Sallysblooms
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HUH? I am a Texan. Odd things to say.
Dr Wakefield sues the BMJ in Texas.
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HUH? I am a Texan. Odd things to say.
Levi
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http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2010/02/19/82946/texas-evolution/?mobile=nc
Note: Some of my best friends do not believe in human evolution and believe that man and dinosaurs co-existed. I do not hold it against them in any way. Seriously. We just agree to disagree.
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Vaccines are reprehinsible, collective STUPIDITY when used as they have been, and potentially, species suicide.
We don't know jack squat as a species and we've been injecting our infants with foreign DNA/RNA for a century as one huge collective experiment and money spinner....way to go, ass clown Homo Sapiens!Stuff it, I'm a Vulcan!
Vaccines should be like any legitimate medical treatment:
-free from commercial abuse
-free from egotistical, authoritarian, governmental mandate EXCEPT in true, dire emergency, ie small pox or similar
Not everybody on this planet is altruistic and has the same goals brother. That is especially true with people in power.
snowathlete
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Thats my personal experience too. The one time i went to court, the judge in his summing up, agreed with me and then went and found in the other guys favour anyway. It was bizare.
Firestormm
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Justin,
This concerns me greatly. In my opinion I would not want Lewis and/or Wakefield anywhere near my condition thanks all the same. You simply cannot and should not seek to compare the Wakefield saga with what you believe constitutes bias towards ME by the BMJ et al.
You attempt to get Wakefield involved with my condition and it will undermine legitimacy for a start. You think the psychiatrist's in my country have ruled the roost - well you see what will happen if Wakefield wades into it all.
I kid you not - this could be the worst thing to hit ME - and if you are unfamiliar with the Wakefield fraud then please please please read the link I posted to the autism blog left brain right brain - the one that in turn links to Deer's refutation of Lewis's complaint: http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2012/01/brian-deer-responds-to-david-lewis-complaint/
e.g. Deer re nature of Lewis's 'fraud' complaint:
'These biopsy assessments, however, werent the basis upon which, in January 2011, the BMJ concluded that Wakefields MMR work was an elaborate fraud. The evidence we presented rested firmly on the GMC panels findings of research dishonesty, and was overwhelmingly related to Wakefields activities with regard to the admission of patients to the study, as well as the purported clinical histories and findings which lay behind a claim by Wakefield of a 14-day temporal link between the administration of MMR and the first behavioural symptoms of autism. We say this purported link was fraudulent.'
e.g. 'At the core of our problems in dealing with Lewis is that nowhere was such an allegation made in the BMJ. He repeatedly identifies my feature Autistic enterocolitis under the microscope, published in April 2010, but this simply doesnt make such an allegation. Plain reading would make this clear.
Not only can I find no foundation for this fundamental of Lewiss complaint (and I think Id remember forming any view at that time that the histopathology reporting in the Lancet was fraudulent, as distinct from, say, wrong, misleading or incompetent), we consulted legal counsel, before and after publication, and expert peer-reviewers. We remain unable to identify any text inferring Wakefields intent with regard to histology reporting. Ive similarly asked Nature to identify any such text, and they too have failed'
Wakefield/Lewis are autism and autism and ME are 'linked' because of Mikovits/Annette and their XMRV and Autism comments. Don't do this Justin. It will not help anyone.
And have a read of Deer and what he has to say about Lewis 'a retired environmental microbiologist' himself as part of his response to the 30 page nonsensical complaint: http://briandeer.com/solved/david-lewis-1.htm
This concerns me greatly. In my opinion I would not want Lewis and/or Wakefield anywhere near my condition thanks all the same. You simply cannot and should not seek to compare the Wakefield saga with what you believe constitutes bias towards ME by the BMJ et al.
You attempt to get Wakefield involved with my condition and it will undermine legitimacy for a start. You think the psychiatrist's in my country have ruled the roost - well you see what will happen if Wakefield wades into it all.
I kid you not - this could be the worst thing to hit ME - and if you are unfamiliar with the Wakefield fraud then please please please read the link I posted to the autism blog left brain right brain - the one that in turn links to Deer's refutation of Lewis's complaint: http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2012/01/brian-deer-responds-to-david-lewis-complaint/
e.g. Deer re nature of Lewis's 'fraud' complaint:
'These biopsy assessments, however, werent the basis upon which, in January 2011, the BMJ concluded that Wakefields MMR work was an elaborate fraud. The evidence we presented rested firmly on the GMC panels findings of research dishonesty, and was overwhelmingly related to Wakefields activities with regard to the admission of patients to the study, as well as the purported clinical histories and findings which lay behind a claim by Wakefield of a 14-day temporal link between the administration of MMR and the first behavioural symptoms of autism. We say this purported link was fraudulent.'
e.g. 'At the core of our problems in dealing with Lewis is that nowhere was such an allegation made in the BMJ. He repeatedly identifies my feature Autistic enterocolitis under the microscope, published in April 2010, but this simply doesnt make such an allegation. Plain reading would make this clear.
Not only can I find no foundation for this fundamental of Lewiss complaint (and I think Id remember forming any view at that time that the histopathology reporting in the Lancet was fraudulent, as distinct from, say, wrong, misleading or incompetent), we consulted legal counsel, before and after publication, and expert peer-reviewers. We remain unable to identify any text inferring Wakefields intent with regard to histology reporting. Ive similarly asked Nature to identify any such text, and they too have failed'
Wakefield/Lewis are autism and autism and ME are 'linked' because of Mikovits/Annette and their XMRV and Autism comments. Don't do this Justin. It will not help anyone.
And have a read of Deer and what he has to say about Lewis 'a retired environmental microbiologist' himself as part of his response to the 30 page nonsensical complaint: http://briandeer.com/solved/david-lewis-1.htm
Sallysblooms
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Levi, just leave Texan's from the subject please. Stereotypes can be made in any state or country.
Sallysblooms
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Thanks Rich. My state is amazing and stereotypes are silly.
Levi
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Sorry Sallysblooms, it just seems to me like the demographics favor Texas for jury selection over the UK for for the Wakefield libel suit. Which is the thread topic. I was not slamming individual Texans, since like you correctly say, stereotypes are problematic. Not trying to drift into religion or politics so I will shut up about Texas now.
Levi and all,
Anything would be better than the UK for a libel trial. Don't mean any insult to our wonderful Texan friends.
After a Judical Review of the NICE Guidelines (which was heard in the Royal Courts of Justice in London), we gave up our ideas of a legal remedy for ME abuse here (for now). My own personal attempts haven't worked well either.
Dr Wakefield would know how corrupt the legal system would be here for him.
Anything would be better than the UK for a libel trial. Don't mean any insult to our wonderful Texan friends.
After a Judical Review of the NICE Guidelines (which was heard in the Royal Courts of Justice in London), we gave up our ideas of a legal remedy for ME abuse here (for now). My own personal attempts haven't worked well either.
Dr Wakefield would know how corrupt the legal system would be here for him.
Absolutely! see my previous post. Many of the top judges have close friends and family members sitting on exe boards of GSK and similar - don't know how many people are aware that Legal Aid funding was denied to MMR families her in UK by the judge whose brother sits on the board of a MMR manufacturer. It doesn't get more disgusting than that.
But most important of all is that it is the Government, NOT the pharma, that would be the biggest loser if the full extent of Deer's fraud and GMC corruption comes to light. It is the Goverment and not pharma who is liable for vaccine damage, because of wonderful exemption agreements.
Lots of very powerful people in the UK have a lot to lose if details of how Wakefield was framed come to light. Read Callous Disregard if interested Callous Disregard: Autisms and Vaccines: The Truth Behind a Tragedy
SilverbladeTE
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Yeah and that damn judge refused to "recuse" himself from that case, grrr.
There's a great pic I an dig up again, showing the vast web of connections in the Wakefield case, as I keep saying, British system is corrupt to HELL.
And no, not because it's "Left wing" or any other wing or whatever
Jsut too old, too damn few systems of fair external oversight and no true accountbaility and limits becaue our Bill of RIghts & Constitution are quite literally not worth the paper, or rather, parchment, they are written on.
UK's government by CONSENT and Parliament, which does smooth/avoid a lot of problems vs US system, but has huge problems vs true Rule by Law (because it relie son the honesty of those invovled...yeah, sigh).
UK's Rights/Costitution are spread over 160+?, sometimes ancient, bills etc, this gives scumbags enormous "wiggle room" to avoid responsibility, which US Foudners and later tried to clamp down on
ergo, as I keep saying UK has a vile, incestous web of a small number ratbags pulling the strings of most of the nation, it's prevented from become a horror by the "consent" etc meaning they cannot ever been seen to be too blatant or the rug will pulled out from under their feet.
ie, if Wakefield is proven right, lot of powerful folk will be exposed for being scumbags.
There's a great pic I an dig up again, showing the vast web of connections in the Wakefield case, as I keep saying, British system is corrupt to HELL.
And no, not because it's "Left wing" or any other wing or whatever
Jsut too old, too damn few systems of fair external oversight and no true accountbaility and limits becaue our Bill of RIghts & Constitution are quite literally not worth the paper, or rather, parchment, they are written on.
UK's government by CONSENT and Parliament, which does smooth/avoid a lot of problems vs US system, but has huge problems vs true Rule by Law (because it relie son the honesty of those invovled...yeah, sigh).
UK's Rights/Costitution are spread over 160+?, sometimes ancient, bills etc, this gives scumbags enormous "wiggle room" to avoid responsibility, which US Foudners and later tried to clamp down on
ergo, as I keep saying UK has a vile, incestous web of a small number ratbags pulling the strings of most of the nation, it's prevented from become a horror by the "consent" etc meaning they cannot ever been seen to be too blatant or the rug will pulled out from under their feet.
ie, if Wakefield is proven right, lot of powerful folk will be exposed for being scumbags.
Undisclosed
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Moderator Note:
It was noted that there are two threads about this subject. Both are 4 pages long, so merging them is not a good idea at this point. Therefore, this thread is being closed so that only the conversation can continue on one thread only. The open thread is here
Kina.
It was noted that there are two threads about this subject. Both are 4 pages long, so merging them is not a good idea at this point. Therefore, this thread is being closed so that only the conversation can continue on one thread only. The open thread is here
Kina.
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