ME=not "MUS" Please be one of the 1004 signatures we need to reach 10,000

[MEisnotMUPS]

People if you can, please consider signing this petition. It is so important. http://bit.ly/1T2Aus9
MUPS or MUS is becoming the next big thing with respect to ME or CFS. It will affect all of us. Eventhough there is no evidence base for the biopsychosocial model, nor the treatments MUPS "experts" actively promote, that is, CBT! MUPS/MUS is becoming a "diagnosis"on its own, and MUPS/MUS experts consider CFS to be a MUS/MUPS "diagnosis", calling CFS a somatoform disorder, functional syndrome, in need of CBT.

Yesterday we found out that 2 members of the Dutch Health Council committee, with task to write advisory report on ME to parliament (in total almost HALF of the committee consists of MUPS experts) not only wrote articles with White and/or Wessely, we knew that, but they are in EURASMUS
So they are direct colleagues with White + Per Fink (yes, the one from Karina!) http://eurasmus.net/

In the Netherlands there is a 1.5 million Euro project funded by health insurers to get ME (MUPS professionals, see ME and CFS as MUPS) patients referred to mental health clinics for CBT. these 2 members of the committee are involved in this project also.

Please if you can take a minute and sign the petition (don't forget to click on the confirmation link in the email you will receive after you sign). If you can ask others to sign and share this, please do. Dutch patients can really use all the help we can get. The biopsychosocial model does not apply to ME, CBT is no cure ! http://bit.ly/1T2Aus9

 

[SilverbladeTE]

Point out to the Dutch parliament the current scandal in The Lancet
the psychosomatic lobby are a *FRAUD*, as that shows and will go down in history as one of the worst criminal conspiracies in medical history along with the Eugenics monsters.

And the Eugenics movement pretty much damn well PROVES the medical profession IS and HAS been capable of such horrendous, massive crimes and blatant refusal to accept real Science.

 

[panckage]

Eventhough there is no evidence base for the biopsychosocial model,

Maybe I'm missing something but from university 'biopsychosocial' doesn't actually mean anything. Ok it does it means that the treatment will contain biological, psychological, and sociological treatments

Eg.
Biological - medicine
Psychological - how the person deals with related stress as a result of the illness
Sociological - support groups


Basically it's a catchall, biopsychosocial can treat everything because all possible treatments are contained within the 3 modalities. It seems to be a way to say that they know nothing about the illness so they are just approaching from all possible angles. It's also a way to keep 2 undergrad departments full that are otherwise pretty useless

Am I missing something here?

 

[halcyon]

Am I missing something here?

The biopsychosocial model attributes the cause of disease to the combination of biological, psychological, and social factors. This contrasts with the biomedical model which drops the latter two.

 

[alex3619]

The biopsychosocial model attributes the cause of disease to the combination of biological, psychological, and social factors. This contrasts with the biomedical model which drops the latter two.

From the outset the BPS model was geared toward justifying psychogenic disease.

Doctors are well aware that there are biological, psychological, social and environmental factors. The BPS model just formalizes that. The base theory behind BPS is good, just as is the theory behind EBM, but how its currently implemented and the direction its going makes a mockery of science, just like EBM. The primary driving forces appear to be more sociological, political and ideological, rather than scientific. As was the Eugenics movement.

BPS is kind of empty though. Its a vast umbrella in which most things can fit.

Somehow there is a huge one way divide here as well. You see its often promoted that psychological factors cause biological problems, but its almost never acknowledged and researched that biological problems can cause psychological symptoms, even though that is obvious.

Those wanting to use a BPS model, in general, can be praised for looking at psychological and sociological factors that affect disease outcomes and experience. On the other hand this in no way validates rejecting the scientific method and using pseudoscientific methodology. Good science is critical to good long term advancement of medicine, including psychiatry. Doctors need better skills for detecting bad science. What PACE has taught us is just how bad most of the medical profession is at identifying and correcting very low grade research.

 

[chipmunk1]

Point out to the Dutch parliament the current scandal in The Lancet
the psychosomatic lobby are a *FRAUD*, as that shows and will go down in history as one of the worst criminal conspiracies in medical history along with the Eugenics monsters.

And the Eugenics movement pretty much damn well PROVES the medical profession IS and HAS been capable of such horrendous, massive crimes and blatant refusal to accept real Science.

 

[SilverbladeTE]

Chipmunk1
the road to hell is paved with good intentions....

 

[chipmunk1]

Chipmunk1
the road to hell is paved with good intentions....

Not sure if they have good intentions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medically_unexplained_physical_symptoms

 

[SilverbladeTE]

Not sure if they have good intentions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medically_unexplained_physical_symptoms

well there's two ways to take that saying, and one of them is the fact that those who strongly proclaim they have "only good intentions" are really ramming their DEMANDS down other folks' throats, regardless of the cost

MUPS, way we've been screwed etc, is just modern day Witch Hunting or whatever.

 

[Chrisb]

I thought some of the comment here was a little OTT. Then I saw this.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...o-euthanasia-due-to-severe-ptsd-a7023666.html

 

[MEisnotMUPS]

If you can take a minute to sign today please! #MEawarenessday the dutch need help with this totally insane situation

https://petities.nl/petitions/me-is...sie-en-houd-u-aan-de-adviesopdracht?locale=en

 

[alex3619]

Not sure if they have good intentions.

They have good intentions if its good for them. Oh, wait ...

 

[MEisnotMUPS]

Dear All, please don't forget to sign! We need your help! So if you can please take a minute and help, sign + share! ME is not MUPS/MUS, Somatoform disorder, functional syndrome..CBT is not a cure!
https://petities.nl/petitions/me-is...sie-en-houd-u-aan-de-adviesopdracht?locale=en

Dutch patients have no options for treatment in the Netherlands, the Dutch "CFS" guideline is made part of the MUS guideline which equates ME and CFS with a undifferentiated somatoform disorder. The author of this guideline is on the Dutch Health Council committee who has the important task to write an advisory report to Dutch parliament on ME. There are 3 other MUS professionals on the committee aswell who have ties with healthinsurers and PACE authors. There is no knowledge about this disease with Dutch health care professionals, psychologists and health insurers are implemention nation wide MUPS/MUS programs to get patients referred to CBT in mental health care institutions. Patients are quite often forced to do CBT when applying for social benefits etc...yet the biopsychosocial model has no evidence base. It hampers all progress.

We need something to change. To stop ME being equated with MUPS/MUS and psychologists taking over ME as a "diagnosis" of MUS, and subsequent "treatments" (CBT), that health insurers are now investing in to reduce health care spending.

So please take a minute and sign. Thank you. We all just want a chance to get our lives back.

https://petities.nl/petitions/me-is...sie-en-houd-u-aan-de-adviesopdracht?locale=en

(don't forget to click on the confirmation link in the email after you sign)

 

[Yogi]

Have signed @MEisnotMUPS. Very disturbed to see that this a re-run of the UK situation with NICE guidelines and CMO report of of 2002.

Who are the ten members on the committee?

You said "There are 3 other MUS professionals on the committee aswell who have ties with healthinsurers and PACE authors. "

Who are they?

 

[Hutan]

Signed

 

[MEisnotMUPS]

Thank you Yogi and Hutan!

To answer your question Yogi; The committee members can be found here: https://www.gezondheidsraad.nl/nl/over-ons/de-raad/adhoc-commissie/myalgische-encefalomyelitis-me

Rosmalen and Knoop are the ones who are projectleaders in the 1.5 million Euro MUPS project funded by Health Insurers. They have written articles with PACE authors (White and others) and Wessely. They also are part of Eurasmus.net the European Research Association for Somatisation and Medically Unexplained Symptoms. (which includes members like White, Creed, Per Fink, the last one is holding Karina Hansen against her will). Interestingly enough the link to the eurasmus.net site has now been taken down........
Another MUPS member is Olde Hartman, who wrote the Dutch MUPS GP guideline, which describes CFS as an undifferentiated somatoform disorder. The last is van Dijk, rehabilitation doctor, who also worked from a MUPS perspective.

 

[MEisnotMUPS]

Don't forget to sign, we soooooo need the help. The biopsychosocial paradigm still has a huge influence in the Netherlands (as it has now on a Dutch Health Council Committee that is about to write an advisory report on ME !! to Dutch Parliament, 4 MUS members have very close ties with PACE authors, Wessely and Per Fink (Karina!).

https://petities.nl/petitions/me-is...n-houd-u-aan-de-adviesopdracht/edit?locale=en

Please help stop the use of invalidated / unfounded hypothesis of this bipsychosocial model and its treatments (CGT/GET), it cannot continue to be the basis of care for ME patients in the Netherlands and elsewhere.

We cannot wait another decade for change. ME is not MUS, MUPS, somatoform disorder or functional somatic syndrome, or whatever term psychologists come up with, CBT is not cure/treatment.

Please sign (with your name or anonymous): https://petities.nl/petitions/me-is...n-houd-u-aan-de-adviesopdracht/edit?locale=en

(don't forget to click on the confirmation link in the email you receive after you sign) Thank you!!

 

[MEisnotMUPS]

Please guys (and girls ;-)), we truely need your help with this petition. Help us fight this please

https://petities.nl/petitions/me-is...n-houd-u-aan-de-adviesopdracht/edit?locale=en

ME is not MUS/MUPS. It is the old wessely-school ideas that are being recycled here into somatic functionals syndromes, or psychiatric diagnosis like undifferentiated somatoform disorders (the MUS GP guideline in the netherlands lists CFS as a somatoform disorder!, these people are now on a commitee that will write a highly influencial report to parliament that will determine health policy for the next decade). I've seen articles where even now chronic lyme is being called MUS, and POTS. We need real ME experts, we need real medical care, we need a change to get our lives back, we need your help as fellow ME patients to get these signatures, please if there is a way you can help, it would be much appreciated. We can use come people in different countries who are willing to help post this link and ask followers/friends to sign.
We cannot wait another decade for change and be confronted with (often forced) CBT and the biopsychosocial model for this illness that completely contradicts the current state of the evidence....please help....please sign..... !!

 

[MEisnotMUPS]

Just wanted to share this very special birthday wish from Ingrid on her facebook page, ill with ME for many years.

https://www.facebook.com/ingrid.glaser1/posts/10153584486676408?pnref=story

Its her birthday today, and yesterday she asked not to get birthday messages or presents this year, but all she wanted was that as many people as possible would share her fB message and sign the Dutch petition (and ask their friends on facebook to do the same), a petition that is so important for her and other ME patients.

Let's give Ingrid the greatest birthday ever!


https://www.facebook.com/ingrid.glaser1/posts/10153584486676408?pnref=story

 

[Yogi]

Thank you Yogi and Hutan!

To answer your question Yogi; The committee members can be found here: https://www.gezondheidsraad.nl/nl/over-ons/de-raad/adhoc-commissie/myalgische-encefalomyelitis-me

Rosmalen and Knoop are the ones who are projectleaders in the 1.5 million Euro MUPS project funded by Health Insurers. They have written articles with PACE authors (White and others) and Wessely. They also are part of Eurasmus.net the European Research Association for Somatisation and Medically Unexplained Symptoms. (which includes members like White, Creed, Per Fink, the last one is holding Karina Hansen against her will). Interestingly enough the link to the eurasmus.net site has now been taken down........
Another MUPS member is Olde Hartman, who wrote the Dutch MUPS GP guideline, which describes CFS as an undifferentiated somatoform disorder. The last is van Dijk, rehabilitation doctor, who also worked from a MUPS perspective.

Thanks for that.

I cannot understand dutch so assume these are some declaration forms? What are they? Any dutch speaker know if anything interesting in them?

The four you mention are:

Fons van Dijk
https://www.gezondheidsraad.nl/sites/default/files/belangenverklaring_dijk_aj_van_045_2016.pdf

Hans Knoop
https://www.gezondheidsraad.nl/sites/default/files/belangenverklaring_knoop_h_045_2016.pdf

olde Hartman
https://www.gezondheidsraad.nl/sites/default/files/belangenverklaring_olde_hartman_tc_045_2016.pdf

Rosmalen
https://www.gezondheidsraad.nl/sites/default/files/belangenverklaring_rosmalen_jgm_045_2016.pdf


Persoonlijke financiële belangen means personal financial interests.

Where can we find on google the 1.5 million Euro MUPS project funded by Health Insurers?

Have all their financial interests been declared correctly as there appears to be no mention of insurance?