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How to Correct a magnesium deficiency? Magnesium Cofactors for Absorption?

Messages
30
I suspect I have a severe magnesium deficiency which I think may be causing my CFS along with a list of other symptoms.
The symptoms I experience are :

1)Severe Chronic Fatigue
2)Anxiety/Depression
3)Brain Fog
4)Delirium/ Disassociation/ Disconnection from reality.
5) Muscle Cramps/ Spasms / (Eye spasms being a big indicator of a mag deficiency.)
6)Muscle Pain
7)Tendon Pain/ Tendonitis in every tendon. (Constant tendon breakdown, I can't even lift weights or go to the gym/ strenuous activity anymore without pain)
8)Urticaria/Hives
9)Blurred Vision/ Light Sensitivity
10) Loss of feeling/touch (loss of nerve function)
11) Neuropathy/ Restless leg syndrome
12) Poor Blood Circulation/ cold hands and feet all the time.
13) Reduced Ability to learn / remember
14)Tinnitus
15) Brittle Teeth. (Can chip easily if I'm not careful while eating with a metal utensil)

So I went and tested both serum and rbc levels. The serum test is only 1-3% accurate and I got a 2.2 (normal range 1.5-2.5). The rbc is 40% accurate and I got a 4.3 (normal range 4.2-6.8) although some doctors believe (6.0-7.0) is optimal range for this test. I can't afford the exatest which is the most accurate magnesium test so I'm basically just relying on the rbc test and going by feel of my symptoms day to day.

*My calcium, potassium, sodium , iron and zinc show they are in normal range.

I started taking magnesium pills and for the first month they were working but then they kind've pooped out and stopped working. I'm guessing I depleted an important cofactor of absorption for the magnesium?
I was taking with them a strong multi with b vitamins, d, and selenium and still they aren't being absorbed well. I'm ordering some l-taurine because I think this is a very strong cofactor for them to get into my cells and stay there efficiently.
The reason I posted on this forum is because I want to know if anyone has ever suffered from this horrible deficiency and what have they done to correct it? What was your cocktail of supplements or diet plan like? I'm in desperate need of help. Any type of useful information or help will be greatly appreciated.
 

pattismith

Senior Member
Messages
3,945
Although I agree that eyelids myoclonus is likely caused by magnesium deficiency,
I doubt your other symptoms to be magnesium related.

I have most of your symptoms excepted 8/9/10 and I discovered some weeks ago that I have a Low T3 Syndrome.
 
Messages
30
Although I agree that eyelids myoclonus is likely caused by magnesium deficiency,
I doubt your other symptoms to be magnesium related.

I have most of your symptoms excepted 8/9/10 and I discovered some weeks ago that I have a Low T3 Syndrome.
That's really interesting actually. I know a mag deficiency can mess with the thyroid as well and make it not function properly. What are your magnesium levels like ? I probably need to get my thyroid checked again but I think my levels are fine.
 

pattismith

Senior Member
Messages
3,945
That's really interesting actually. I know a mag deficiency can mess with the thyroid as well and make it not function properly. What are your magnesium levels like ? I probably need to get my thyroid checked again but I think my levels are fine.

My Thyroid panel was fine too, but fT3 was closed to the mininum

The Low T3 Syndrome is detected by measuring Reverse T3 (rT3) which is high, and fT3/rT3 ratio which is low
 

CFS_for_19_years

Hoarder of biscuits
Messages
2,396
Location
USA
I have the condition erythromelalgia which the late Dr. Mansmann also had and he treated with high doses of magnesium. I take a magnesium complex (from magnesium oxide, magnesium citrate, magnesium aspartate) 400mg twice a day and MagTab Sr twice a day, which he discusses in the article. If I stop taking MagTab Sr my calf cramps come back.

Dr. Herbert Mansmann who was a diabetic with congenital magnesium deficiency and severe
peripheral neuropathy shares that he was able to reverse with a year of using oral magnesium preparations at very high doses.

He was the director of the Magnesium Research Laboratory at Jefferson Medical College, Thomas Jefferson University. These are some of his articles:
http://barttersite.org/category/articles-by-dr-mansmann/

More of Dr. Mansmann's work that was posted online:
http://web.archive.org/web/20080204160607/http://www.magnesiumresearchlab.com:80

He recommended taking a variety of magnesium formulations:
http://web.archive.org/web/20071012...rchlab.com:80/Dosing-with-Mg-Suppl-6-3-04.htm
(I rearranged some of the text to make it easier to follow and understand)
We usually recommend only the four numbered (1-4) salts below that are printed in bold.

Start with this first salt (Magnesium Oxide - Blaine MagOx 400), once on 3-4 tablets of Blaine MagOx 400 mg, every 4-6 hours, per day or develops diarrhea, one should then add other salts beginning with Mag-Tab SR and then Maginex.

4B. MAGNESIUM OXIDE is an intermediate acting salt. We have assayed Blaine MagOx 400, (contains 240 mg of elemental Mg per tablet) and content is as stated. It is also free of lead, mercury, cadmium, arsenic and aluminum; and it is free of chemical solvent residue, herbicide, pesticide, and fungicide residue. This product is the most widely used and available Mg product recommended by USA physicians, often even by prescription, although it is OTC. NOTE: this product is covered by Medicaid programs in most USA states.

General Nutrition Center (GNC) Mg oxide products were found by our assay to be accurate as stated on their labels. Other cheaper less know and less studied brands of Mg oxide also are available.

Start With This salt, once on 3-4 tablets of Blaine MagO 400 mg, every 4-6 hours, per day or develops diarrhea, one should then add other salts beginning with Mag-Tab SR and then Maginex.

It is obvious from the above list that Mg oxide (MgO) is the workhorse because it contains the highest concentration of Mg. Actually 60.3% of the MgO salt is elemental Mg, the part that counts. That is its major advantage, but it might be too much for some patients. A disadvantage is that it takes about 2 hours for any to be found in the urine. This is the only sign of absorption of Mg for those with normal sMg levels, which is also the amount of time it takes to see any clinical effectiveness to be seen.

The MgO peak effect is in 4 hours, and gradually decreases in a few hours. Even with very high doses the kidneys will only maintain your sMg levels in the normal range, since Mg is stored in the bones not the serum.. If one's sMg is below normal, the sMg level will ultimately increase to the normal range. Thus between 0 and 2 hours, and between 4 and 8 hours the patient may need a higher dose to prevent symptoms of MgD.

3B. Mag Tab SR is a delayed acting salt. (This Mg salt is made by Niche Pharmaceutical Inc., 800-677-0355.
Mag Tab SR is 84 mg of Mg from Mg L-lactate (MgL) in caplets containing a sustained release wax matrix formulation of this dehydrated compound. This formulation has the theoretical advantage that Mg is absorbed in small increments, 7 mg/hour for 12 hours as the matrix moves through out the bowel. It has been shown that lactate is excreted in the urine after taking MgL, which means that it is mostly absorbed intact leaving little or no Mg in the bowel to bind with 300 times it's weight of water, thus less likely resulting in loose stools.

2B. MAGINEX is an intermediate release enteric-coated Mg salt from Geist Pharmaceuticals 1-888-644-3478.
Maginex is a 61 mg of Mg from Mg-L-Aspartate HCl in an enteric-coated tablet, to bypass the stomach. Its Mg levels peak in 3-4 hours, judged by urinary excretion and measurable, statistically significant, serum levels (10% increases) in 4 hours. Total absorption is 50% more than Mg from Mg Oxide, reported in the medical literature. (Muhlbauer B, Eur J Clin Pharmcol, 1991;437-438). It is important to use the HCl salt, since the neutral acid protects the ability to absorb iron.

The following Mg salt is an excellent RESCUE product, because five to ten tablets often relieves sudden unexpected acute symptoms (like muscle pain/cramps, PMS and burning feet) and can be repeated as soon as one-half hour later 2-4 times without resulting in diarrhea.

1B. MAGONATE is a rapid acting salt. (A Mg Gluconate (MgG) salt, (there are 2 molecules of G in this salt, to one atom of Mg) is made by Fleming and Company Pharmaceutical; our research laboratory assay has found the content to be accurately stated). MgG contains only 5.39% Mg.

MgG is well tolerated, which is very important when taking any Mg product for the first time. Your druggist will usually have to order it. It takes only one day and does not require a prescription. Order 3 bottles of 100 tablets, which is enough for 2-4 weeks, a minimum trial.

Each 500 mg tablet contains 27 mg of Mg*, and 5 tablets equal 135 mg of Mg. This means that 5.8% of the MgG salt is elemental Mg, which is the active component of all of the Mg salts. It is very rapidly absorbed, and the peak effect occurs in less than an hour when taken on an empty stomach, and within an hour from the stomach even when needed after food This Mg salt enters the blood and then the cells through the glucose pathways in the stomach. The salt then dissociates in the cells to free gluconate and functional free ionized Mg. (FDA PB-288 p675 and p537). While other Mg salts, which take 2-4 hours to get their peak effect, MgG’s down side is that it is such a small amount of Mg that one needs at least 5 pills or as much as 10 tablets (270 mg of Mg) every half hour for 2-3 hours. It is wonderful for migraine, as soon as one feels the aura. It usually needs to be used with Mg oxide (MgO), if high doses of Mg are needed.

It has been shown that IV MgSO4 relieves Migraine (Mauskop, Headache. 1996:36;154-160) and Magonate by mouth does the same thing. Many need 10 tablets every half hour for 3-4 times to prevent a migraine attack after the aura or actual headache occurs. Some of the daily dose of this salt is best taken at bedtime, because it results in a rapid sound sleep due to muscular relaxation. Also, I have used it this way for acute onset of Atrial Fibrillation.

More Than One Salt at a Time: In certain situations all three types of these four marked Mg salts: an immediate, an intermediated, and the delayed acting Mg salts, may be necessary to reach one's maximum tolerated dose without peaks and valleys, and that is without symptoms during the low periods, (valleys). They should be taken together.
 
Last edited:

CFS_for_19_years

Hoarder of biscuits
Messages
2,396
Location
USA
More from Dr. Herbert Mansmann:
http://web.archive.org/web/20071012...rchlab.com:80/Dosing-with-Mg-Suppl-6-3-04.htm
MAGNESIUM DOSING

General Principles

1. All adults, even with Bartter’s, Gitelman’s and Distal Renal Tubule Acidosis, should be drinking at least eight 8-ounce glasses of fluid, mostly water, per day.

2. All Mg salts are better tolerated with at least a 100-calorie snack.

3. For its most rapid action, Magonate is best taken on an empty stomach, one hour before or two hours after food intake. Yet it works with food.

4. Because of Magonate’s rapid onset of effect it can be taken with another Mg salt for sudden unexpected acute symptoms, like migraine aura, migraine, muscle cramps, PMS and burning pain. Count the extra Mg as part of the daily total.

5. The total daily dose should always be taken in equally divided doses, 2-6 times a day (12-4 hours apart) and at equally divided times..

6. Always start with the smallest available amount, ½ a tablet, as far apart as possible, initially every 12 hours.

7. Always error by taking more at night, ½ at 10 AM and ½ at 10 PM, then ½ +1, 1+1, 1+1 ½, 2+2, 2+2 ½ etc.

8. Increase dose slowly every 1-2 days, when 2+2, go to 2+1+2 every 8 hours, etc.

9. Learn the amount of elemental Mg in each salt, so that once on 4 pills of Mag-Tab SR, or 10 of Magonate you might try substituting 1-250 mg (or 240 mg) tablet of Mg Oxide. It saves your doctor’s time if you know you elemental Mg amount taken per day.

10. The idea is to slowly increase the dose up to the point of producing soft semi-formed bowel movements without diarrhea-your MTD.

11. When changing Mg salts or to a different brand it is best to gradually make substitutions by alternating sources.

12. A word of caution: the clinical effect all Mg salts is decreased by the simultaneous taking of many drugs. Neurontin is an example, 24% (in the PDR) is not absorbed when taken with Mg, moreover those controlled with a given Neurontin dose find they need more, because of this Mg binding in the blood. This is managed by increasing both the Mg and the Neurontin to remain controlled and symptom free be it due to MgD or due to Neurontin.
 

keenly

Senior Member
Messages
814
Location
UK
CFS patients can not really correct it with supplements.
We leak Magnesium from the cell constantly. Injections can correct this for 4-6 hours.

You have to change your environment so you are not getting constant calcium efflux. Stay away from nnEMF, otherwise everything else is futile.
 
Messages
30
I have the condition erythromelalgia which the late Dr. Mansmann also had and he treated with high doses of magnesium. I take a magnesium complex (from magnesium oxide, magnesium citrate, magnesium aspartate) 400mg twice a day and MagTab Sr twice a day, which he discusses in the article. If I stop taking MagTab Sr my calf cramps come back.

Thank you for the supplement list but regardless of what mag supplement I take which i have tried a lot. They are not getting absorbed into my system efficiently. I might try the slow release mag tho that sounds interesting although the price is expensive for the quantity of mag supplied per bottle.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

CFS_for_19_years

Hoarder of biscuits
Messages
2,396
Location
USA
Thank you for the supplement list but regardless of what mag supplement I take which i have tried a lot. They are not getting absorbed into my system efficiently. I might try the slow release mag tho that sounds interesting although the price is expensive for the quantity of mag supplied per bottle.
MagTab Sr is the only magnesium supplement I've found that will keep my left calf from spasming from an old Achilles tendon injury. I have to take it every day, twice a day, otherwise my calf spasms. If I sleep too long and miss a dose several days in a row so that I'm only taking it once a day, eventually my calf spasms and I have to make sure I don't miss taking it twice. It should be taken with meals. https://magtabsr.com/

It's not how much you take in, it's how much is absorbed.
 

Mary

Moderator Resource
Messages
17,378
Location
Southern California
@Snowx997 - I'm dealing with increasing my magnesium levels so I'm glad you asked this question. I thought I was taking enough magnesium (magnesium glycinate 532 mg a day in divided doses) but apparently not. I've upped it quite a bit and am finally (after months and months of bad insomnia) starting to sleep better.

A quick search shows that B6 is an important cofactor for magnesium, and testing has shown that I have a high need for B6 - I've been taking 100 mg of P-5-P a day which I've just increased to 150 mg. Don't start with that dose - some people don't do well with B6, but you very well may need it.

Also I just read that taurine is important to keep magnesium in the cell and B6 is necessary for taurine production.

B6 can help with sleep at night but it causes insomnia for me when taken at night so I take it with breakfast and lunch and do fine.

http://gotmag.org/how-to-restore-magnesium/
 

Mary

Moderator Resource
Messages
17,378
Location
Southern California
@Snowx997 - I've just been reading that boon is also important for magnesium utilization. A hair analysis just showed that I am deficient in boron, and my calcium/magnesium ratio is skewed badly in favor of calcium, so am temporarily at least stopping calcium as well as adding magnesium, and plan on adding in boron too. I wish we all had knowledgeable nutritionists who could guide us through this wilderness! I get bits and pieces but never the full story ---
 
Messages
30
@Snowx997 - I'm dealing with increasing my magnesium levels so I'm glad you asked this question. I thought I was taking enough magnesium (magnesium glycinate 532 mg a day in divided doses) but apparently not. I've upped it quite a bit and am finally (after months and months of bad insomnia) starting to sleep better.

A quick search shows that B6 is an important cofactor for magnesium, and testing has shown that I have a high need for B6 - I've been taking 100 mg of P-5-P a day which I've just increased to 150 mg. Don't start with that dose - some people don't do well with B6, but you very well may need it.

Also I just read that taurine is important to keep magnesium in the cell and B6 is necessary for taurine production.

B6 can help with sleep at night but it causes insomnia for me when taken at night so I take it with breakfast and lunch and do fine.

http://gotmag.org/how-to-restore-magnesium/
Tried taking b6 and it didn' help with the absorption in my case. Yes I also wish we had expert nutritionalists to get us out of this mess haha
 

GreenMachineX

Senior Member
Messages
362
Is it actually important to take b6 with magnesium, or just by using enough b6 during the day good enough for magnesium taken hours later?
 

Carl

Senior Member
Messages
367
Location
United Kingdom
I take very high doses of Magnesium every day. Around 2 grams/day, sometimes more.

I use Magnesium carbonate which is very versatile because it can be reacted acid/base reaction with many acids such as amino acids, malic acid, citric acid etc to form magnesium salts. It is very inexpensive. When it is added to water it is a cloudy white colour and when an acid is added it turns clear showing it has reacted to form a magnesium salt.

I do also take Boron, I was taking fairly high doses around 12mg/day as Borax but I have not found time to prepare any recently so have been using Boron capsules 3mg/cap. Boron can help joint pain
I do take at least 120mg P-5-P too. I do also take high dose Vit K2 MK-4 (30mg) AND MK-7 (600ug). Vit K is important for proper Calcium usage. I do also take Taurine amino acid for it's benefits to many systems including Kidneys.
 

Mary

Moderator Resource
Messages
17,378
Location
Southern California
Is it actually important to take b6 with magnesium, or just by using enough b6 during the day good enough for magnesium taken hours later?

I don't know for sure, but I would guess that taking B6 during the day would help with magnesium absorption hours later, though some might find it more effective taken together. B6 did boost my energy some. Several years ago Nutreval testing showed I had a severe deficiency in B6. I'd been taking a B complex forever but that wasn't enough; for some reason I have a high need for B6. Now that I'm learning about its role in magnesium absorption, it seems more important than ever.
 
Messages
30
I don't know for sure, but I would guess that taking B6 during the day would help with magnesium absorption hours later, though some might find it more effective taken together. B6 did boost my energy some. Several years ago Nutreval testing showed I had a severe deficiency in B6. I'd been taking a B complex forever but that wasn't enough; for some reason I have a high need for B6. Now that I'm learning about its role in magnesium absorption, it seems more important than ever.
I took a blood test and it showed my b6, b12 and folic acid were overdosed/overly elevated. That scared me so I cut back on the b vitamin complex I had been taking. It was weird though seeing that being I thought the body flushes out the excess b vitamins it doesn't utilize. Can anyone explain this ?
 
Messages
30
I take very high doses of Magnesium every day. Around 2 grams/day, sometimes more.

I use Magnesium carbonate which is very versatile because it can be reacted acid/base reaction with many acids such as amino acids, malic acid, citric acid etc to form magnesium salts. It is very inexpensive. When it is added to water it is a cloudy white colour and when an acid is added it turns clear showing it has reacted to form a magnesium salt.

I do also take Boron, I was taking fairly high doses around 12mg/day as Borax but I have not found time to prepare any recently so have been using Boron capsules 3mg/cap. Boron can help joint pain
I do take at least 120mg P-5-P too. I do also take high dose Vit K2 MK-4 (30mg) AND MK-7 (600ug). Vit K is important for proper Calcium usage. I do also take Taurine amino acid for it's benefits to many systems including Kidneys.
Has your magnesium increased at all with that specific supplement routine you have been following with the taurine ? I just ordered some taurine yesterday and I'm praying it will work. I'm so tired of feeling like complete garbage from this horrible deficiency. I want it to end . Lol
 

CFS_for_19_years

Hoarder of biscuits
Messages
2,396
Location
USA
I took a blood test and it showed my b6, b12 and folic acid were overdosed/overly elevated. That scared me so I cut back on the b vitamin complex I had been taking. It was weird though seeing that being I thought the body flushes out the excess b vitamins it doesn't utilize. Can anyone explain this ?
For proper blood levels of B vitamins you need to stop taking them for two weeks before the blood test.
 
Messages
24
I suspect I have a severe magnesium deficiency which I think may be causing my CFS along with a list of other symptoms.
The symptoms I experience are :

1)Severe Chronic Fatigue
2)Anxiety/Depression
3)Brain Fog
4)Delirium/ Disassociation/ Disconnection from reality.
5) Muscle Cramps/ Spasms / (Eye spasms being a big indicator of a mag deficiency.)
6)Muscle Pain
7)Tendon Pain/ Tendonitis in every tendon. (Constant tendon breakdown, I can't even lift weights or go to the gym/ strenuous activity anymore without pain)
8)Urticaria/Hives
9)Blurred Vision/ Light Sensitivity
10) Loss of feeling/touch (loss of nerve function)
11) Neuropathy/ Restless leg syndrome
12) Poor Blood Circulation/ cold hands and feet all the time.
13) Reduced Ability to learn / remember
14)Tinnitus
15) Brittle Teeth. (Can chip easily if I'm not careful while eating with a metal utensil)

So I went and tested both serum and rbc levels. The serum test is only 1-3% accurate and I got a 2.2 (normal range 1.5-2.5). The rbc is 40% accurate and I got a 4.3 (normal range 4.2-6.8) although some doctors believe (6.0-7.0) is optimal range for this test. I can't afford the exatest which is the most accurate magnesium test so I'm basically just relying on the rbc test and going by feel of my symptoms day to day.

*My calcium, potassium, sodium , iron and zinc show they are in normal range.

I started taking magnesium pills and for the first month they were working but then they kind've pooped out and stopped working. I'm guessing I depleted an important cofactor of absorption for the magnesium?
I was taking with them a strong multi with b vitamins, d, and selenium and still they aren't being absorbed well. I'm ordering some l-taurine because I think this is a very strong cofactor for them to get into my cells and stay there efficiently.
The reason I posted on this forum is because I want to know if anyone has ever suffered from this horrible deficiency and what have they done to correct it? What was your cocktail of supplements or diet plan like? I'm in desperate need of help. Any type of useful information or help will be greatly appreciated.
There is a really good but hard to do diet called GAPS it’s only hard for the first stage, but well worth doing. I know it works.
 

caledonia

Senior Member
You have some symptoms of mag deficiency, but also hypothyroid and/or adrenal fatigue type issues. Also mercury toxicity. Which can be the root cause of the other things.

Potassium and magnesium work together.

With the B vitamins, you may have created a potassium deficiency.

With adrenal fatigue, you may be losing all electrolytes.

When I first started taking B vitamins I needed a lot of potassium. (This is noted in Freddd's protocol info as something that may happen.)

I was taking something like 3000mg of potassium gluconate (the elemental form, not the total amount), 2000mg of magnesium glycinate (again the elemental form), and 4 pinches of sea salt, all dissolved in water and divided into 4 doses throughout the day.

Dosing 4 times a day is important to get the maximum absorption. Your body can only process so much at one time.

After several years, my need for potassium changed and now I do 50mg potass, but still 2000mg mag and 4 pinches of sea salt.

It can be difficult to distinguish which symptoms are from potass deficiency or mag deficiency, as they're very similar.

My doc had me work it out like this - start with potassium, gradually increase over several days until you get to a "sweet spot" where you feel the bes . Note that you might end up overdosing on it and feeling worse. In that case, stop supplementation until you feel better, then go back to the last dose where you felt the best.

Then go through the same process with magnesium. If you take enough mag it will cause diarrhea, if so, just back off the dose a bit. Note that mag oxide doesn't absorb very well. Other forms like mag citrate, mag glycinate, mag taurate, etc. are better. You might have to experiment and see what works best for you and what you tolerate.

Then add in the salt. For that I just increased until I wasn't craving salty foods any more, and you can also go by taste - it should taste pleasant and not too salty.

It's a good idea to keep a symptom journal as to what dose you're taking, and how you're feeling to help sort everything out, as you probably won't remember all the details if you don't write it down.

The blood tests aren't that accurate because you can have a sufficient amount of mag or potass in the blood, but for whatever reason, it's not getting into the cells.

My potassium never showed low, but I did have a suboptimal mag result like yours.