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Anybody selling DNSR program?

Seven7

Seven
Messages
3,444
Location
USA
is anybody wanting to sell the DNSR program? not sure if that is possible I want to research and apart from videos not really saying anything I do not know where to learn or buy for research purposes.
 

sunshine44

Que sera sera
Messages
1,123
When I do it YES it absolutely helps. But then I would tell myself killing the virus's was more important and get off course and focus on supplements and meds....and here I am.

When I also try to do a ton of detoxing with a supplement to kill lyme etc and have 2 severe crashes in one year....bad combo. So, I am working on focusing on this stuff more and less on the suppelemnts and meds that have really taken me down as my system is much too fragile for it.

Just my experience.
 

sunshine44

Que sera sera
Messages
1,123
I should say too that I have personally spoke to many people using these type of programs to help heal and I don't think anything is the cure-all. I think the people with ME/CFS whom do it, get better and relapse (that we read aout in here, etc.) may be getting excited, push it and relapse....it seems to be a toggle kinda approach. Like it is part of the solution but the virus's and bacteria are still going to take some time to go away as your immune system strengthens.

That is the main goal, getting our immune systems to do their best work which is why this program works I believe if used regularly. No amount of supplements can strengthen our immune systems...trust me I've tried lol!!
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,807
When I do it YES it absolutely helps.

Do the DNSR/Gupta etc programs help just because they teach positive thinking and educate (or should we say indoctrinate) you to ignore your symptoms, in which case you may report feeling better even though your symptoms have not actually improved?

Or do these programs actually help in an objectively measurable way? For example, if you have POTS —whose severity can be accurately and objectively measured by the increase in heart rate on standing — does DNSR/Gupta improve POTS such that you heart rate no longer increases so much on standing?

Another objective measure: if you find that you normally cannot walk to the shops for example without triggering PEM, do the DNSR/Gupta programs enable to do that walk without getting PEM?

How are you gauging the improvements in symptoms made by these programs?



No amount of supplements can strengthen our immune systems...trust me I've tried lol!!

There are quite a few supplements that have been shown in studies to stimulate or modulate the immune system.

The ones that have a track record of improving ME/CFS symptoms in some patients include oxymatrine and inosine, which Dr John Chia finds helps some of his ME/CFS patients.
 

sunshine44

Que sera sera
Messages
1,123
Have never done Gupta.

You are not taught to ignore your symptoms. You are taught strategies that help your mind to feel better and remind you of what good things feel like, since the pain and symptoms have kept us in a state of hypervigilance. There is much evidence that the limbic system can calm and yes POTS can decrease/go away in some people using these type of strategies.

I had a very, very difficult 2018. 2 deaths in family and two severe crashes from supplements, so I have had a lot going on. It is typically not recommended you begin the program when under a lot of stress from deaths, etc. for obvious reasons. Sooooo, don't gage by my story I have barely given it a go but when I was doing it, yes I was finding my tolerance was increasing to standing for longer amounts, etc. I plan on incorporating more of the methods in my life this year.

There are massive amounts of supplements for immune system but any good dr will tell you, as they have me, your best friend is internally strengthening your own immune system. I am not at all saying there are not things that can help but if immune boosting supplements were the 'cure' for this, the word would be out, a lot of us have found otherwise. It hasn't been that simple because the immune system is so complicated. Simple seesm to be best for so many of us in this complicated illness. I am also speaking from the mast cell crowd that has ALOT of reactions to most of these.
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,807
You are taught strategies that help your mind to feel better and remind you of what good things feel like, since the pain and symptoms have kept us in a state of hypervigilance.

Sure, not criticizing positive thinking techniques per se, but pointing out that there is a difference between positive thinking, and the actual objective improvement of symptoms.


Perhaps all of us with ME/CFS could benefit from some psychological techniques that aim to brighten our lives, supply hope, or give us more optimism.

In fact I think this is one of the reasons that ME/CFS patients generally follow all the ME/CFS research very closely, as we are looking for reasons to be hopeful and optimistic.

Myself, whenever I am planning to try a drug or supplement that I read about, and which I think might improve my ME/CFS, even before I start taking it, just doing the research on it puts me in a better, more optimistic mood. 90% of the time it turns out that the drug or supplement I tried had no benefits, and it's then back to the drawing board. But at least for several weeks I was in an optimistic hopeful mood.



There is much evidence that the limbic system can calm and yes POTS can decrease/go away in some people using these type of strategies.

POTS often arises after viral infection. Recent studies have found autoantibodies POTS patients which target the nerves of the autonomic nervous system. That seems a plausible mechanism to explain POTS; though the number of studies conducted is small, so this autoimmune research is still in its infancy.

At this point I don't think there is any scientific evidence for DNSR or other psychological therapies helping POTS. Though there are anecdotal stories. However, I imagine that thousands of patients may have tried DNSR, and with that many people, you are bound to get a few that just improve spontaneously.

You find spontaneous resolution in approximately 75% of younger POTS patients. Ref: 1

If we get some well-conducted double-blind placebo controlled trials showing DNSR can help POTS, then that might throw a different light on things.
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,807
if immune boosting supplements were the 'cure' for this, the word would be out, a lot of us have found otherwise

Cure is a rare thing in ME/CFS, but immunomodulators like LDN and oxymatrine do seem to help a percentage of ME/CFS patients. Dr Chia finds LDN works for around 10 to 20% of patients. 1 2
 

sunshine44

Que sera sera
Messages
1,123
Sure, not criticizing positive thinking techniques per se, but pointing out that there is a difference between positive thinking, and the actual objective improvement of symptoms.


Perhaps all of us with ME/CFS could benefit from some psychological techniques that aim to brighten our lives, supply hope, or give us more optimism.

In fact I think this is one of the reasons that ME/CFS patients generally follow all the ME/CFS research very closely, as we are looking for reasons to be hopeful and optimistic.

Myself, whenever I am planning to try a drug or supplement that I read about, and which I think might improve my ME/CFS, even before I start taking it, just doing the research on it puts me in a better, more optimistic mood. 90% of the time it turns out that the drug or supplement I tried had no benefits, and it's then back to the drawing board. But at least for several weeks I was in an optimistic hopeful mood.





POTS often arises after viral infection. Recent studies have found autoantibodies POTS patients which target the nerves of the autonomic nervous system. That seems a plausible mechanism to explain POTS; though the number of studies conducted is small, so this autoimmune research is still in its infancy.

At this point I don't think there is any scientific evidence for DNSR or other psychological therapies helping POTS. Though there are anecdotal stories. However, I imagine that thousands of patients may have tried DNSR, and with that many people, you are bound to get a few that just improve spontaneously.

You find spontaneous resolution in approximately 75% of younger POTS patients. Ref: 1

If we get some well-conducted double-blind placebo controlled trials showing DNSR can help POTS, then that might throw a different light on things.
yes. absolutely.

I know there have been some recent independent studies but have not looked into any of this much. From the DNRS website:

---We are excited to provide an update on two independent research studies!

The observational study at McMaster University in Hamilton Ontario is complete. They are in the process of compiling their results and will be publishing a peer reviewed paper soon! They followed 100 participants who attended the 5 day DNRS Training Seminar for 1 full year to track their recovery process!

The Neuroplasticity project that is taking place in partnership with the University of Alberta (Integrative Health Institute) and the University of Calgary has completed Phase 1 of the study (a systematic review of published research to understand what is already known about Mind-Body Interventions (MBI) as they relate to Myalgic Encephalomyelitis/Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Multiple Chemical Sensitivity and Fibromyalgia. The researchers stated, “the results found that MBI’s have varying results depending on the condition ranging from no noticeable effects to significantly improving symptoms in patients affected by these conditions. Now, with a deeper understanding of what findings already exist, researchers will now move to Phase II of this project which will include a clinical trial comprised of quantitative, qualitative and neuroimaging methods to evaluate the impact of DNRS.” ---