ft3 conversion bad, but can't take T3

judyinthesky

Senior Member
Messages
208
Likes
275
Hello!

Is there anyone with this issue?
My ft3 is always very low and personally I am really convinced that that is not ideal for my body (not to speak of the fact that all my neurological issues started after a thyroidectomy).
However, I have tried T3 in all forms and consultet all the online theories about this. It makes me more wired. I am not sure this is related to different aspects like cortisol?

So I have tried natural dessicated thyroid, extended release (very! hard to get prescribed though) T3 and compounded versions. I have no thyroid and my ft3 value is always at least 40% after the ft4.

(It would not make sense to post my actual values, because due to pancreatic insufficiency they fluctuate like crazy and are very very different all the time). But what is consistent is that the ft3 is lower than normal (like 10-25%), while the ft4 is 50-80/%.

I feel like this is a bit of a catch 22... but also feel I have to go for the lesser evil.
This conversion issue to me is also a sign that some process is wrong in the body.

I supplement the classic thyroid problem nutritional values (which are also related to my pancreas) and the only thing that does help a tiny bit with this is taking high dose B12.

Any other ideas?
I also know that some people with CFS can take T3 or NTD... does it not make you more wired?
 

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
3,709
Likes
6,577
Location
Alberta
I also know that some people with CFS can take T3 or NTD... does it not make you more wired?
I tried T4 (25 mcg) and NDT, and didn't notice any effects. I tried T4 once at a significantly higher level (maybe 100 mcg?) and it did make me feel a bit jittery. Didn't do anything for my ME though. :grumpy:

T2 was wonderful though. :) It gave me temporary remission the first few times, and after that I needed a 100 mcg dose every 21 days or else I'd start feeling worse. That issue went away along with my physically-induced PEM, so there seems to be a link between the two.

Since you don't have a thyroid gland to produce T2, and have problems with T3 levels (the other source of T2), you might consider trying some supplemental T2. The NDT I tried must not have had enough T2 to trigger an effect. T2 does seem important, and it's wrong to simply assume that your T3->T2 conversion process is working properly. Endocrinologist ignorance about T2 might be a problem too.
 

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
3,709
Likes
6,577
Location
Alberta
@judyinthesky Amazon still has a T2 product listed, but it's unavailable. I think T2 as a fat burner was fashionable at one time, and now is mostly ignored, so it's hard to find. This site seems to have a T2 product: https://biocornutrition.com/products/thyro-t2-thyroid-hormone You'd have to figure out if it's still available and can legally be shipped to Australia, or if there are any other sources.

I don't know if it will help you, or if it might have some negative effects for you, but at least you don't have to worry about its usual negative side-effect: shutting down the thyroid gland's normal production. ;)

Maybe someday the medical system will accept that T2 does play an important role in health and that measuring it is worthwhile.
 

judyinthesky

Senior Member
Messages
208
Likes
275
I'm bit worried as wiredness is my issue... and you didn't notice anything on NDT (which I certainly do big time).
Hm! It's a very interesting approach though.
 

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
3,709
Likes
6,577
Location
Alberta
I don't remember what dosage I tried for NDT, but I assume it was the equivalent of 25 mcg Synthroid. The thyroid glad produces some T2, but I think most of our production is from converting T3. Thus little bits of pig thyroid gland probably only had traces of T2. However, 150 mcg of iodine was enough to trigger remission the first few times, and I don't know how much of that would have been converted to T2 by my gland. Since I didn't respond to T4 or T3, the conversion of those to T2 must not have been much. Maybe I have a defect in that pathway.

I think T2's action involves transcription of RNA, but I'm not sure. T2 is badly under-researched.
 

judyinthesky

Senior Member
Messages
208
Likes
275
Yes I am pretty sure that there are some badly under-researched areas, but the issue I have is not that I feel nothing on T3, but I respond too much, while still showing low ft3. There is a few people who claim this has something to do with the adrenals, but I am not sure how scientifically substantial that is.
 

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
3,709
Likes
6,577
Location
Alberta
I was thinking about this last night: since you don't have a thyroid gland to scavenge iodine-containing molecules, maybe you have too much T2, which does boost metabolic rate more than T3 does. I don't know how much T2 gets made from T3 or how quickly it gets used or scavenged, but it does sound plausible. I'll let you research that, or ask your endocrinologist about it. Of course, it may not have been covered in medical school, and some doctors don't bother to learn beyond that, so google away.
 

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
15,566
Likes
46,023
(It would not make sense to post my actual values, because due to pancreatic insufficiency they fluctuate like crazy and are very very different all the time). But what is consistent is that the ft3 is lower than normal (like 10-25%), while the ft4 is 50-80/%.
Do you know if you also have pituitary insufficiency? Are your ACTH and Cortisol levels normal? I am still in the process of learning about all of this re: my own situation (and I have my thyroid so my issue is definitely different). I was curious if your levels are normal of the other pituitary hormones?
 

judyinthesky

Senior Member
Messages
208
Likes
275
My cortisol was only measured in serum but then it was normal range, yes. I want to get another test though. I am not sure I already measured ACTH.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,276
Likes
3,267
Location
Austria
I was curious if your levels are normal of the other pituitary hormones?
Have low fT3 too (in avg. just below lowest end of range), but high fT4 (at the upper end of normal). Serum cortisol has been high (twice above normal), also 24hrs urine collection cortisol test showed 2 out of 4 above normal. ACTH too with its last test last year shoot up above normal (before in the middle of range, once below normal).

Once did a trial with T3 I've got in India. Didn't felt anything, nor did it budge fT3 at all.

Me too. Where you've got the NDT here?
 

judyinthesky

Senior Member
Messages
208
Likes
275
@pamojja Good question re the NDT. To be honest, I lived abroad for 3 years, and I did my NDT trials. When I trialled T3 synthetic, I got it via a person at the Schilddruesenpraxis Josefstadt. But I had to say that I already did this. And I got one time a compounded version via a pharmacy in Germany. I've done lots of trials.

I do feel T3 very strongly myself. I have yet to test my cortisol in other things than in serum, in serum it feels normal.