Do antivirals just push viruses deeper?

[anncavan]

I have been a big supporter of the antiviral approach (and am currently on Valcyte and Famvir). However, this week, I've had 2 well respected doctors tell me they think all antivirals do is push viruses deeper. This would be similiar to the idea in Lyme, where you may still have Lyme lurking deep in your tissue after the antibiotic regiments are through and you feel better.

They think they simply get pushed extremely deep and inactivated for a bit, but you never get 100% well and always risk a full relapse.

Does anyone else have opinions on this? Has anyone seen any research that supports this? I'm neutral, simplying wanting to learn more.

Thanks.

 

[SOC]

Ugh.... that's an awful thought.

Of course we never get rid of herpesvirus infections, they just go into latency. With our lousy immune systems, it's certainly possible that they can reactivate, but healthy peoples' immune systems can keep them latent and are unlikely to have reactivation.

I think the idea behind long-term antivirals was to prevent replication for so long that the number of infected cells is very small. Could these well respected doctors be thinking about 3 month antiviral courses that may only get at the easiest infected cells...?

 

[August59]

There is a possibility of resistance, but that can be true for just about any virus. Retroviruses are about as deep as you can get, but someone else would be better answering this than me. I can't see an antiviral directly increasing viral replication.

Other than possible resistance, I don't understand their thinking of "pushing them deeper"

 

[aquariusgirl]

Odd you should mention that. I just heard the same thing..second hand from a patient who said their doc said that.

I don't even understand what that means?

Would love for someone knowledgeable to chime in.

Care to name these well respected docs?

 

[anncavan]

Care to name these well respected docs?

I'd rather not... But I think it's a stronger feeling in the lyme community. Also, I get the feeling it's the doctors who are more "open" to ideas and alternative treatments that feel this way. Makes me wonder if they're more open to hearsay or somethign that isn't necessarily published in general? Where some doctors won't believe it until it's peer reviewed and disseminated via journal.

All I know is that I'm REALLY confused, as I'm hanging my hat on antivirals. Also, because I've never really bothered to investigate before, is Ampligen an antiviral?

 

[heapsreal]

antivirals stop the herpes viruses from replicating but i dont think this means it stops them being active, so in away there still doing their damage, just on a smaller scale, maybe we are just slowing it down. The cancer treatment where they do b cell depletion maybe a better way of irradicating herpes viruses in conjunction with antivirals. Ampligen has antiviral activity by stimulating our immune system to make more interferon which has direct antiviral properties as well as strengthen natural killer cells, there are probably other reasons as well.

cheers!!!

 

[ukxmrv]

Doctors are always telling me their observations and ideas. These are often based on what they see in their patients and not something published and concrete. I'm always happy to hear them talk, although I have seen individual doctors change their minds as the decades go on (which is fine and expected).

If AV's do push the viri deeper then my only immediate concern is "what is my choice"? Taking AV's has helped me with the symptoms of the chronic herpes family ones I carry. They may well be getting pushed deeper but until I can find something better I will continue with that for now. Alternative remedies and supplements failed.

I need to improve my current functioining to make my life bearable. In the future something better may come up. Then I'll try that. Given that I have little money it may be that I will be elderly when it does. Who knows. I'm not going to worry about it as I have no real choice right now.

 

[heapsreal]

im doing pretty well on famvir and using cycloferon to strengthen my immune system which i have noticed a jump in improvement from. I have just had some hormone testing done and they are out of whack so in the process of fixing it and also noticing some benefits from it. Hormones are worth looking into as i think the longer u have this illness the longer all the stress puts your hormones out of whack. If the AVs are working for u then keep going with them, dr lerner has some of his patients on them for several years and is having success.

cheers!!!

 

[Hope123]

Yeah, I don't know what they mean by "deeper" either. "Deeper" sounds horrible and menacing and implies it might be harder to treat but what do they really mean when they say that? I would ask them for clarification. Just because something is in the tissues doesn't mean it is automatically harder to treat; it depends on the pharmaceutical properties of the drug in question, how it is administered, etc.

For example, one could theorize that something in the liver could be treated "easier" because after gut absorption the liver is often where a lot of drugs pass first, so it gets hit with a higher dose. Or in the case of certain brain infections, blood brain barrier could be breached by directly injecting the drug into the spinal fluid instead of taking a pill. So a lot of factors.