Equilibrant - what are your experiences?

[elvira]

I know that there are other threads about this but they’re so long so wanted to ask again.

How have you titrated the dosage? And how did you feel while starting? Worse? Did it help in the end once coming up to a high dose?

I’m only on my 4th day taking 1/4 of a tablet. Feeling more fatigued and my temperature is higher than usual (37,9 C instead of 37,5. My body temperature since getting ME is always slightly elevated, Before I was always under 37. Maybe bc of the chronic infections).

Can this already be a reaction to the Equilibrant, with such a small amount?

Was planning to increase with 1/4 pill every 2 weeks.

I’d appreciate any input! Thanks!

 

[Shanti1]

I am taking Oxymatrine from White Tiger. Since I react to so many substances, I decided it was best for me to try the star ingredient in Equilibrant as a stand-alone. I had a fever for about 3 weeks after starting it and I worked my way up from 1/day to 1 3x/day. Despite the fever, I felt that it was helping me. I take it along with valacyclovir 1g 3x/day and believe that it potentiated the antiviral activity as it seemed to give a bump to the improvement. I may increase the dose at some point, but am experimenting with some other things at the moment.

 

[hapl808]

Sounds somewhat similar to my reaction to artemisinin - spiked fever for a couple days, etc. I haven't tried Equilibriant or Oxymatrine but they have interested me as I've gotten some small benefits from things like zithro, doxy, artemisinin, allicin, etc.

 

[HealingFalcon]

I am taking it for a week now and am at 3 per day. Higher temperatur than usual and some sweating and shivering episodes so far.
(In combination with inosine)

 

[Mary]

I tried equilibrant several years ago for about 2 months and had no reaction, good or bad, so finally gave up on it. Dr. Chia did recommend I then try inosine, which made me feel a little better for a little while - a little more energy - but then that faded away so I stopped it. Sorry I can't be of more help here!

 

[godlovesatrier]

If you're getting a raised body temp at that dose it probably bodes well for the recommended dose, I forget what that is - 2 tablets per day? This treatment is meant to induce a fever that lasts a few days I believe with worsening of all symptoms prior to that.

So it probably bodes well I'd keep going. It just made me high but lots of things make me hyperactive, it's almost like my body does the opposite of what it is meant to do, but I only took oxymatrine. But the same thing happens with valtrex as well.

Good luck!

From Hip's cfs roadmap:

Coxsackievirus B and echovirus treatments. If your tests indicate you have an active infection with coxsackievirus B3 or B4, Dr John Chia finds about 30% of ME/CFS patients make major improvements with an immunomodulator called oxymatrine.1 2 However oxymatrine does not work for echovirus.1

Dr Chia suggests patients with autoimmune tendencies should not take oxymatrine, as there is a risk it may trigger rheumatoid arthritis — see this thread post. Oxymatrine is best avoided in young children and during pregnancy.1

Oxymatrine supplements can be bought online without prescription. Dr Chia has formulated his own brand of oxymatrine called Equilibrant, but you can also buy White Tiger oxymatrine, and Alternative Medicine Solutions oxymatrine, which Chia finds work with similar efficacy. Oxymatrine treatment begins by taking half an Equilibrant capsule for the first week or two, then slowly increasing up to 2 or 3 capsule twice daily (a total of 4 to 6 tablets daily). See this video interview with Dr Chia at 4:24. No escalation of dose should be made if there is a significant increase in symptoms (wait until the symptoms settle).1

The exact dose of oxymatrine in Equilibrant is not known, as this is a proprietary formulation. However, on the Alternative Medicine Solutions website they suggest an oxymatrine dose of 400 to 600 mg daily.1 Oxymatrine may best be taken in divided doses (eg morning and night).

Responders to oxymatrine should see signs of improvement by 4 to 6 weeks, but a few may take more than 3 months.1 Once the full benefits of oxymatrine have manifested, Dr Chia says men can stop taking it after 3 to 6 months (though here he says to take it for 12 months). Women however usually have to continue taking oxymatrine, otherwise they relapse.1 Dr Chia says inosine can be taken with oxymatrine in order to augment the effects.1 When taken with inosine, the oxymatrine dose can be reduced to 3 or 4 tablets a day. Dr Chia sometimes adds rifampin (also called rifampicin) 300 mg twice daily for 7 days to boost the immunomodulatory action of oxymatrine.1 2

 

[elvira]

I am taking it for a week now and am at 3 per day. Higher temperatur than usual and some sweating and shivering episodes so far.
(In combination with inosine)

Did you start directly at 3 pills? I have inosine at home but i’m waiting to see how things evolve before adding it

 

[elvira]

If you're getting a raised body temp at that dose it probably bodes well for the recommended dose, I forget what that is - 2 tablets per day? This treatment is meant to induce a fever that lasts a few days I believe with worsening of all symptoms prior to that.

So it probably bodes well I'd keep going. It just made me high but lots of things make me hyperactive, it's almost like my body does the opposite of what it is meant to do, but I only took oxymatrine. But the same thing happens with valtrex as well.

Good luck!

From Hip's cfs roadmap:

Thank you for the info! I really hope it is a good sign. Blood tests show that my immune system is quite supressed/fatigued (a lot of too low values) so in theory this kind of treatment should help I think. I want to add inosine later to see if it can raise my low NK cells...

 

[HealingFalcon]

Did you start directly at 3 pills? I have inosine at home but i’m waiting to see how things evolve before adding it

No. I started with half a tablet but increased quite rapidly as I did not notice a huge decline if anything in the beginning...

 

[kalles]

Thank you for the info! I really hope it is a good sign. Blood tests show that my immune system is quite supressed/fatigued (a lot of too low values) so in theory this kind of treatment should help I think. I want to add inosine later to see if it can raise my low NK cells...

Hey Elvira how you doing on Oxymatrine?

 

[elvira]

Hey Elvira how you doing on Oxymatrine?

Hi! Thanks for asking! Unfortunetely I quit after only one week. I wasn’t able to give it an honest chance since I’m severe and got worse, which I can’t really afford. Maybe i’ll try it again if I feel stronger, I’m really interested in seeing what it can do.

 

[mrzombie]

I took White Tiger Oxymatrine for 2 months. Started with 1 tablet and worked up to 4 tablets/day.
Overall impression is it made me significantly worse. I stopped it last week.
Note that I never tested for any viruses, I just decided to take it because “why not?”.
Also, I took it in combination with Inosine Pranobex.
After few days since I started it, it came into my mind that the way I feel and the side effects remind me of some other drug which I could not tolerate previously. That drug was Finasteride and I could not handle it for more than a month.
Side effects were exactly the same as what finasteride gave me: low libido, bad fatigue, stronger brain fog, memory issues, needed a lot of sleep, almost every day I would wake up tired and not refreshed at all.
I checked online and found that Sophora flavescens is 5a-alpha reductase inhibitor, so of course…
I am not really sure what component of Sophora is responsible for that effect, was it oxymatrine or something else, maybe the tablets are just contaminated with other components of Sophora. But it is what it is.

 

[ChrisD]

My experience so far with Oxymatrine:

Viral infection 2015 (bornholm symptoms)
Later tested positive Coxsackie
Also have Lyme, Bartonella, Mycoplasma
M.e. Since 2017, and Long Co vid since last year too

6 weeks or so ago, started 75mg oxymatrine daily and built up to 200mg
Felt a shift within a few days to feeling a bit better
200mg felt to be straining my adrenal so dropped back to 100mg

Then UK heatwave came and despite staying in shade and very h ydrated, I was getting so easily dehydrated and put this down to Oxy so came off it.
Felt worse so when the heatwave ended t itrated back on and again felt that small positive shift.

Have been on 100-200mg a day now for a month and there is a clear immune shift to feeling slightly better and sleeping more but not a breakthrough yet.

Also experimenting with licorice root for adrena ls. And Inosine and Taxifolin to enhance antiviral mechan ism.

Inosine caused joint pain as also doing niacin protocol along side which helps but possibly together raises uric acid too much.

Yet to start Taxifolin.

I'm not sure if I'm feeling worse from the longer sleeps which many with m.e. will know can make you feel worse

 

[Canuck101]

Hi! Thanks for asking! Unfortunetely I quit after only one week. I wasn’t able to give it an honest chance since I’m severe and got worse, which I can’t really afford. Maybe i’ll try it again if I feel stronger, I’m really interested in seeing what it can do.

Hey Elvira,

How are you doing now ? Are you taking any treatments in particular that are helping you ?

I recently took equilibrant and it made me crash severely after a couple of weeks.

Thanks