant to treat injured horses.

A bit sketchy, but this year there was another study showing success on a POTS rabbit model: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35118574/

But when you go to the forums, most people's experience seems to be kind of "meh". I certainly haven't seen any difference yet, but I haven't been using it for long. Are we all doing it wrong?

 

[BrightCandle]

But when you go to the forums, most people's experience seems to be kind of "meh". I certainly haven't seen any difference yet, but I haven't been using it for long. Are we all doing it wrong?

I doubt it. Given the amount of fabricated studies there are surrounding ME/CFS by Psychologists and Physiotherapists at this point I consider there is no real science being done by these professions whatsoever. So when you get something like this its important to view it with a high degree of skeptisim, not replicating the results is common place when it comes to these professions for going on about 80 years now and all their studies typically get graded as garbage tier quality some time later.