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High dose Vitamin C

Hopeful2021

Senior Member
Messages
262
Hello- today I had another high dose vitC IV.
I've had many of them back in December 2019 and January 2020. But once I discovered NAD IV and how well it worked for me, I rarely would get a high dose vitC.

VitC would be included in my co-nutrients but at a low dose.

What I experienced back then was a solid sense of strength in my normally tired and exhausted muscles. (I'm keto adapted so it's invigorating for me to get this type of IV compared to some who experience hypoglycemia).

Another reason I didn't continue with high dose vitC is that sometimes my hard fought gains to slow or temporarily halt my hyper mobility would come back in spades. I'd be a walking mudslide of a Jenga game. Wobble, hobble, falter, slip and instability would set back in quickly.
However my insulin resistance reset itself to insulin sensitivity in most muscles. And my metabolism also changed for the better.
I'd be very interested to hear from others about their experiences with vitamin C, especially in the IV administration. And I'd like to further know if you were/are insulin resistant or insulin sensitive.

Today I had a great experience. I was able to walk very far and at a tiny bit faster than my normal slow-mo pace. I've had a much more active day than normal.
 

Learner1

Senior Member
Messages
6,305
Location
Pacific Northwest
I've done high dos IVC for several months during And after chemotherapy. I beat the odds for my cancer that had 50/50% chance of survival and I believe the IVC helped me do it. Later I got high doses IVC to try to go after my infections, however even though it is a great intervention and proven effective for these things my immune system was too sick to get the benefit at that time.

These days I use all oral vitamin C. I developed an oxalate problem due to the antibiotics I was on which killed off all the oxalobactor bacteria in my gut, so lowering C intake is important. But after the advice of the oxalate people going to zero to one gram a day of C, It was a huge mistake and I ended up feeling very viral and couldn't kick it till I got my vitamin C and lysine again.

I also found, after researching how to protect my body from a CT scans radiation, that increasing antioxidants was the way to go. Therefore I increase my alpha lipoic acid, my A and E, and experienced a tremendous bump in energy that's been great. So I ended up doubling up on all my antioxidants since then and have been retaining my function. But, I already was on a comprehensive nutrient protocol to begin with.

if you choose to do high dose IVC, it would be useful to check on your lipid peroxides from time to time, as well as your peroxynitrites. Vitamin C in high doses can be a proximate and increase your oxidative stress, And it's also needed for glutathione recycling. And making collagen and doing a whole bunch of other things. So good too do your research as you're doing and figure out what's right for you.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
However my insulin resistance reset itself to insulin sensitivity in most muscles. And my metabolism also changed for the better.
I'd be very interested to hear from others about their experiences with vitamin C, especially in the IV administration. And I'd like to further know if you were/are insulin resistant or insulin sensitive.

Did you also test markers of glucose metabolism, like fasting and postprandial glucose, fasting insulin, C-peptide, HbA1c, Homa-IR?

I've taken in average 24 g/d of oral ascorbic acid powder for 11 years with many unrelated health benefits (PAD, skin, infections..), but sadly only started to test my insulin-resistance long after starting with vitamin C. And been prediabetic throughout.

However, one benefit of high dose vitamin C is the whooping reduction of HbA1c, also seen in my case (study now behind a paywall:

Journal of the New Zealand Medical Association, 23-August-2002, Vol 115 No 1160

Glycohaemoglobin and ascorbic acid

Copplestone et al1 (http://www.nzma.org....al/115-1157/25/) identified misleading glycohaemoglobin (GHb) results due to a haemoglobin variant (Hb D Punjab) and listed a number of other possible causes for such false results (ie, haemolytic anaemia, uraemia, lead poisoning, alcoholism, high-dose salicylates and hereditary persistence of foetal haemoglobin).

We have observed a significant "false" lowering of GHb in animals and humans supplementing ascorbic acid (AA) at multigram levels. Mice receiving ~7.5 mg/d (equivalent to > 10 g/day in a 70 kg human) exhibited no decrease in plasma glucose, but a 23% reduction in GHb.2 In humans, supplementation of AA for several months did not lower fasting plasma glucose.3,4 We studied 139 consecutive consenting non-diabetic patients in an oncology clinic. The patients had been encouraged as part of their treatment to supplement AA. Self-reported daily intake varied from 0 to 20 g/day. The plasma AA levels ranged from 11.4 to 517 µmol/L and correlated well with the reported intake. Regression analysis of their GHb and plasma AA values showed a statistically significant inverse association (eg, each 30 µmol/L increase in plasma AA concentration resulted in a decrease of 0.1 in GHb).

A 1 g oral dose of AA can raise plasma AA to 130 µmol/L within an hour and such doses at intervals of about two hours throughout the day can maintain ~230 µmol AA/L.5 Similar levels could also be achieved by use of sustained-release AA tablets. This AA concentration would induce an approximate 0.7 depression in GHb. The GHb assay used in our study, affinity chromatography, is not affected by the presence of AA.3 Thus, unlike the case with Hb D Punjab, our results were not caused by analytical method artifact. More likely, the decreased GHb associated with AA supplementation appears related to an in vivo inhibition of glycation by the elevated plasma AA levels, and not a decrease in average plasma glucose.3 If this is true, the effect has implications not only for interpretation of GHb but also for human ageing, in which glycation of proteins plays a prominent role in age-related degenerative changes.

A misleading GHb lowering of the magnitude we observed can be clinically significant. Current recommendations for diabetics suggest that GHb be maintained at 7, a level that is associated with acceptable control and decreased risk of complications; when GHb exceeds 8, re-evaluation of treatment is necessary.6 Moreover, relatively small increases in average blood sugar (ie, GHb) can accompany adverse reproductive effects. A difference in mean maternal GHb of 0.8 was found for women giving birth to infants without or with congenital malformations.7 In either of these circumstances, an underestimation of GHb could obscure the need for more aggressive intervention.

Vitamin usage is common in New Zealand and after multivitamins, AA is the most often consumed supplement.8 Moreover, diabetics are encouraged to supplement antioxidants, including AA. Thus, it seems prudent for primary care health providers to inquire regarding the AA intake of patients, especially diabetics, when using GHb for diagnosis or treatment monitoring.

Cheryl A Krone
Senior Research Scientist
John TA Ely
Director
Applied Research Institute
PO Box 1925
Palmerston North

References:
  • Copplestone S, Mackay R, Brennan S. Normal glycated haemoglobin in a patient with poorly controlled diabetes mellitus and haemoglobin D Punjab: implications for assessment of control. NZ Med J 2002;115(1157). URL: http://www.nzma.org....al/115-1157/25/
  • Krone CA, Ely JTA. Vitamin C and glycohemoglobin revisited. Clin Chem 2001;47(1):148.
  • Davie SJ, Gould BJ, Yudkin JS. Effect of vitamin C on glycosylation of proteins. Diabetes 1992;41(2):167–73.
  • Paolisso G, Balbi V, Bolpe C, et al. Metabolic benefits deriving from chronic vitamin C supplementation in aged non-insulin dependent diabetics. J Am Coll Nutr 1995; 14(4):387–392.
  • Lewin S. Vitamin C: Its Molecular Biology and Medical Potential. New York: Academic Press; 1976.
  • Kenealey T, Braatvedt G, Scragg R. Screening for type 2 diabetes in non-pregnant adults in New Zealand: practice recommendations. NZ Med J 2002;115(1152):194–6.
  • Rosenn B, Miodovnik M, Dignan PS, et al. Minor congenital malformation in infants of insulin-dependent diabetic women: association with poor glycemic control. Obstet Gynecol 1990;76:745–9.
  • Allen T, Thomson WM, Emmerton LM, Poulton R. Nutritional supplement use among 26-year-olds. N Z Med J 2000;113(1113):274–7.
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

Senior Member
Messages
16,047
Location
Second star to the right ...
I've done high dos IVC for several months during And after chemotherapy.
Damn. When I was going thru pretty aggressive chemo, my oncologist warned me off Vit C, and pretty much all the other supps I was taking. I've always been pretty vit supp/herbs/amino conscious, ever since reading my mother's copies of Adele Davis' books at about 12, and not taking anything while going thru this unhappy little hell ride was really hard.


It got harder a year or two later when I learned that medical opinion had, once again , shifted (remember when eggs were bad for you? Ditto coffee? Coconut oil?) and now Vit C was regarded as a critical helper in chemotherapy.

Bah. It was my first major lesson in the reductionist thinking that many Drs are limited to and the stubborn reluctance they bring to any concept that goes against their original training. The next few lessons were a lot harder, and a lot more painful, and probably had a hand in landing me in an illness that Drs prefer to believe doesn't exist ...

That'll be harder as post-COVID patients continue to pile up, with symptoms extremely reminiscent of this snarly little hisser of an illness.
These days I use all oral vitamin C.
I went back to my vit supps and herbs literally the day that chemo ended, against Drs recommendation.


I've never done IVC, but for the last several years, I've been averaging 3000 - 5000 mgs of oral C with some co-factors for absorption and better utilization (they say) a day, and so far, so good.

Vit C is absolutely essential for so many processes in the human body, and I believe that the stresses of this illness probably burn thru C pretty fast. I haven't tested for oxalates, in spite of being a little worried about them, because I;m not sure what it would take to drag me back into a Drs office, ANY Drs office, but that isnt it.

And the last few blood draws I had at an independent lab were .... unfortunate.

I was assured about 5 years ago that all my bloodsugar tests and insuln tests were normal, but Drs make mistakes, so who knows.

I have a very unscientific approach to the mysteries of what works and why: my bottom line is that if it makes me feel better, or function better, or just not feel as crappy as usual, I'm all in, so long as Drs Google and Research agree..

ORAL VIT C AND MAGNESIUM
Have you tried boosting your oral C yet? Forgive me if you were clear in your post about this, I'm having a foggier than usual day (but much, much, magnitudes better than The Bad Old Days, so no complaints here) and while I've read it a couple of times and still am ot clear.


You might try buffering it with some magnesium (God, I sound like a broken record, or the father in My Big Fat Greek Wedding who carried around a bottle of Windex, which he firmly believed would cure everything from insomnia to cancer) ..... I use Mag Glycinate, which doesn;t have the unfortunate bowel effects of some other forms. I have yet to find any reliable research that supports the received wisdom that mag threonate, which is very expnsive, crosses the BBB and is more effective for brain issues, and believe me, I've looked, and I never felt any benefit at all from mag orotate.

Magnesium also decreases the odds of diabetes, since it reduces insulin resistance, so there's that. EDIT: MAG also supports the body’s glutathione levels, and glutathione is a real power-player when it comes to health generally.

My brain function is a little vague this morning, but if I think of anything more, I'll come back ....

VIt C and magnesium are mainstays in my slow plod towards better health, and believe me, you'd be deeply, deeply impressed if you'd seen me 4 or 5 years ago ..... or even 2, for that matter ....
 
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Hopeful2021

Senior Member
Messages
262
You might try buffering it with some magnesium (God, I sound like a broken record, or the father in My Big Fat Greek Wedding who carried around a bottle of Windex, which he firmly believed would cure everything from insomnia to cancer) ..... I use Mag Glycinate, which doesn;t have the unfortunate bowel effects of some other forms. I have yet to find any reliable research that supports the received wisdom that mag threonate, which is very expnsive, crosses the BBB and is more effective for brain issues, and believe me, I've looked, and I never felt any benefit at all from mag orotate.
I love the windex reference. LOL
 
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Hopeful2021

Senior Member
Messages
262
Did you also test markers of glucose metabolism, like fasting and postprandial glucose, fasting insulin, C-peptide, HbA1c, Homa-IR?

I've taken in average 24 g/d of oral ascorbic acid powder for 11 years with many unrelated health benefits (PAD, skin, infections..), but sadly only started to test my insulin-resistance long after starting with vitamin C. And been prediabetic throughout.

However, one benefit of high dose vitamin C is the whooping reduction of HbA1c, also seen in my case (study now behind a paywall:
@pamojja
Hello.

yes. I do test those markers.
I am keto-adapted which means my liver has been making ketones for me to use as fuel and as hormones to signal many other processes in the body. It also means I have transporters to take the ketones up into the brain. And that my body when it is respirating Uses a fuel mix of more free fatty acids (fats) than someone who is not "keto-Adapted". (Phinney and Volek)

Many common vitC pills contain too much sugar. And in general, I am unable to take the average vitC even in liposomal form. But I wasn't deficient in nutrients.

This 18 month journey of mine to get my brain and nervous system back from a devastating crash - hopefully my last of this magnitude- taught me that likely what is measured in the blood as normal levels is a ***separate*** issue to what the brain and nervous system need to function properly and heal.

for example, someone with MS could have beautiful skin and nails but have a lack of nutrients needed for the fast and hot flow of electricity maintenance in their nervous system. Or a a Parkinson's patient could have great muscle tone in their legs arms and abs yet still have uncontrollable tremors.

I'm now an advocate that providing the brain and nervous system with an abundance of nutrients and unfortunately most likely IV nutrients is what is needed for some level of healing. There is research to suggest that vitC levels are kept low by oral dosage.... that to tip the scales toward a large increase in Plasma levels, it's IV delivery. And that getting to this set point takes 2-3,000 of vitC so that dosing orally at low doses is almost not relevant. (But okay, the research is new and our intuition and own results matters) For me, IV was and is still the thing that is keeping me up and running (well, not Running.... but you get helge idea).

Also to answer the other part of your questions, my other markers are also good. Although sometimes my CRP is too high as well as other ones. But they are definitely better than they were.
As to insulin, I've been likely insulin resistant since my teen years. But I also had lots of energy. And was an over exerciser/ very active.... think high altitude all day hikes kind of active.
I never knew about the power of ketones. And it is with great regret and sadness that I wish I did. I do not think I would have gotten this disease if I had been in ketosis and keto-adapted. Like with this global scary virus, those that are metabolically strong and esp those in ketosis, it can be overcome.
Since deep diving into corona research, I now understand ME and what it has done to me on a whole new level. I've added more glutathione and N-acetyl cystine as these are just two of the many things needed to decrease a cytokine storm.
Most people who are given the label pre-diabetic if they took a glucose tolerance test of old would actually be re-labeled a diabetic that very hour upon failing their glucose test.
Now, I personally don't think it's safe for anyone to take a glucose test. It's extremely unhealthy to chug that much. The great news is that this form of being "carbohydrate intolerant" is easy to fix. Diabetes and pre-diabetes can be reversed for most ppl in 3 months of following a low carb ketogenic diet. That's published and there are also hundreds of thousands of testimonials worldwide. Keto avocado and bacon memes are now old school on social media. But for metabolic safety, being "keto adapted" is highly advantageous.
I had almost three years of a semi active life for someone with severe bedridden ME. Who knows how long I'll last ... as I said this past 18 months has been a journey. But those almost 3 years were definitely the best years with this disease and in that context, the best years of my life in terms of delightful surprises of wellness.
I was also able to undertake several rounds of hard shell Hyperbaric Oxygen for my brain because I was safely keto adapted and in a strong level of ketosis. The research on its brain benefits is strong and there are about 5 ppl in the ME community who have gotten extreme success-- one woman even counts herself cured. (She did 6 straight months). Three in hard shell at a clinic and the remaining three at home in a soft shell which cannot sustain as much pressure as the big metal or metal and clear ones can.
The cardiovascular benefits of having ketones for the heart is also a no-brainer. But great cardiovascular health is dependent more upon low insulin than being able to run a 5k. Unfortunately, the American Heart Association does not abide by this easy fix. They did however in the past few years say that a VO2MAX test can in its 3 levels of data satisfy early prediction of problems. And this is based on the mix of fuel that one is respirating. Your exhalation. So those that are burning free fatty acids will of course have better test results and that can only come from at least not being a diabetic glucose type of fuel burner at the lower and resting levels of the test.
Here's a link from Dr Volek who touches upon in the clearest way the anti-inflammatory parts of being keto adapted and upon pre-diabetes and exhalation and fuel mix. He did a study that looked at hard core athletes and measured a lot of metabolic markers.
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

Senior Member
Messages
16,047
Location
Second star to the right ...
I love the windex reference. LOL
Lovely little heart-filled movie. Quirky but nor ridiculous, sweet but not sappy ...


And now, off for a little lie down, back shortly to read you post, which looks like it's filled with interesting stuff that's going to take more brain power than I currently have at my disposal ....

EDIT .... for missing apostrophe, which for some reason, really bothered me .... it's an odd day ....
 
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pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
There is research to suggest that vitC levels are kept low by oral dosage.... that to tip the scales toward a large increase in Plasma levels, it's IV delivery. And that getting to this set point takes 2-3,000 of vitC so that dosing orally at low doses is almost not relevant.

I also keep my prediabets in range with low carb, periodically in ketosis.

However, the reason I posted the NewZealand study above is, that the usual research finding plasma ascorbate saturation at about 200 µmol/L, only gave doses of up to 3 gram, and extrapolated plasma levels for higher doses.

But above unique study actually meassured regular intakes of 20 g throughout the day, and found constant plasma level even above 500 µmol/L !

10ff1.jpg


This graphs shows what one accomplishes with an IV upto 1.25g - plasma levels of up to 1000 of µmol/L, but after 3 hours already less then 500 µmol/L - as is already possible orally with 20g taken troughout the day 24/7. And even inferiour after only 10 hrs when already back to 100 µmol/L and below. For how often? 3 hours 1 or 2 times a week?

As an old article discussing the myth about plasma ascorbate saturation also mentions:

Hickey: The NIH emphasize the massive concentrations that can be briefly achieved in the blood using IV. High levels are obviously possible as the vitamin is being poured directly into a vein. In taking this macho IV approach they have forgotten one of the first rules of pharmacology. The effect of a substance depends on the dose, duration and frequency of administration. In other words, how often you take a drug and for how long can be as important as the size of the dose. I know saying it like this is obvious but apparently it needs restating.

Passwater: Each of the parameters is important. It’s like a three-axis graph, with the effective area in the middle and the ineffective areas along the edges.

OK, this is the crux of this discussion, so let’s be as clear as possible for our readers, even if we must be redundant. Is it your contention then that the scientific literature supports that oral vitamin C can be safely consumed at a level that is at least as effective as IVC? As a follow-up, is it your contention that the science suggests that oral vitamin C can be even more effective that the current IVC protocols?

Hickey: Yes. Essentially IVC will increase blood levels to a very high value for a short period, a few hours. However, oral intakes can sustain high blood levels. In other words, oral doses can deliver a far greater total amount of vitamin C to a tumor than can be achieved practically using IV. I can find no data supporting the contention that IVC is a more effective cancer treatment than oral vitamin C. Given some minimum effective concentration, the longer the exposure, the more cancer cells are killed.

Then there is also this old anectode:

http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/2005/pdf/2005-v20n04-p230.pdf

Another was Albert Szent-Gyorgyi. In a 1982 letter,14 Stone tells Szent-Gyorgyi of a friend of his who, was diagnosed with prostate cancer at age 44 and then treated with surgery and radiation. A few years later, the cancer had metastasized to the pelvic bone and the patient was declared terminal and given about a year to live. However, Stone writes:

“Since he began taking 80 grams a day in 1979, his well-being has been excellent. He says he feels great most of the time, has also been able to continue working every day and lives a fairly normal life of the years since November 1978 when orthodox medicine said he would be dead. Visually he looks more like an athlete than a terminal cancer patient...

In the last few weeks he has been able to improve his well-being by increasing his ascorbate intake to 130 to 150 grams per day! He has been taking oral doses every hour of 5 to 10 grams of a mixture of nine parts sodium ascorbate plus one part ascorbic acid dissolved in water. These doses are well tolerated and within “bowel tolerance” and he has had no trouble from diarrhea except just lately when he had to reduce the 150 grams a day to 130 grams.

I believe his case is a classic and a good demonstration that if sufficient ascorbate is given to fully counteract all the incident stresses, then the cancer can be controlled. If given early enough in this disease, then cancer may no longer be a problem. Up to now we just haven’t realized how big these daily controlling doses have to be.”

Stone adds that the man’s doctor “ran some ascorbate determinations on Joe’s blood and came up with the highest blood levels I ever saw. At one point it was 35 mg%! Our so-called “normal” but scorbutic population averages 1 mg% or less, our kidney threshold is 1.4 mg%...

I would like to see a crash ascorbate program started on terminal cancer patients using doses in the ranges found to keep his cancer under control. Since these “terminals” have been abandoned by orthodox medicine, they have nothing to lose but their ill health.”

A plasma level of 35 mg/dl equals 1987 µmol/L.

So there isn't any real ascorbate plasma saturation level, but levels just increase with increasingly higher intake. The constant increase, though possibly as massive as with a 3 g IV (if one is able to take massive oral doses), is however indeed not very proportional with intake. But that's also seems not the case with IVs, however much taken, after 3 hours the astronomical peak is always gone.

Where does it go? - I can't believe either oral or IV is all so fast excreted, especially when looking at actual tissue asorbate concentrations:

Code:
 Table 9.312 Human tissue & fluid ascorbic acid concentrations1

Organ/Tissue     Vitamin C Concentration*
  
Pituitary Gland            40-50  
Adrenal Gland             30-40  
Eye Lens                       25-31  
Liver                              10-16  
Brain                             13-15  
Pancreas                      10-15  
Spleen                          10-15  
Kidneys                          5-15   
Lungs                                 7
Skeletal Muscle             3-4
Testes                                3
Thyroid                              2
Cerebrospinal Fluid         3.8
Plasma                         0.4-1
Saliva                           0.1-9.1

* mg/100 g wet tissue, mg/100 mL fluids

To me it seems it must be soaked up by tissues all very fast, as fast as plasma levels lower again. 20 g orally throughout the day has beem meassured to give 9.1 mg/dl 24/7 plasma ascorbate concentrations (below 1 is normal). Certainly not all excreted - with such multifold higher concentration in tissues - but arriving at theoretically 45 that times in the pituary gland: 409 mg/dl, or 23223 µmol/L (http://www.endmemo.com/medical/unitconvert/Vitamin_C.php)

Of course, as it is rare that higher dose AA intake has ever been meassures - like in the only of its kind study in New Zealand - brain tissue meassurement can't be expected anytime on high dose AA. Which doesn't reall matter, since the health-benefits are obvious anyways.


Due to the high cost of IVs and the already anyway apparent health-benefits of high-dose oral, I would only do it the old way: At least 50 g SA per IV (http://www.doctoryourself.com/vitciv.html, but haven't found a doc adventurous enough yet)
 
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Hopeful2021

Senior Member
Messages
262
I also keep my prediabets in range with low carb, periodically in ketosis.

However, the reason I posted the NewZealand study above is, that the usual research finding plasma ascorbate saturation at about 200 µmol/L, only gave doses of up to 3 gram, and extrapolated plasma levels for higher doses.

But above unique study actually meassured regular intakes of 20 g throughout the day, and found constant plasma level even above 500 µmol/L !

View attachment 38057

This graphs shows what one accomplishes with an IV upto 1.25g - plasma levels of up to 1000 of µmol/L, but after 3 hours already less then 500 µmol/L - as is already possible orally with 20g taken troughout the day 24/7. And even inferiour after only 10 hrs when already back to 100 µmol/L and below. For how often? 3 hours 1 or 2 times a week?

As an old article discussing the myth about plasma ascorbate saturation also mentions:



Then there is also this old anectode:



A plasma level of 35 mg/dl equals 1987 µmol/L.

So there isn't any real ascorbate plasma saturation level, but levels just increase with increasingly higher intake. The constant increase, though possibly as massive as with a 3 g IV (if one is able to take massive oral doses), is however indeed not very proportional with intake. But that's also seems not the case with IVs, however much taken, after 3 hours the astronomical peak is always gone.

Where does it go? - I can't believe either oral or IV is all so fast excreted, especially when looking at actual tissue asorbate concentrations:

Code:
 Table 9.312 Human tissue & fluid ascorbic acid concentrations1

Organ/Tissue     Vitamin C Concentration*
   
Pituitary Gland            40-50   
Adrenal Gland             30-40   
Eye Lens                       25-31   
Liver                              10-16   
Brain                             13-15   
Pancreas                      10-15   
Spleen                          10-15   
Kidneys                          5-15    
Lungs                                 7
Skeletal Muscle             3-4
Testes                                3
Thyroid                              2
Cerebrospinal Fluid         3.8
Plasma                         0.4-1
Saliva                           0.1-9.1

* mg/100 g wet tissue, mg/100 mL fluids

To me it seems it must be soaked up by tissues all very fast, as fast as plasma levels lower again. 20 g orally throughout the day has beem meassured to give 9.1 mg/dl 24/7 plasma ascorbate concentrations (below 1 is normal). Certainly not all excreted - with such multifold higher concentration in tissues - but arriving at theoretically 45 that times in the pituary gland: 409 mg/dl, or 23223 µmol/L (http://www.endmemo.com/medical/unitconvert/Vitamin_C.php)

Of course, as it is rare that higher dose AA intake has ever been meassures - like in the only of its kind study in New Zealand - brain tissue meassurement can't be expected anytime on high dose AA. Which doesn't reall matter, since the health-benefits are obvious anyways.


Due to the high cost of IVs and the already anyway apparent health-benefits of high-dose oral, I would only do it the old way: At least 50 g AA per IV (http://www.doctoryourself.com/vitciv.html, but haven't found a doc adventurous enough yet)

@pamojja

( ooooohhhhhhhh Lordy Lordy.
Wow and *****W O W *****
Pamojja.......!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow .... you know your vitC.

yes, that first study about the plasma.
All the subsequent info you sent along.....esp the tissue .... oh awesome information.

I here sitting with the biggest grin. To have this experience and guidance with someone so versed. I do have some really interesting things I'd appreciate sharing and asking you about later in regards to vitC.

But first just quickly :
20g...... every day...??? Holy moly. How is that possible...???
Can you do this? And if so have you had testing or results or how are you tracking, what are you tracking...basically any and all details will be very interesting and eye opening. I've only heard of a few ppl doing 20g but mainly 10g in the AA circles and the others are incredulous even though the love vitC too.

gosh, I'm so thankful for you putting all these links in. I'm saving it. Hope to get back to you in the coming weeks. But please any time you want to share or provoke hypotheses or ideas or anything, please please tag me. Are there others here with your vitC enthusiasm?

A wonderful day to you P.
 

Hopeful2021

Senior Member
Messages
262
Due to the high cost of IVs and the already anyway apparent health-benefits of high-dose oral, I would only do it the old way: At least 50 g AA per IV (http://www.doctoryourself.com/vitciv.html, but haven't found a doc adventurous enough y

so do I interpret that you can give yourself an IV and you would at 50g but you just need prep instructions you trust @pamojja ...???
I believe a person can order a bag delivered to them. For sure, you can pick up a bag from many doctors once you are in their care.
The correct osmolality is pretty easy once you have the same needles and know the lines to measure by. But yes, I'd be afraid too. Eventually though, it's something I'd like to do myself and learn.
 
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pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
20g...... every day...??? Holy moly. How is that possible...???

Always started low and increased gradually over weeks, months and year with any nutrient. Took me about 1 year to reach the (Linus Pauling) least therapeutic dose of 6 g/d, 18 g after the 2nd, gthe third year (compounted by a year long persisting chronic bronchitis), the later years it fluctuated, expecially with strong seasonal rhinitis always higher (works lika a fast-acting anti-histamine for me). But in average I consumed about 24 g taken throughout the day in at least 3-4 doses mixed in water (and all other powders during the last 11 years.

so do I interpret that you can give yourself an IV and you would at 50g but you just need prep instructions you trust @pamojja ...???

Till now I'm too cautious to do it myself. Though found a GP who started to give me inexpensive Mg-Sulfate IVs against my Mg-deficiency, but she still too cautious too (and honestly doesn't has the time) to prepare 50 g sodium-ascorbate IVs herself. She would do ascorbic acid IV with commercially available ampoules, but being acidic AA (which I heard hurts everyone much), and only 4.5 g, I don't think beside the pain could give much more benefits than oral 24 g/d are already giving.

And if so have you had testing or results or how are you tracking, what are you tracking...basically any and all details will be very interesting and eye opening.

Besically every lab-test I can get, some addtional out of my pocket. It's become a huge spreadsheat with all labs over 11 years. I guess that would be information over-flow right away, better look at my simple version here first: https://www.longecity.org/forum/stacks/stack/111-pad-and-additional-remissions/
 
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