Dutch article about people homebound with CFS

Dr. Yes

Shame on You
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Whoops.. I suppose he does. I blame hypoperfusion, and other factors.

Thanks Tom. I thought you were dead. Glad to see otherwise.
 

gracenote

All shall be well . . .
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You must not have heard about Miracle Cure X that brought me back - I'm selling it now for only $59/week - just PM on your credit card details. :Retro wink:
tomk
MIRACLE CURE X
Order NOW while supplies last!
Send Lots of Money Before the Studies Come Back Negative.

 
K

_Kim_

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No problem.
:D
You must not have heard about Miracle Cure X that brought me back - I'm selling it now for only $59/week - just PM on your credit card details. :Retro wink:
Trappist Tom!

At the Church of False Illness Beliefs
We want to promote your Miracle Cure X
Consider our pastoral partnership
Here is a link to our
new online store
 

Dr. Yes

Shame on You
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Thanks for the info, Toos.. I ran it through Google Translate (as God apparently has caller ID and is ignoring my calls), and the results were... rather odd-looking, though I got the gist. Thank you Maarten for that translation. It would seem that van der Meer was, in this interview at least, not as 'self-incriminating' as I had remembered; though there is that Reeves-esque suggestion of serious doubt prior to a study that is disturbing. Perhaps I read about the TV interview you mentioned. It certainly suggested to me powerful public evidence of researcher bias. If anyone unearths a transcript/excerpt, please post about it.


(3) "We have all sufficient strength to support the misfortunes of others" (Rochefoucauld)
Douglas Adams dreamed up the concept of a "Somebody Else's Problem Field", a device that renders objects essentially invisible by triggering the all-too-easy-to-trigger phenomenon of apathy in the minds of observers. I have often thought that ME/CFS powerfully triggers an interesting psychopathology in otherwise healthy individuals, especially doctors, that could be called Somebody Else's Problem Syndrome. The prognosis is grim, unless someone close to you develops ME/CFS, or (hypothetically) you worry about contracting ME/CFS yourself. The most common symptom is referral of ME/CFS patients to psychiatrists, who unfortunately tend to have other Problems.


The normal answer in Holland is: "We have them seen by an objective medical doctor, not their own GP or specialist, and they decide". That seems fair enough, in a way, until you realize that:

(a) These "objective medical doctors" are usually from the medical dregs i.e. the worst doctors who are unable to find better employment
(b) These "objective medical doctors" are forced to declare a pre-determined percentage of people who say they are too ill to work as fit to work (pre-determined politically or bureaucratically)
(c) There is no realistic appeal against their decisions (court are overworked anyway; judges are not medical people; going to court requires money and health)
(d) These "objective medical doctors" are these days in Holland employed by private firms and private insurance companies whose interests they serve (and their interest is to pay out as little to ill people as possible)
(e) Most things related to medicine in Holland over the past 10 years have been massively turned over from the state to the health market, on the basis of the argument that "folks are then free to choose the best from genuinely competing firms" (as if selling cars and helping people medically are on a moral and economical par)
(f) There are now in Holland, and apparently also in England, and quite possibly elsewhere, lots of market forces in the form of commercial healthcare-firms who are paid from the taxes to do the bidding of the state.
Strange.. you could just as well substitute "United States" for "Holland" and the above would still be accurate.

It saves a lot of money not to help several millions of ill people
Oh no! A conspiracy theory! "Patient clearly has paranoid tendencies."
 
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Maarten wrote: "Ca 1980 - when I studied, and Angela Kennedy may be glad to hear it - one could get academic degrees in sociology, political science or philosophy by course points given for squatting and for political activism."

Maarten, I really have to ask, what on EARTH makes you think I would be glad of such absurdities? That's such a strange and insulting thing for you to say.

Please explain yourself.
 

Dolphin

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Hello Angela,



It's called "irony" in lit.crit. classes. I have now for 20 minutes been busy with this crazy vBulletin software to find the post in which you and Gerwyn and I discussed (let's say) philosophy of science, but I have to log out from this software to be able to see my own posts, and the search stuff of this vBulletin software also produces zilch, and I am also dysfunctionally so "fatigued" I couldn't even yodel for money.
Is this the thread: http://www.forums.aboutmecfs.org/showthread.php?3837-PLos-Article-Most-published-research-wrong-! ? (I hope to read it eventually).
 

Dolphin

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tomk
MIRACLE CURE X
Order NOW while supplies last!
Send Lots of Money Before the Studies Come Back Negative.

:D
Looks like you've got yourself a job in our advertising department, gracenote. Pay is a year's supply of Miracle Cure X.

I've decided to frachise also so if others want to sell the product, just get in touch. :Retro wink:
 

Dolphin

Senior Member
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Trappist Tom!

At the Church of False Illness Beliefs
We want to promote your Miracle Cure X
Consider our pastoral partnership
Here is a link to our
new online store
I think we can do a deal, _Kim_

The poster makes a good point, Beware of fraudulent cures!
That could be a problem. At least with my recovery, there are no doubts with this product.

I see Dr. Yes has been working on the instruction leaflet how you have to open your mouth before you swallow tablets such as Miracle Cure X:

http://www.forums.aboutmecfs.org/showthread.php?3783-Paging-Dr.-Yes&p=58714&viewfull=1#post58714
 

gracenote

All shall be well . . .
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:D
Looks like you've got yourself a job in our advertising department, gracenote. Pay is a year's supply of Miracle Cure X.

I've decided to frachise also so if others want to sell the product, just get in touch. :Retro wink:
Thanks tomk. So exciting. I have a job!

It was fortuitous that you named your product MIRACLE CURE X. We can tie the X in with XMRV and XAND and the rest is hysterical (I mean history)!
 
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Yes Tom. And I've already said on that thread that I'm not a post-modernist (or 'po-mo'). I should say I was only responding on that thread to what I saw were problematic assumptions about my academic discipline (sociology) and my own approach, and trying to clarify both. I couldn't carry on as it took up a lot of time.

Frankly Maarten's comment about me being glad to hear about what sounded like pretty disgraceful academic practices in the 1980's I felt was insulting, not to mention inaccurate. It didn't appear ironic. It implied I supported lax academic standards!

Maarten you are very mistaken in your assumption that my explanations of a feminist empirical sociologist approach is 'attenuated po-mo'. I think you believe what I write is 'po-mo' because you do not know much about sociology, frankly. That's not a crime- but you are wrong in your assumptions.

This comment is pretty amazing too:

"I *really* wish you well Angela, and I don't mind that we think rather differently about philosophy, but IF we are to discuss I go for the truth by any stylistical means, and I don't think we are equals in the respects of philosophy, logic or written argument."

Really? You go for the truth? And what would you see me as doing? And we're not equals? So which of us is better? Have I got to make another pop-cultural reference to Harry Hill again?
 

Dolphin

Senior Member
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Thanks tomk. So exciting. I have a job!

It was fortuitous that you named your product MIRACLE CURE X. We can tie the X in with XMRV and XAND and the rest is hysterical (I mean history)!
With such insights, I'm promoting you to head of Marketing and Advertising. Not sure what salary increase you should get or how to structure bonuses?
 

gracenote

All shall be well . . .
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With such insights, I'm promoting you to head of Marketing and Advertising. Not sure what salary increase you should get or how to structure bonuses?
Thank you once again, tomk. Since I shall have been cured with MIRACLE CURE X, I am up for any challenge. Because I believe in this product, I shall promote it out of the largess of my heart, spreading the word with enthusiastic hyperbole. I only expect to be repaid with gratitude and obsequious adoration.

Now I will return our attention to this study of the CFS homebound which was the purpose of this thread originally. (Thanks all for indulging this silliness.)
 

Jody

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Ca 1980 - when I studied, and Angela Kennedy may be glad to hear it - one could get academic degrees in sociology, political science or philosophy by course points given for squatting and for political activism.
Maarten,

I'm not sure why you dragged Angela's name into this, but I have received a few complaints about the fact that you have done so. In reading through this thread I am noticing that Angela has tried to talk with you about this more than once. Your response has been to entertain yourself at her expense. Sometimes your arrogance plays well, and sometimes it does not. In this case, it really doesn't.

Your statement here, and your subsequent response to Angela is not acceptable. Please correct the situation.
 

Jody

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Maarten,

This is who I am. I am an administrator on these forums. I have come to you about something you posted. It is insulting another member. She has already tried to talk to you about this and gotten more ridicule from you. I have asked you to make appropriate changes.

We also require courtesy be directed toward administrators and moderators, and challenging my right to speak to you doesn't do this.

So I am simply going to repeat, Your statement here, and your subsequent response to Angela is not acceptable. Please correct the situation.