Depression, insomnia and anxiety after methyl B12 - desperate for help

Messages
6
For two weeks (from the end of November to December 17) I took large doses of sublingual, methylated vitamin B12 in drops. The doses were 5000-6000 mcg in divided forms. I haven't been officially diagnosed with a deficiency, but I wanted to help my neuropathic pain, sciatica (etc.) due to fibromyalgia. Doctors have always prescribed me B vitamins, but I wanted to try a little higher doses. Especially since I've heard that you can't overdose on B12 and there are no side effects.

On December 13th I had my first panic attacks in my life. That day I didn't sleep the whole night, not even a minute. My whole body was shaking (especially my hands). I had no reason to be worried, and my body was completely shaken. I didn't know what was happening around me. I felt a strong warmth, hard to describe unreality and depressive states bordering on psychosis. My heart was beating like I had run a marathon. The worst thing was what was happening in my head. That night I felt like all the worst things had taken over me. I had the worst thoughts imaginable, I felt terribly alone, like I was the only person on earth, overwhelming sadness and the belief that it would always be like this - that I would always live in pain (fibromyalgia) and that I would always be alone, unhappy etc.

On December 17th I took another large dose of vitamin B12. It was basically the same thing all over, except I didn't have such negative thoughts. I didn't sleep all night either. The next few days were awful for me. Constant fear and anxiety, severe depression, I cried all the time, everything made me incredibly sad, I didn't know what was happening to me.

I found some info that it could be overmethylation and that niacin should help quickly. At that point I only had niacinamide with me, so on December 25th I started taking 50 mg of niacinamide every hour. I felt a slight improvement, but I still felt absolutely terrible.

In the following days I increased the dose of niacinamide (up to 250 mg 4 times a day) and I started to feel better and better. I still felt depressed, I still had anxiety and I slept 2-3 hours a night, but it was much better than at the beginning. I felt like I was slowly starting to come out of it.

I decided to reduce my niacinamide dose (to 250 mg twice a day) and on January 8th I didn't sleep through the night. On January 9th I only slept for 2 hours. On January 10th I also didn't sleep through the night. I started feeling worse and worse again. After B12 I am very overstimulated and overenergized. I don't feel tired at all and don't feel like sleeping. I took melatonin to try to sleep (it gave me about 4-5 hours of sleep last night, although I woke up every hour), but it made me feel even more depressed. I found information that melatonin is also a methyl donor, so that would explain it.

I wonder how long it will take for this to all be over? Should I take niacin until all symptoms disappear? How long can overmethylation last? Most people write that after 2-4 days of taking niacin all their symptoms disappeared. I took niacinamide for over 2 weeks and I am still a long way from my previous state. It's really, really hard for me.

I've been taking 50mg of niacin every hour for the past two days. It helps a little, but I still feel really, really bad. I'd appreciate any advice.
 

L'engle

moogle
Messages
3,308
Location
Canada
Maybe consider TMG or another kind of glycine? Taurine or B6 may help. Magnesium glycinate has been useful for a lot of people.
 
Last edited:

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
18,176
If I get overstimulation via overmethylation, I usually take a 1000 mg dose of niacinamide once or twice daily. I've read that up to 3 grams of B3 a day is considered safe for the liver.

In my case, overstimulation can appear if I take too much methylfolate, a methyl donor. But usually this overstimulation only lasts for 24 hours.


Are you taking any supplements or drugs that have stimulatory effects? Panax ginseng, Rhodiola rosea, bromelain, and sulbutiamine can all be stimulatory.

And certain antidepressant drugs that act on norepinephrine are stimulatory, so could worsen overstimuation.

Supplements that act as methyl donors, such as S-adenosyl-methionine (SAMe), trimethylglycine or methylfolate will contribute to overmethylation and thus overstimulation.


I've read that vitamin C and zinc can help counter overmethylation, but I don't know if this is true.
 
Messages
6
I don't take any supplements or stimulants. I don't even drink any caffeinated beverages (coffee, cola, etc.).

I remember that already at the beginning of December I felt strangely stressed and my hands were shaking during some activities. On December 10, I had to deal with one simple matter and I was stressed like never in my life. I myself wondered what was wrong with me. At that time I had no idea that it was a reaction to large doses of methylated B12.

I have never had depression and have never taken medication for it, although I did take duloxetine for 4 weeks in August, not for depression, but for fibromyalgia.

At the moment I am not taking any supplements (or medications) except for niacin/niacinamide and herbal sedatives.

Thank you for your comments!
 

kushami

Senior Member
Messages
534
@lukarello , I can’t offer any advice, but I just wanted to say that I have also had a very strange mental reaction to a medication, and sympathise with the horrible thoughts you have had.

Have you read the Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy series? It was as though I had been put into the Total Perpective Vortex machine that Douglas Adams dreamt up. I saw an overview of my life and how pathetic and futile my existence was. It was extremely unpleasant. I suppose it was similar to a “bad trip” as might have been described in the 1960s.

Luckily this effect wore off when the medication wore off (by the next day).

I do hope you feel better soon. Could you ask your doctor for a small supply of sleeping tablets to help you get through this difficult time?
 

Wayne

Senior Member
Messages
4,493
Location
Ashland, Oregon
I'd appreciate any advice.
Hi @lukarello -- So sorry to hear how difficult things are for you. I'm constantly working on keeping my system as calm as possible, and use a number of different techniques help me do that. One that I do daily is the Balancing the Cortices technique, which I describe in the linked post. Perhaps it will help with your situation (it's really quite easy to learn and do). -- All the Best...
 
Messages
21
For two weeks (from the end of November to December 17) I took large doses of sublingual, methylated vitamin B12 in drops. The doses were 5000-6000 mcg in divided forms. I haven't been officially diagnosed with a deficiency, but I wanted to help my neuropathic pain, sciatica (etc.) due to fibromyalgia. Doctors have always prescribed me B vitamins, but I wanted to try a little higher doses. Especially since I've heard that you can't overdose on B12 and there are no side effects.

On December 13th I had my first panic attacks in my life. That day I didn't sleep the whole night, not even a minute. My whole body was shaking (especially my hands). I had no reason to be worried, and my body was completely shaken. I didn't know what was happening around me. I felt a strong warmth, hard to describe unreality and depressive states bordering on psychosis. My heart was beating like I had run a marathon. The worst thing was what was happening in my head. That night I felt like all the worst things had taken over me. I had the worst thoughts imaginable, I felt terribly alone, like I was the only person on earth, overwhelming sadness and the belief that it would always be like this - that I would always live in pain (fibromyalgia) and that I would always be alone, unhappy etc.

On December 17th I took another large dose of vitamin B12. It was basically the same thing all over, except I didn't have such negative thoughts. I didn't sleep all night either. The next few days were awful for me. Constant fear and anxiety, severe depression, I cried all the time, everything made me incredibly sad, I didn't know what was happening to me.

I found some info that it could be overmethylation and that niacin should help quickly. At that point I only had niacinamide with me, so on December 25th I started taking 50 mg of niacinamide every hour. I felt a slight improvement, but I still felt absolutely terrible.

In the following days I increased the dose of niacinamide (up to 250 mg 4 times a day) and I started to feel better and better. I still felt depressed, I still had anxiety and I slept 2-3 hours a night, but it was much better than at the beginning. I felt like I was slowly starting to come out of it.

I decided to reduce my niacinamide dose (to 250 mg twice a day) and on January 8th I didn't sleep through the night. On January 9th I only slept for 2 hours. On January 10th I also didn't sleep through the night. I started feeling worse and worse again. After B12 I am very overstimulated and overenergized. I don't feel tired at all and don't feel like sleeping. I took melatonin to try to sleep (it gave me about 4-5 hours of sleep last night, although I woke up every hour), but it made me feel even more depressed. I found information that melatonin is also a methyl donor, so that would explain it.

I wonder how long it will take for this to all be over? Should I take niacin until all symptoms disappear? How long can overmethylation last? Most people write that after 2-4 days of taking niacin all their symptoms disappeared. I took niacinamide for over 2 weeks and I am still a long way from my previous state. It's really, really hard for me.

I've been taking 50mg of niacin every hour for the past two days. It helps a little, but I still feel really, really bad. I'd appreciate any advice.
Greetings & I hope you're feeling better.
I find it best to always start "slow & low" with supplements; especially when trying something new. I worked for a holistic practice for 7 years & not once did the providers ever prescribe these kinds of "mega doses". Especially in taking anything hourly. Sometimes, they had folks take breaks of 1 week from supplements altogether when having issues like yours. I have often taken such breaks and it's been helpful, especially with the B vitamins and magnesium. The B's can interfere with sleep as I have found the hard way!
I believe we need to approach supplements carefully because they can have side effects. Maybe get yourself a good book like Dr. Josh Axe Ancient Remedies where they offer suggestions on supplementation amounts of find a holistic doc.

For what it's worth,

K.
 
Messages
6
I know that this all happened because of the high doses of methylated B12 and my mistake was that I was taking it without cofactors. I didn't know that at the time.

I have been taking niacinamide for almost 3 weeks (maximum 1000 mg per day). Niacin in doses of 50 mg every hour (8 times a day) for 4 days and I still feel bad.

Depression, insomnia and anxiety are not my only symptoms. I feel bad mentally. Nothing makes me happy, nothing matters to me. I am very irritable and emotional. Sometimes when I do something I feel like throwing everything away and crying. I feel anxiety, fear, my body shakes a bit. I have brain fog. I don't remember anything at all. On top of that I have migraines, nausea etc.

Niacin and niacinamide help me, but it's a short-term effect. For example, I feel worse in the morning and when I take niacin every hour, I start to feel better and better.

Yesterday in the morning when someone asked me what the book I was reading was about, I couldn't answer anything. I literally remembered nothing. In the evening I returned to this topic and discussed everything for several minutes. I felt my memory coming back, that the brain fog had decreased a lot. I was calmer. I started listening to music and even felt a slight interest.

And I know that many people had severe symptoms of overmethylation after vitamin B12 and folic acid. I know that they even had s*icidal thoughts. The problem is that they returned to normal after 2-4 days of using niacin, glycine, etc.

And here I am, 3-4 weeks later still feeling absolutely horrible. When I take niacin and start to feel better, I regain hope that things will only get better. And in the evening I really feel much, much better compared to the morning. But the next morning it's tragic again, everything comes back again. I don't know what to do anymore.
 
Messages
21
I know that this all happened because of the high doses of methylated B12 and my mistake was that I was taking it without cofactors. I didn't know that at the time.

I have been taking niacinamide for almost 3 weeks (maximum 1000 mg per day). Niacin in doses of 50 mg every hour (8 times a day) for 4 days and I still feel bad.

Depression, insomnia and anxiety are not my only symptoms. I feel bad mentally. Nothing makes me happy, nothing matters to me. I am very irritable and emotional. Sometimes when I do something I feel like throwing everything away and crying. I feel anxiety, fear, my body shakes a bit. I have brain fog. I don't remember anything at all. On top of that I have migraines, nausea etc.

Niacin and niacinamide help me, but it's a short-term effect. For example, I feel worse in the morning and when I take niacin every hour, I start to feel better and better.

Yesterday in the morning when someone asked me what the book I was reading was about, I couldn't answer anything. I literally remembered nothing. In the evening I returned to this topic and discussed everything for several minutes. I felt my memory coming back, that the brain fog had decreased a lot. I was calmer. I started listening to music and even felt a slight interest.

And I know that many people had severe symptoms of overmethylation after vitamin B12 and folic acid. I know that they even had s*icidal thoughts. The problem is that they returned to normal after 2-4 days of using niacin, glycine, etc.

And here I am, 3-4 weeks later still feeling absolutely horrible. When I take niacin and start to feel better, I regain hope that things will only get better. And in the evening I really feel much, much better compared to the morning. But the next morning it's tragic again, everything comes back again. I don't know what to do anymore.
Do you have access to a therapist or a doctor who can help you with your symptoms?
 
Messages
6
I went to a therapist, he diagnosed me with depression and anxiety and prescribed medications.

But I still feel like I'm in some alternate reality. Before B12 I felt really good mentally. And then came depression, derealization, psychosis, panic attacks, anxiety, insomnia. I've never had such problems, not even close.

Someone suggested to me that it might be long covid. I don't know anymore, but I actually got very sick in early December and I haven't recovered yet. I still have symptoms like severe sore throat, sinus pain, headaches, chest tightness.

But can long covid cause such severe psychological symptoms? Yesterday and today I drank anti-inflammatory herbs and felt a little better. Maybe that's a clue...
 
Messages
21
Hi Lukarello,

Glad you answered back. I hope you find it helpful to reach out and chat with others.

I do have long covid and yes - it can make you feel depressed. I certainly felt depressed during the flares I've had with it. After my flares subsided, I eventually get back to my old self again, but it does take time. I rely on several supplements daily that I believe helped.

Have you heard of Bach Flower Essences? I swear by the Mustard essence for depression & their Rescue Remedy for anxiety. They are nice to have on hand as they work quickly on improving your mood if you take as directed.

I also agree that the herbs are a clue to your issues. Covid is basically an "anti-inflammatory sh*t storm" so to speak so you want to eat foods and teas that are supportive in combating inflammation.

This book is really excellent for long covid, inflammation, etc. It offfers very helpful & practical solutions.

https://www.amazon.com/Long-Illness-Practical-Surviving-Thriving/dp/030682874X


Hope that helps & that you have a good day. Hang in there. 🌅
 
Messages
6
I don't even know how to describe the condition I'm in, but I'll try:
  • First, my brain has completely shut down. I have absolutely no thoughts, zero. Before, I always had a lot of thoughts, ideas, and plans. Now I have a completely blank mind.
  • My perception of time has changed. Time moves very, very slowly. Every day seems excruciatingly long.
  • Everything makes me extremely sad. Wherever I look, I feel deep despair. I can't watch TV, read books, talk to someone or anything, because I constantly feel such negative feelings that I want to explode (it's slightly better after I cry).
  • I can't sleep (I fall asleep at 4am and for just 1-2 hours).
  • Anxiety and occasional panic attacks.
  • Complete anhedonia (I have no feelings and I haven't felt any positive feelings for a month), lack of interest in anything.
  • Depersonalization (everything seems artificial, I feel like I'm alone and somehow I see the world around me differently).
  • Very little desire to eat (or no appetite).
  • Dizziness, nausea, headaches, vision problems etc.
I consulted a psychiatrist who said that high doses of B12 had completely deregulated my neurotransmitters in my brain and that's why I feel the way I do.

I feel like I've been poisoned. Every day is an absolute nightmare. I really don't know what can help me anymore.
 

Wayne

Senior Member
Messages
4,493
Location
Ashland, Oregon
I feel like I've been poisoned. Every day is an absolute nightmare. I really don't know what can help me anymore.
Hi @lukarello -- I really feel for you. Perhaps until things can get harmonized in your brain again, a simple spiritual (HU Song) that I have links to in my signature might be something that could be helpful. Take care!
 
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