Heavy Metals

[drex13]

Hi all,

I see alot of discussion on the different forums about heavy metals, mostly mercury, and people having flares during mehtylation protocols because they are detoxing mercury or the mercury is moving around from one supplement or the other and creating new symptoms. My question is this : How do you know that this is what is happening, and how do you know you have heavy metal or mercury toxicity issues to begin with ? Have you been tested for heavy metals, and if so how ? Blood, hair ? I know in the past (a long time ago) I was blood tested for heavy metals, but all was o.k.. I do have amalgam fillings. I am just curious, since there seems to be so much discussion on the topic.

 

[August59]

If the mercury is moving around it would be a good time to do a blood test. I'm of the belief that very low dose chelator (not sure which is prefered or harmful - EDTA, DMSA, DMPS) prior to a blood test is the most accurate, but your mobilizing metals to get a test, which I would think just redeposits the metals somewhere else (if you have any).

I have several amalgam fillings and 4 or 5 of them have been in place for 20 years or more. I have had "hair analysis" and the above mentioned test at the Mayo Clinic and neither one found out of range levels of any metal. The blood test was only for mercury, lead, arsenic, cadmium(?) and one other metal. The hair analysis was for 10-15 or more metals and came back within range, which is surprising as almost all hair analysis come back with something elevated.

 

[caledonia]

Doctor's Data Metals and Minerals test - urine test with DMPS (I think it is) prior to testing. It also tells you your minerals status which is a good thing to know. When you chelate you will also be losing minerals, so you need to load up on them while chelating.

 

[*GG*]

Hi all,

I see alot of discussion on the different forums about heavy metals, mostly mercury, and people having flares during mehtylation protocols because they are detoxing mercury or the mercury is moving around from one supplement or the other and creating new symptoms. My question is this : How do you know that this is what is happening, and how do you know you have heavy metal or mercury toxicity issues to begin with ? Have you been tested for heavy metals, and if so how ? Blood, hair ? I know in the past (a long time ago) I was blood tested for heavy metals, but all was o.k.. I do have amalgam fillings. I am just curious, since there seems to be so much discussion on the topic.

I was found to have elevated mercury and lead in my urine sample after doing a DMSA challenge. I did Choleystryamine and Chlorella for at least 3 mos!

GG

 

[August59]

I was found to have elevated mercury and lead in my urine sample after doing a DMSA challenge. I did Choleystryamine and Chlorella for at least 3 mos!

GG

What lab did you get to do your testing? Thanks!

 

[*GG*]

What lab did you get to do your testing? Thanks!

Doctors Data, it was about 2 years ago.

 

[dannybex]

I would avoid chlorella...

I was found to have elevated mercury and lead in my urine sample after doing a DMSA challenge. I did Choleystryamine and Chlorella for at least 3 mos!

GG

Hi GG,

Chlorella is not really considered a safe chelator, it doesn't really grab on tightly enough to mercury, like DMSA or ALA. Andrew Cutler, who got his PhD studying heavy metal problems, is very outspoken on what are the safest and most effective ways to chelate, and what things are dangerous. He puts chlorella in the second category:

http://onibasu.com/archives/am/2658.html

"...Now he is on to chlorella, which is
also very dangerous. I know several people who took it per his protocol and
suffered permanent neurological damage as a result."

Yes, he's quite outspoken, has his fans and his detractors, but he seems to be able to back up what he says, and I found a short trial of his protocol to be helpful.

Here's a list of his posts/comments on a wide variety of chelation/heavy metal issues:

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/ANDY_INDEX.html

And here's a link to his own website:

http://www.noamalgam.com/

I'm going back to it, after trying it about 15 months ago. I was doing a lot better then, but I guess I kind of took it for granted. In the meantime I got a lot worse, mainly because I started too many methylation supps, which released 'stuck' mercury and other toxins into my gut/bloodstream too quickly, causing the worst flare-up I've ever experienced.

I'm glad I did the methylation panel and learned I have the 'partial block'...I was just started on too many of the supps at doses that were too high...that caused the problems. But the silver lining is that it confirmed that I do indeed have high levels of stored mercury, so i'm going to start chelating again...using the Cutler ALA (alpha lipoic acid) protocol, and do it probably for 2-3 months before starting the methylation supps again.

Just my two cents.

d.

 

[August59]

I'm going to be very honest here because I don't know either way. I was in a hurry to find "Doctors Data" website, so I goggled it and I was met with a barrage of negative nasty peole that have filed some pretty massive lawsuits against them. I tend to disregard some negativity, but this is way beyond some!

GG and Cal - If you can give me some more feedback I would appreciate it? Thanks!

Thanks DB!!

 

[dannybex]

I'm going to be very honest here because I don't know either way. I was in a hurry to find "Doctors Data" website, so I goggled it and I was met with a barrage of negative nasty peole that have filed some pretty massive lawsuits against them. I tend to disregard some negativity, but this is way beyond some!

GG and Cal - If you can give me some more feedback I would appreciate it? Thanks!

Thanks DB!!

Sorry -- I'm not GG or Cal, but it's my understanding that there is only one person who tried to sue Doctor's Data, and a lot of people reporting about that lawsuit, and that's the infamous Stephen Barrett, of "Quackwatch" fame -- a man uses "M.D." after his name, but who has had no clinical practice for decades. He dismisses anything that isn't a prescription drug, and has filed countless lawsuits, but has lost almost every single one.

Doctor's Data is a reputable lab -- it's the one Cutler uses, and recommends the Hair Elements Test.

 

[Dreambirdie]

I have used various chelators, and found most of them to be rather hard to handle: zeolite, ALA, chlorella, EDTA, PCA RX are all on my list. I did horribly with both EDTA and the ALA, and find Cutler a bit too dogmatic. What worked best for me and was the gentlest was Jarrow's Heavy Metal Detox--which is fruit pectin and sodium alginate from seaweed. I think everybody's body is so different that you really have to be open to whatever works for YOU in that particular moment.

As far as labs... Trace Elements is the best lab to test hair for both toxic metals and minerals. They do a great job with that kind of test. http://www.traceelements.com/Default.aspx

 

[*GG*]

I'm going to be very honest here because I don't know either way. I was in a hurry to find "Doctors Data" website, so I goggled it and I was met with a barrage of negative nasty peole that have filed some pretty massive lawsuits against them. I tend to disregard some negativity, but this is way beyond some!

GG and Cal - If you can give me some more feedback I would appreciate it? Thanks!

Thanks DB!!

I am not familiar with this controversy, but as with most medicine, particularly in our arena's of need, I would not doubt that some people do not see the value of this treatment. I have done a lot over the last 2 years, but I think the detox helped a lot with de"fogging" my brain!

I trust my Dr very much, if he uses this lab, then I think it is likely still a good lab! Of course this is subject to change, but if you have a Dr who advises this, then it would suggest that they have confidence in the lab.

In regards to Danny's concern with Chlorella, perhaps my "load" of toxins was not so bad as compared to some, therefore the Chlorellas was "alright" for me to use. I did this under the direction of my Dr also, not on my own! So if I would have had a major herxheimer or something of the like, perhaps he would have suggested something else?

GG

 

[lancelot]

I just started Klinghardt mercury detox protocol with cilantro and chlorella(6gX2/day). Should i worry?

 

[leela]

I just started Klinghardt mercury detox protocol with cilantro and chlorella(6gX2/day). Should i worry?

Please don't worry worrying's not good for you . But do consider adding a better binder, as cilantro will mobilize mercury but not bind it. Chlorella can be hard to digest, and is considered a counter-irritant by some, including my ND. If you are tolerating the chlorella okay, then good on ya. Either way, whether you drop it or stick with it, do consider adding the Jarrow formula mentioned by Dreambirdie or Pectasol Chelation Complex (same general thing.) This product will help you bind and eliminate mobilized metals. It will also chelate lead from the tissues quite effectively. For me it was a really effective product while I was doing IV EDTA and TD DMSA for insanely elevated lead levels.

Regarding the questions about tests, I used the Doctor's Data provoked urine test and found that to be highly useful to track my progress. If you use the hair analysis, it seems from what I've read to prove more useful if you use Cutler's counting rules to read between the lines.

 

[lancelot]

i'm doing fine with the jarrow yaeyama chlorella powder 1000g. i used it last year without any mobilizers. You think cilantro is not enough a mobilizer so you want me to add Jarrow Formulas, ToxGuard, Heavy Metal Detox, 90 Veggie Caps? it's not part of the Klinghardt metal detox protocol though.

 

[leela]

i'm doing fine with the jarrow yaeyama chlorella powder 1000g. i used it last year without any mobilizers. You think cilantro is not enough a mobilizer so you want me to add Jarrow Formulas, ToxGuard, Heavy Metal Detox, 90 Veggie Caps? it's not part of the Klinghardt metal detox protocol though.

From what I've read cilantro is supposed to be a great mobilizer of mercury, but not a great binder, and the binding qualities of chlorella are not altogether clear. I'd think about adding one product that is a reliable binder--modified citrus pectin plus alginate has had clinical trials to prove its efficacity, and I can't see it getting in the way of your protocol as long as you take it on an empty stomach, away from minerals etc. and drink lots of water. I mean, I'm not a doctor, and we're all different, but that was a product that worked well for me (pectasol).

 

[lancelot]

From what I've read cilantro is supposed to be a great mobilizer of mercury, but not a great binder, and the binding qualities of chlorella are not altogether clear. I'd think about adding one product that is a reliable binder--modified citrus pectin plus alginate has had clinical trials to prove its efficacity, and I can't see it getting in the way of your protocol as long as you take it on an empty stomach, away from minerals etc. and drink lots of water. I mean, I'm not a doctor, and we're all different, but that was a product that worked well for me (pectasol).

thanks, i will add as long as you promise it doesn't crash me!

 

[leela]

Here is a site that explains the way it works:

http://www.annieappleseedproject.org/modcitpechea.html

Ignore the dosing in the above article though; when taking MCP with alginate it drastically reduces the amount of MPC needed.

The Pectasol from Econugenics is getting really expensive now. I think the Jarrow one is less pricey.

 

[lancelot]

Here is a site that explains the way it works:

http://www.annieappleseedproject.org/modcitpechea.html

Ignore the dosing in the above article though; when taking MCP with alginate it drastically reduces the amount of MPC needed.

The Pectasol from Econugenics is getting really expensive now. I think the Jarrow one is less pricey.

thanks for the link. i'm taking 6g/2X day of chlorella as a binder and cilantro(2drops/2Xday/week increasing 1 drop per week to a maximum of 10 drops/2Xday or whatever is tolerable). each jarrow cap is 750mg of PectaSol Chelation Complex (Modified Alginate and Modified Citrus Pectin). how many jarrow caps should i take at 2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10 drops 2x day of cilantro?

 

[leela]

Well of course I am not qualified to tell you what to take. I can tell you what I take, which is the Pectasol from Econugenics, three caps two times a day, which totals 900mg MCP plus 1.35g alginate per dose. I have taken this same dose whether I am using it alone or with
another chelator. It seemed to help me mop when I was using DMSA, ALA, or EDTA.

 

[lancelot]

Hmmmm....i guess any amount would be good because my original metal detox protocol didn't even have the pectasol. So, i'll start low maybe 1cap/2x/day and take more as my cilantro dosage increases or if i'm feeling more detox. so about 1.5g to 4.5g/day of the jarrow pectasol.