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Liver repair?

poohsilk

Never gives up
Messages
36
Location
San Diego 2019
I have been coming here for long time but not often enough latley!
. I'm looking for the subjects of liver. I believe my gastrointestinal problems most of my malaise and achiness comes from my liver not working well and thereby causing constipation which I have tried everything for. I do coffee enemas I am trying to do binders to get mold out that I cannot tolerate it at all. I am thinking about starting bitters to see if that helps. Is there another place in the Forum that I should post this? Or can you direct me to where conversations might have been for tips about this? I have had genetic tests which say liver doesn't work in several categories. Thanking you all in advance, Cristina
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,434
I believe my gastrointestinal problems most of my malaise and achiness comes from my liver

Chinese Traditional Herbs can target the Liver Qi, and I take many herbs to improve liver function. I go to a well respected, experienced herbalist who prescribes specific herbs for my needs.

Its not a cure but it sure helps and I do not wish to give up this assistance.

I have significantly improved by gastro-intestinal function, by consistently takiog four chinese herbs targetting IBS-d symptoms. In fact: the last 2 months I've experienced tremendous improvement. I think that taking Mito support supplements has improved by Gut Permeability and inflammation there.
 

Tammy

Senior Member
Messages
2,194
Location
New Mexico
I have a book called "Liver Rescue" by Anthony William. I have learned more about the liver from that book than any other source. It's a pretty lengthy book. Tells all about how to heal the liver...........and much much more. You might check to see if your library carries it if you're interested.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,406
Location
Austria
I have learned more about the liver from that book than any other source.

Just remain aware that all of Anthony's health-promoting interventions are already found elsewhere. All the knowledge he promotes, he claims to have been given to him by a spirit. Impossible to prove by science, since it allegdedly isn't developed that far yet. A compendium of known interventions, with a lot of fantasy-literary work woven in.

For example, he promotes a low fat mainly vegetarian diet. Interestingly, I developed a fatty liver while being for 30 years on a very low fat vegetarian diet. And which healed in my case by changing to a high and healthy fat diet (~70% of calories), also adding in eggs and fish again. Just the opposite he recommends.

Therefore I strongly believe there isn't a one-size-fits-all diet, he promotes. But I'm also sure many diets are so bad, that a lot could improve by implementing some of his advises.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,406
Location
Austria
Some of the nutrients needed for the liver to work (posted by @Learner1):
liver detox pathways.jpg

Additional to all the nutrients and choline from eggs, supplementing choline was essential for my liver to heal.
 

Carl

Senior Member
Messages
370
Location
United Kingdom
Constipation is often due to lack of acetylcholine due to the liver using up all available choline for detox leaving insufficient for acetylcholine production which is used for things like memory and to stimulate the bowel. Therefore increasing your choline intake might be helpful. Supplementing with Choline and Inositol which should be used together for maximum effect as shown by research on pubmed, can be very helpful.

Milk Thistle extract can be helpful to the liver and might be worth trying. Absorption/bioavailability can be a problem so combining with phosphatidylcholine contained in lecithin can help improve bioavailability and also provide a small amount of choline but do not rely solely on lecithin for choline because the content is quite low and insufficient.

I briefly suffered with symptoms of NAFLD which I quickly resolved by increasing my choline & Inositol intake through supplementation.
 

Tammy

Senior Member
Messages
2,194
Location
New Mexico
Just remain aware that all of Anthony's health-promoting interventions are already found elsewhere.
Curious........how you would come to that conclusion without having read all the material? The Liver Rescue Book in itself is 442 pages. Did you read any of it?
 
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pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,406
Location
Austria
Curious........how you would come to that conclusion without having read all the material?

I've been active member of the https://vitamincfoundation.com forum. It's owner just two month ago converted to Anthony's beliefs, and since tries to prove him. Including him, 2 other forum members with serious health concerns addopted his interventions too. Till now no real beneficial results. He also posted most of his interventions already in different threads. Beside discussing his material there, I of couse sieved through his books in a bookstore too and choose chapters which seemed interresting to me. But didn't find anything worthwhile.

So of course I could have missed something. But even celery juice, for example, was already practiced in traditional chinese medicine. And on his really endless supplement shoplist I didn't see anything new: https://www.medicalmedium.com/preferred/supplements
 
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Tammy

Senior Member
Messages
2,194
Location
New Mexico
@pamojja......................I really am not out to prove anything. Simply sharing what has helped me. It has been a long healing journey for me. Improvements didn't come over night and they weren't linear for sure. I don't know how long the members of the group you mentioned stuck with it. It took a lot of willpower and discipline for me to stick with the program...........but it finally paid off.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,406
Location
Austria
It took a lot of willpower and discipline for me to stick with the program...........but it finally paid off.

Congratulations! Would you want to elaborate?

As already said:

Therefore I strongly believe there isn't a one-size-fits-all diet, he promotes. But I'm also sure many diets are so bad, that a lot could improve by implementing some of his advises.

My liver healed with the opposite of what he advises. There isn't a contradiction in that by itself. Since we are all different. The problem starts once it is promoted as one size fits all. Which is not what you do. But his books do. Other than all the well-known interventions, the books promote ideas which can't be proven by science, and therefore aren't possible to be verified. Which requires blind faith. Things like:

What weight gain really comes down to is how fast or slowly your liver functions.

I've been as skinny one can be with full blown NAFLD.

"Put plainly, it's a chemical imbalance in the brain that occurs when someone experiences trauma. When there isn't enough glucose stored in the brain tissue to feed the Central nervous system, emotional upheaval can create lasting effects. Contrary to popular science belief, though electrolytes do play a critical role in brain health, PTSD does no occur from a lost of electrolytes. A lack of glucose is the real cause.
There’s also an epidemic of hidden PTSD. ... is so rampant that almost everyone has it. ... There are no limitations to what can cause PTSD.
"Medical communities are aware of only one version of EBV, but there are actually over 60 varieties."
"What doctors don’t yet know is that there isn’t merely one type of shingles virus, but 31 varieties."
"Don’t my adrenal glands excrete the same adrenaline in response to any emotion?" That’s what medical communities believe—and they’re mistaken. The truth is your adrenal glands produce 56 different blends in response to different emotions and situations.
As for Borrelia burgdorferi, it's a normal part of our environment that's carried by every human being and animal on this planet --including entirely healthy ones. Truth is, this bacteria poses no health risk . . . and has zero connection to Lyme disease. If someone with Lyme disease tests positive for Borrelia burgdorferi, it's meaningless

What are such blind beliefs good for, other than producing a strong placebo-effect?
 

Tammy

Senior Member
Messages
2,194
Location
New Mexico
Congratulations! Would you want to elaborate?
Thank you. Although not cured by any means...............I went from a level of suffering in which I wanted to end my life .........to improving to an extent that the quality of my life is definitely now worth living. Really............that's the most simplest and best way I can put it. Too tedious to list and go into details of all the myriad of symptoms that are either gone or improved at different levels.
 

poohsilk

Never gives up
Messages
36
Location
San Diego 2019
Some of the nutrients needed for the liver to work (posted by @Learner1):
View attachment 35184
Additional to all the nutrients and choline from eggs, supplementing choline was essential for my liver to heal.
Thank you for this information on a liver. I will revisit it although I have read it before. My problem is it I have become sensitive to everything especially supplements and sulfur Foods. I feel much worse when I have sulfur foods and I am on a low sulfur diet and a low oxalate diet which helps. But this means I have very restricted diet of about 10 things. That is also not good for me. I have been trying to figure out how to resolve this and still need to remove one Crown in my mouth which has mercury behind it which I suspect caused a lot of my crash back in 1985 and may be the cause for sulfur sensitivity.
 
Last edited:

poohsilk

Never gives up
Messages
36
Location
San Diego 2019
Constipation is often due to lack of acetylcholine due to the liver using up all available choline for detox leaving insufficient for acetylcholine production which is used for things like memory and to stimulate the bowel. Therefore increasing your choline intake might be helpful. Supplementing with Choline and Inositol which should be used together for maximum effect as shown by research on pubmed, can be very helpful.

Milk Thistle extract can be helpful to the liver and might be worth trying. Absorption/bioavailability can be a problem so combining with phosphatidylcholine contained in lecithin can help improve bioavailability and also provide a small amount of choline but do not rely solely on lecithin for choline because the content is quite low and insufficient.

I briefly suffered with symptoms of NAFLD which I quickly resolved by increasing my choline & Inositol intake through supplementation.
Thanks Carl. I have been using phosphatidylcholine BodyBio (german) in liquid form as it is suggested to be the best or maybe only real absorbent way. This was recommended by Doctor Andrew can't remember his last name for reducing inflammation in chronic inflammatory diseases before addressing mold illness clean up. I think it has been helping me.
 

poohsilk

Never gives up
Messages
36
Location
San Diego 2019
Chinese Traditional Herbs can target the Liver Qi, and I take many herbs to improve liver function. I go to a well respected, experienced herbalist who prescribes specific herbs for my needs.

Its not a cure but it sure helps and I do not wish to give up this assistance.

I have significantly improved by gastro-intestinal function, by consistently takiog four chinese herbs targetting IBS-d symptoms. In fact: the last 2 months I've experienced tremendous improvement. I think that taking Mito support supplements has improved by Gut Permeability and inflammation there.
Thank you Rufus for your comments about traditional Chinese medicine herbs. I may look into that. In regards to mito support I know there's a supplement company called Mito something. I know some of the typical things which are suggested for mitochondrial support and I know the theory that maybe some of us have damaged mitochondria. I know carnosine might be one of the elements that is helpful and I have not tried that. Do you have a mito protocol or supplement brand name that you like?
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,434
Do you have a mito protocol or supplement brand name that you like?

Its likely I have further to go on Mito support. This summer, I was out of the country, ran out of certain supplements, couldn't get things, symptoms got worse etc. So I had to resume some things. And I don't like pills. They make me choke...so once I'm beyond say 5 supplements, I start being inconsistent and reject them.

Generally we get Swanson...and Life Extension.

I resumed the carnitine and acetyl-cysteine...and for maybe for the last 3 weeks ribose. And not been taking the COQ10 consistently due to shortage so now resumed that. I also added the PGG- not taking that much. I should take this PGG more. The bottle is small, the pills small, and its rather pricey.
 

Carl

Senior Member
Messages
370
Location
United Kingdom
Thank you Rufus for your comments about traditional Chinese medicine herbs. I may look into that. In regards to mito support I know there's a supplement company called Mito something. I know some of the typical things which are suggested for mitochondrial support and I know the theory that maybe some of us have damaged mitochondria. I know carnosine might be one of the elements that is helpful and I have not tried that. Do you have a mito protocol or supplement brand name that you like?
I used to take Carnosine but stopped it some time back. I just couldn't afford to keep buying it. I do not know one way or another whether it had any benefit. So many things have changed that it is difficult to know what did what. Lyme? Carnosine? Change in diet? Lots of other stuff.
From my notes:
Sergei Severin (S.E. Severin) from Russia found in 1953 that Carnosine, which is produced in the human body from histidine and beta-alanine, reduces lactic acid build up in muscles.
My theory is that because of the high histamine levels, there is insufficient histidine to make enough carnosine which adversely affects muscles causing fatigue. That is probably a bit simplified but there is probably some truth to it. The body directs nutrients to the most essential areas ie detox and the immune system not leaving a lot left for other less essential processes.

Cordyceps mushroom is said to improve energy and more importantly lower/normalize cytokine levels. It is also helpful in preventing heart and circulatory disease.
Abstract
Cordyceps (Cordyceps militaris) exhibits many biological activities including antioxidant, inhibition of inflammation, cancer prevention, hypoglycemic, and antiaging properties, etc. However, a majority of studies involving C. militaris have focused only on in vitro and animal models, and there is a lack of direct translation and application of study results to clinical practice (e.g., health benefits). In this study, we investigated the regulatory effects of C. militaris micron powder (3 doses) on the human immune system. The study results showed that administration of C. militaris at various dosages reduced the activity of cytokines such as eotaxin, fibroblast growth factor-2, GRO, and monocyte chemoattractant protein-1. In addition, there was a significant decrease in the activity of various cytokines, including GRO, sCD40L, and tumor necrosis factor-α, and a significant downregulation of interleukin-12(p70), interferon-γ inducible protein 10, and macrophage inflammatory protein-1β activities, indicating that C. militaris at all three dosages downregulated the activity of cytokines, especially inflammatory cytokines and chemokines. Different dosages of C. militaris produced different changes in cytokines.
https://www.jfda-online.com/article/S1021-9498(14)00030-1/fulltext

http://www.realmushrooms.com/cordyceps-supplements-guide/
If you decide to try it, ignore polysaccharides because they are mainly from the the growth medium. It is the Beta Glucans in particular that you need to watch out for. I started with one which claimed 30% polysaccharides of which beta glucans was 10-15%.
Taken from the Time Health website:
30% Polysaccharides with Beta Glucan content between 10% and 15% of total Polysaccharides.
ie only 3 to 4.5% of the total weight. A very misleading way of putting it.
The current one I am taking, about 4 grams at a time ATM, claims 25% Beta glucans.
 

Learner1

Senior Member
Messages
6,305
Location
Pacific Northwest
Since I was tagged above, thought I'd add my comments to this discussion as I have some strong opinions based on a goid deal if experience and research.
I have a book called "Liver Rescue" by Anthony William. I have learned more about the liver from that book than any other source. It's a pretty lengthy book. Tells all about how to heal the liver...........and much much more.
Just remain aware that all of Anthony's health-promoting interventions are already found elsewhere. All the knowledge he promotes, he claims to have been given to him by a spirit. Impossible to prove by science, since it allegdedly isn't developed that far yet. A compendium of known interventions, with a lot of fantasy-literary work woven in.
Even though Wiliam is an enthusiastic writer, his spirit-given belief system is not based on science. Yes, he may hsve landed on a few good pop-health topics, but some of what he promotes, a high carb, high oxalate, low protein and fat diet could be downright dangerous for some readers. And worse for ME/CFS patients who researchers have found to be short of amino acids, cell and mito membrane building lipids, hormones made from cholesterol and nutrients found mainly in animal food sources like B12, carnitine and cettain minerals.
For example, he promotes a low fat mainly vegetarian diet. Interestingly, I developed a fatty liver while being for 30 years on a very low fat vegetarian diet. And which healed in my case by changing to a high and healthy fat diet (~70% of calories), also adding in eggs and fish again. Just the opposite he recommends.

Therefore I strongly believe there isn't a one-size-fits-all diet, he promotes. But I'm also sure many diets are so bad, that a lot could improve by implementing some of his advises
Agreed. It is important to look at what each of us needs individually and get it, and avoid things that give us trouble, like lectins, phytates, saponins, oxalates, and other toxins or antinutrients. Some of this depends in genetics, but also gut and microbiome health, as well as environmental exposures.
There isn't a contradiction in that by itself. Since we are all different. The problem starts once it is promoted as one size fits all. Which is not what you do. But his books do. Other than all the well-known interventions, the books promote ideas which can't be proven by science, and therefore aren't possible to be verified. Which requires blind faith.
Agreed. Blind faith is not a wise way to manage one's health. Knowing what one's body needs and providing it, while avoiding things that are counterproductive is wise, and this will likely differ for each one of us.
I feel much worse when I have sulfur foods and I am on a low sulfur diet and a low oxalate diet which helps. But this means I have very restricted diet of about 10 things. That is also not good for me. I have been trying to figure out how to resolve this and still need to remove one Crown in my mouth which has mercury behind it which I suspect caused a lot of my crash back in 1985 and may be the cause for sulfur sensitivity.
Oxalates swap places with much needed sulfur in the gut via the SAT1 transporter. High and medium oxalate foods, like spinach, beets, celery, almonds, rhubarb, raspberries, sweet potatoes, potatoes, carrots, etc. can wreak havoc on one's body, especially if one is deficient in B6 and citrate. Upping B6 intake and taking calcium, magnesium, or potassium citrate with meals can alleviate these symptoms, especialky when combined with a lower oxalate diet. Many people eho think they have a sulfur problem actually have oxalate and B6 problems.

In regards to mito support I know there's a supplement company called Mito something. I know some of the typical things which are suggested for mitochondrial support and I know the theory that maybe some of us have damaged mitochondria. I know carnosine might be one of the elements that is helpful and I have not tried that. Do you have a mito protocol or supplement brand name that you like?
Are you thinking of Mitoq, a special kind of CoQ10 made to go into the mitochondria better?

I've done a lot to repair my mitochondria, damaged by Cipro and chemotherapy, using NT Factor to repair damaged membranes, riboflavin-5-phosphate to support complex II along with manganese for MN-SOD, reducing peroxynitrites with 5-MTHF, B12, and C, a little MitoQ for complex I, some carnitine, and NMN or NAD+ to add a little more fuel.

I got no effect from PQQ, and don't seem to need much CoQ10, although others need a large amount. Again, you have to do what works for you, there's no one so e firs all protocol.
I resumed the carnitine and acetyl-cysteine...and for maybe for the last 3 weeks ribose. And not been taking the COQ10 consistently due to shortage so now resumed that. I also added the PGG- not taking that much. I should take this PGG more.
I think you mean PQQ? Ive taken it at high doses and had no effect, but have seen goid things in the literature. I also have not been helped by d-ribose or the vaunted NR - nicotinamide riboside. (I think due to NMRK SNPs.) N-acetyl-cysteine is a glutathione precursor - you also need adequate glycine and glutamine - for me, I typically run short of glycine, not n-acetyl-cysteine, so we each have to find what works for us, not sone internet list.

Speaking of lists, Anthony W has a huge number of "favorite supplements." Again, many are good ideas, but are targeted toward certain problems and deficiencies. Proper testing, and knowing your genetics in some cases might be wise - I see he has 5-HTP on that list of his and anyone with the IDO2 SNPs identified by Dr. Phair (a good chunk of folks of European descent) woyld want to stay away from that one, or risk falling into the IDO2 metabilic trap.

As for livers, having each part of ines digrstive system working properly is helpful, and then having support for the various Phase I, II, and III detox pathways is wise, along with ingesting adequate fiber and water.