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Eradicating HMRV (or whatever they name it next)

xrayspex

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thanks joey (mojo....always makes me think of that Doors song)

I went to Cheney for his eval in 08 and was under his care a year and he did rec artesunate by end of that time, I tried it and have some of the hepasunate and wormwood around the house that very occasionally i take a mini dose where i feel worse a day later for a day or 2 and then better for a little while. but I have never given concerted effort because do not want to feel worse all the time for a long period of time. I like Dr C but didnt stay with him, until more is known on stem cells or other tx want to save $
 

Daffodil

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im not sure now if low dose valtrex is OK cuz someone just posted an article stating that acyclovir can create resistance in HIV. i took high dose valtrex and valcyte for 3 years!!!! ugh

tania....that theory about the XMRV already being there is certainly intriguing, but my gut tells me that isn't the case. no one in my family has anything like this....no cancer at all either. unless it was a contaminated vaccine, i just dont see how i could have gotten it other than the day i got "mono"
 

George

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im not sure now if low dose valtrex is OK cuz someone just posted an article stating that acyclovir can create resistance in HIV. i took high dose valtrex and valcyte for 3 years!!!! ugh

tania....that theory about the XMRV already being there is certainly intriguing, but my gut tells me that isn't the case. no one in my family has anything like this....no cancer at all either. unless it was a contaminated vaccine, i just dont see how i could have gotten it other than the day i got "mono"
What about sex??
 

mojoey

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Hey OS,

You're absolutely right, but I think we do understanding enough about the retrovirus lifecycle to at least have this discussion. Thanks for the article, great stuff. It just reinforces the fact that there are so many ways to block replication, but if we're talking about eradication, we need to account for the adaptive tendencies of pathogens. If we block the receptor site for one protein, the retrovirus may just use another one or eventually evolve another one. Block the path of the retrovirus out of the cell (per your article) and we'll still have a bunch of unintegrated viral DNA and virions in the cytoplasm that may cause damage to the cells. If you do all of that and modulate the immune system, and you deal with the proviral DNA: no more unintegrated DNA, more more infectious integrated DNA (left with only junk DNA), and no more virions.
 

leela

Slow But Hopeful
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xrayspex,

Since cheney is using stem cells primarily to modulate the immune system, this would improve the things you mentioned (in theory) by modulating the immune system. I think he agrees that anti-XMRV strategy both before and after stem cells are important, but he's using artesunate mainly for this, for better or worse. I think once he finds a better alternative, we'll hear about it.
The bit I don't get is when using stem cells from another person, isn't it like getting a transplant? Don't you have to take immunosuppressive drugs so that the body
doesn't reject the foreign cells? That's what appealed to me about the bone marrow doc, since he takes it from the patient, but viral reactivation seems too risky now...Not to mention Cheney (bless him) hasn't exactly had roaring success with stem cell patients so far.
 

mojoey

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No you don't need immunosuppression for umbilical cord stem cells. This is probably because the cells have not yet developed the features that can be recognized and attacked by the recipient's immune system.
 

leela

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No you don't need immunosuppression for umbilical cord stem cells. This is probably because the cells have not yet developed the features that can be recognized and attacked by the recipient's immune system.
AAh! This makes a lot more sense now. I still like the idea, though, of using my own bone marrow stem cells, but I know things like lead hide out there, and possibly herpes (though until now we supposed they hid out only in the nerves. Maybe there's some other agent in there that reactivates the herpes somehow upon introduction to the blood stream?)
If the body has been trying to stow stuff away out of the bloodstream in the marrow (as it does with adipose tissue) a transplant could wreak havoc. Perhaps, as you said, the umbilical cells are kind of a clean slate, though. It still raises the question of reactivation in general with any kind of stem cell transplant, and with HGRV in the mix, it will be interesting to see what arises in the field.
 

Overstressed

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Hey mojoey,

My remark about basic biology was a remark to all the nitwits in white, i.e. the doctors slash researchers slash ... I think we all made this experience during our illness, it's not biological. The ones making these statements even don't understand basic biology.

Now, your discussion on eradication is great, more please! :)

If you have time, you should google on abzymes and Prof. Paul Sudhir, or the lipid rafts theory, very interesting, or anti-sensing. But, if you also can handle some bad news, I recently read a research report about Swedish researchers that detected unmutaded HIV in people infected for some years I thought. That's very unnusual, and perhaps means there's a virus container where the virus is not attacked by the immune system at all. And that's bad news...

OS.
 

Overstressed

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Yes, I was told to practise safe sex. My saliva was also contaminated but after a few GcMaf injections I am clean saliva wise.
Hi Cansado, how have you been tested to be sure about your saliva ? Where are you getting your GcMaf treatment ? You can PM me, if you want.

Thanxs,
OS.
 

mojoey

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Another study trying to eradicate latent HIV-infected cells by hypermutation:

http://www.aidsmeds.com/articles/hiv_mix_dna_1667_18978.shtml

Stimulation of viral integration by the INS and INrs peptides, combined with the prevention of virion production by the protease inhibitor, not only resulted in blocking of HIV-1 infection but also in extermination of the infected cells by invoking apoptosis,” the authors concluded.
The peptides were derived from integrase protein. Retroviral integrase (IN) is an enzyme produced by a retrovirus (such as HIV) that enables its genetic material to be integrated into the DNA of the infected cell. The protease inhibitor disabled the virion production mechanism.

By force-feeding the infected cells with integrase, the researchers caused the virus to integrate its retroviral DNA into multiple locations in the host genome, "triggering the cell’s chemical panic button and causing it to kill itself, a process called apoptosis."

Another way to look at it: if you keep feeding a piggy and cause it to expand (integrase), yet you keep it in a form-fitting box with stagnant walls (protease inhibitor), piggy has to explode! For every action there is a reaction. I'm half-kidding of course.
 

leela

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Piggy is hilarious!
On the other hand, this sounds promising; however how would that work in vivo I wonder?
How would the appropriate substances be delivered to the hidden little piggy tissue reservoirs?
 

mojoey

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Hey Leela,

Piggy was hilarious when trying to expand. Piggy now dead.

Since the peptides are integrase-derived, I think it would be a matter of reaching critical mass rather than delivery to reservoirs, because latently-infected cells and actively-infected cells use integrase all the same.