Anyone get burning in their upper back?

[ChookityPop]

I have started getting burning in my upper back on both sides. It makes me nauseous and dizzy. I had three days in a row that I almost fainted when walking to the bathroom. low blood pressure and had to lay down. This was at night and was somewhat better during the day. It may be the dorsal scapular nerve seen in this link https://www.solsticephysicaltherapy...ting-down-the-back-of-the-arm-could-it-be-dns

Could it be from water rentention? I have gained some water weight after starting TRT, maybe 4kg but Im still thin. 180cm and weigh between 67-69kg.

I also have on and off carpal tunnel in both hands maybe its related to the burning in the back. Idk.

Im pushing for SFN sweat test but they keep rejecting me because of my diagnosis.

Anyone else?

 

[Rebeccare]

I was having neck and upper back problems earlier this year. It actually turned out to be POTS related. Does it follow this pattern?

 

[ChookityPop]

I was having neck and upper back problems earlier this year. It actually turned out to be POTS related. Does it follow this pattern?

View attachment 42263

Wow, this is really interesting. It matches it perfect. Could it be due to small fiber neuropathy? Its difficult to explain the feeling. I guess it kind of feels like poor blood flow. I started using a nail mat and I think it helps a bit.
Have you found anything that helps?

 

[Rebeccare]

Have you found anything that helps?

Oddly enough, four month's worth of pain vanished almost instantly when I started taking measures to treat the POTS such as wearing thigh-high compression stockings, increasing my fluid intake, and increasing my sodium.

Before I figured it out, though, two things that seemed to bring a little bit of relief were wall push-ups and the child's pose. Depending on the day, sometimes a heating pad helped and sometimes a cold pack helped. And certain positions such as sitting cross-legged or reclining in bed seemed to make the pain less bad.

Could it be due to small fiber neuropathy?

It seems like small fiber neuropathy can cause all sorts of weird pains, so who knows? And it can also cause the poor blood flow that results in the coat hanger pain.

 

[junkcrap50]

I was having neck and upper back problems earlier this year. It actually turned out to be POTS related. Does it follow this pattern?

View attachment 42263

Can you expand on this post? What type of problems were you having, specifically? Coat hanger pain? Did you have knots, spasms, painful muscles? What was the pain like: soreness, aching, sharp, electrical/shocks, burning, etc.? Did sleep or neck position worsen it? How was it POTS related? How can POTS have any connection to coat hanger pain?

It seems like small fiber neuropathy can cause all sorts of weird pains, so who knows? And it can also cause the poor blood flow that results in the coat hanger pain.

Really? Any references of more info on this?

 

[Rebeccare]

What type of problems were you having, specifically? Coat hanger pain? Did you have knots, spasms, painful muscles? What was the pain like: soreness, aching, sharp, electrical/shocks, burning, etc.? Did sleep or neck position worsen it? How was it POTS related? How can POTS have any connection to coat hanger pain?

Yes, it was coat hanger pain. My muscles felt sore and tight and they burned. It was usually at its worst first thing in the morning, although I'm not sure if that's because of the position I slept in or because my POTS symptoms are worst first thing in the morning. I tried sleeping in a soft collar, but that didn't seem to help at all. But, like I said, the pain went away quickly once I started treating the POTS symptoms with compression stockings, more fluid, and more sodium.

I don't quite understand the science behind how this is POTS related (science is not my strongest suit). But from what I've read, the theory is that when there hypotension it causes inadequate blood flow to these muscles, which causes the pain. Just from a quick Google search, here are a few sources of information:

https://www.nature.com/articles/3101259

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22711896/

https://thedysautonomiaproject.org/coat-hanger-phenomenon-and-the-pretzel-leg-sign/

https://www.healthrising.org/blog/2...ria-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-dr-newton-talks/

Really? Any references of more info on this?

This is an excellent talk on small fiber polyneuropathy and how it affects various systems:

My take-away is that SFPN causes the autonomic issues that then lead to coat hanger pain.

I hope these are helpful!

 

[BrightCandle]

I had that precise triangle of pain which was worse on the right hand side at the shoulder blade for years, steadily getting worse. Its improved dramatically recently with my protocol and is rarely something I notice now.

 

[ljimbo423]

My take-away is that SFPN causes the autonomic issues that then lead to coat hanger pain.

Thanks for the video and other info. I have coat hanger pain. It is usually at it's worst when I'm standing in front of my kitchen sink washing dishes.

The posture I have, seems to cause significant pain. It often gets bad enough that I need to take breaks from doing the dishes every 10-15 minutes or so.

Dr. Khosro Farhad in the video, works at Wentworth Douglass Hospital, which is just about 1 mile from me.

 

[junkcrap50]

https://thedysautonomiaproject.org/coat-hanger-phenomenon-and-the-pretzel-leg-sign/

This link to the Dysautonomia Project is a great link and resource. Lots of good info. Very good overview and summary. Thanks!

 

[ChookityPop]

I had that precise triangle of pain which was worse on the right hand side at the shoulder blade for years, steadily getting worse. Its improved dramatically recently with my protocol and is rarely something I notice now.

Thats awesome! Can I ask what your protocol is like?

 

[godlovesatrier]

Bright Candle is on the same protocol as the one in my signature @ChookityPop

 

[Rebeccare]

Bright Candle is on the same protocol as the one in my signature @ChookityPop

We're allowed to talk about the Herpes Viridae/Joshua Leisk protocol and even call it by its name--it's not like Voldemort (he-who-must-not-be-named)! Although maybe it's best to discuss it in another thread--we don't want to take this thread off track.

 

[Rebeccare]

It is usually at it's worst when I'm standing in front of my kitchen sink washing dishes.

Have you ever tried doing dishes while perched on a stool? I wonder if that might help. I do this often, since it helps keep my heart rate from shooting up. If that helps keep more blood in your upper body, perhaps it might help with the pain?

 

[godlovesatrier]

Yep I know, I just usually refer to it like that, no particular reason for it

 

[ChookityPop]

Thanks for the video and other info. I have coat hanger pain. It is usually at it's worst when I'm standing in front of my kitchen sink washing dishes.

The posture I have, seems to cause significant pain. It often gets bad enough that I need to take breaks from doing the dishes every 10-15 minutes or so.

Very insteresting. Most of the time I keep the coat hanger pain in check but I have now figured out that I trigger it to come back if I wash dishes just like you say. And I only wash my frying pan and thats enough to do it sometimes.

How would you describe the coat hanger pain? For me it actually feels like the muscles dont get enough blood or oxygen as well as some lactic acid feeling.

 

[ljimbo423]

How would you describe the coat hanger pain?

Mine is usually an aching pain. Sometimes the ache is really, really painful! To say it just aches feels like a profound understatement.

But the pain is an aching, ranging from mild to very intense. To the point where I just can't stand the pain, I have to stop doing the dishes to get some relief.

 

[BrightCandle]

It was definitely a tired strained muscle feeling for me, always felt like it needed stretching but it just never got better with exercise. Much easier to tell once its gone and you are left with the lingering sensation of an injury. I have had to do a lot of shoulder squeeze and stretch work over the past few months to restore motion and its still not quite right.

 

[godlovesatrier]

@ChookityPop that could be lack of oxygen and blood to the brain. I am sure Cort mentioned in his thiamine article that higher doses of thiamine help with this, but I might be making that up. At any rate high doses of thiamine (even 300mg to 400mg) increases blood flow to the brain and oxygenation. Who knows if that would have any effect on coat hanger pain, but I do know my shoulders are particular tense - or they were at least the last few days.

 

[Judee]

@ChookityPop that could be lack of oxygen and blood to the brain. I am sure Cort mentioned in his thiamine article that higher doses of thiamine help with this, but I might be making that up. At any rate high doses of thiamine (even 300mg to 400mg) increases blood flow to the brain and oxygenation. Who knows if that would have any effect on coat hanger pain, but I do know my shoulders are particular tense - or they were at least the last few days.

I still have my Mom's bed on a slant and so just tried something with this as I also get this "coat hanger" type pain all the time.

I lay with my feet at the higher end and my head at the lower end to see if this pain would diminish as the blood flowed back up towards my shoulders.

It did seem to help but I'll have to compare that later to just laying flat.