Allergy / Mast cell treatments

[triffid113]

Re H2 receptors -- when they DO work in regulating histamine overload/sensitivity is mainly when they are used in combination with H1 antagonists. I cannot find my notes now but remember a couple of studies describing raised IgE levels when H2 (even H1 from what I can remember) blockers were used on their own. This effects was not present when a H1+H2 antagonists where used in combination.

These could hopefully give you more clues:

Improved outcomes in patients with acute allergic syndromes who are treated with combined H1 and H2 antagonists http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11054200

Treatment of chronic idiopathic urticaria with combined H1 and H2 blockers http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30546

Greater inhibition of dermographia with a combination of H1 and H2 antagonists http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6132569

H1- and H2-receptor antagonists prevent histamine release in allergic patients after the administration of midazolam-ketamine. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10219654

Histamine 2 blocker potentiates the effects of histamine 1 blocker in suppressing histamine-induced wheal http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19052407

Conjunctival eosinophil infiltration evoked by histamine and immediate hypersensitivity. Modification by H1- and H2-receptor blockade http://www.iovs.org/content/27/10/1495.long
… neither cimetidine nor pyrilamine alone produced an inhibitory effect, but a cimetidine-pyrilamine combination caused a significant reduction in the number of infiltrating eosinophils and prevented epithelial damage and goblet cell depletion


Another very interesting thing I was coming across when looking into antihistamines was histaminergic involvement in various areas that are often problematic in CFS/ME like modulation of glutamate release, central cholinergic system, even cardiac systolic function …


A histamine H₂ receptor blocker ameliorates development of heart failure in dogs independently of β-adrenergic receptor blockade http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20852875
These beneficial effects of famotidine were associated with a decrease of the myocardial cAMP level. Histamine H₂ receptor blockade preserves cardiac systolic function in dogs with pacing-induced heart failure, even in the presence of β-adrenergic receptor blockade. This finding strengthens the rationale for using histamine H₂ blockers in the treatment of heart failure.

I am a terribly allergic person and totally unschooled about all of this. But one thing jumps out...your mentioning that blah blah raises IgE. Did you know that ZINC lowers IgG?


http://www.springerlink.com/content/dhn3804v156563r8/

Biomedical and Life Sciences

BioMetals

Volume 22, Number 6 (2009), 1031-1040, DOI: 10.1007/s10534-009-9254-z

Comparison of inhibitory activities of zinc oxide ultrafine and fine particulates on IgE-induced mast cell activation

Kouya Yamaki and Shin Yoshino

Abstract

The effects of ultrafine and fine particles of zinc oxide (ZnO) on IgE-dependent mast cell activation were investigated. The rat mast cell line RBL2H3 sensitized with monoclonal anti-ovalbumin (OVA) IgE was challenged with OVA in the presence or absence of ZnO particles and zinc sulfate (ZnSO4). Degranulation of RBL2H3 was examined by the release of β-hexosaminidase. To understand the mechanisms responsible for regulating mast cell functions, the effects of ZnO particles on the levels of intracellular Zn2+, Ca2+, phosphorylated-Akt, and global tyrosine phosphorylation were also measured. IgE-induced release of β-hexosaminidase was obviously attenuated by ultrafine ZnO particles and ZnSO4, whereas it was very weakly inhibited by fine ZnO particles. The intracellular Zn2+ concentration was higher in the cells incubated with ultrafine ZnO particles than in those with fine ZnO particles. Consistent with inhibitory effect on release of β-hexosaminidase, ultrafine ZnO particles and ZnSO4, but not fine ZnO particle, strongly attenuated the IgE-mediated increase of phosphorylated-Akt and tyrosine phosphorylations of 100 and 70 kDa proteins in RBL2H3 cells. These findings indicate that ultrafine ZnO particles, with a small diameter and a large total surface area/mass, could release Zn2+ easily and increase intracellular Zn2+ concentration efficiently, thus decreasing FcεRI-mediated mast cell degranulation through inhibitions of PI3K and protein tyrosine kinase activation. Exposure to ZnO particles might affect immune responses, especially in allergic diseases.

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The reason I can't relate to the H1 H2 receptor discussion is that I refuse to take drugs (ESPECIALLY PPI inhibitors which I am convinced are the real reason my father passed on). I am extremely sensitive to drugs and so I cannot take them. But turning off your stomach acid production IMHO is ALWAYS a mistake. And fyi I have NEVER SEEN these things prescribed after ACTUALLY testing stomach ph...it is always ASSUMED that if the stomach hurts, then it is too much HCL (when in fact it may be too LITTLE). DO you know that PPI inhibitors have been proven to cause contraction of CDIFFs if the germs are present (whereas people with sufficient HCL do not get CDIFFs). HCL is the body's main defense against pathogens entering through the digestive tract.

 

[triffid113]

I typed a long article about the Weston Price article about oxalates which says quite a bit about CFS but I somehow lost it. Here's the article if interested: http://www.westonaprice.org/food-features/the-role-of-oxalates-in-autism-and-chronic-disorders

It says you can get oxalates from yeasts and fungi, such as Candide [which says to me the primary problem is low HCL, because adequate HCL prevents Candide overgrowth].

Here is an exerpt:
CHRONIC FATIGUE AND FIBROMYALGIA

Yeast is a common factor in chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia, and antifungal therapy is very useful in treating these problems. Jacob Teitelbaum has written several books about the treatment of fibromyalgia and indicates two-thirds of individuals improved their chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia after anti-fungal therapy.

A Dr. Eaton in England found that individuals who had chronic fatigue would actually produce alcohol from their sugar intake. He describes patients who would do a baseline blood-alcohol test, then take some glucose dissolved in a flavored drink, and measure the blood alcohol one or two hours later. The blood alcohol would be substantially higher if the person had a severe Candida problem.
...
Eaton found that by using this test he could monitor patients undergoing different treatments for chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia and found that 42 percent of patients improved just with sugar restriction alone. If he combined a low-sugar diet together with anti-fungal drugs, he had about a 78 percent success rate.

The most comprehensive study was that of a Dr. Jessop in California, who treated over one thousand people with chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia using a single anti-fungal drug, ketoconazole. Eighty-four percent of the patients improved. Of the 1,100 patients, 685 were on disability payments. After the treatment with anti-fungal treatment, only twelve remained on disability. It was an extremely effective treatment!

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It says people who eat soy or spinach as main dishes on a daily basis are pretty much going to have stones. But here are mitigating strategies that taken together with limiting oxalates can largely prevent stone formation:

The most effective way to get rid of oxalates is the use of calcium citrate. This supplement exerts a double potency action in eliminating oxalate. The calcium part of calcium citrate binds to the oxalate and causes it to precipitate out in the stool so it will not be absorbed. But part of the oxalate escapes. The citrate is a second line of defense, which competes directly with the oxalate for absorption.

For the treatment to be effective, the calcium citrate must be taken at the same time as the oxalate-containing food. If you have problems with any of conditions caused by oxalates—kidney stones, autism or vulvodynia— then taking calcium citrate with each meal can be very effective. If there is an adequate amount of calcium in the diet—if supplementing with calcium citrate, for example—it will combine with the oxalate in the GI tract, precipitate out in the stool, and then be eliminated in the stool.

The optimum dosage is approximately 300-350 mg calcium as calcium citrate for a total of 1000 mg (one gram) of calcium a day. If you’re taking this you don’t need additional sources of calcium. An even better approach would be to use magnesium citrate. The adult dosage is about 300-400 mg a day. Some practitioners recommend up to 1000 mg but many people report problems with diarrhea if they exceed 400 mg. Again, a divided dose would be best, taking the magnesium citrate with each meal.

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Lastly it says that the problem with oxalates is that they cause the urine to become a very low ph (acidic). Now I have the VDR mutation and I found that pretty much nothing would budge my urinary ph until science discovered that 400IU was nowhere near enough D. I found the single thing most affecting urinary ph is Vitamin D status (which governs ability to absorb calcium). I don't remember which way it makes the ph go. But I would STROGLY suggest a Vitamin D test. I maintain my D levels at 70 (not 50) and I was only at 25 before I started taking 50,000 D/week by prescription. You can buy ph test strips and check your ph. If I was a stone former I would.

 

[Fogbuster]

I have tried to search if Fluoxetine has been proven to be effective at helping mast cell issues in studies. Has it? As when I took it my "wired" symptom and "reaction" to foods etc was significantly reduced. Utterly convinced I have MC issues..

Thanks

 

[Sherlock]

I have tried to search if Fluoxetine has been proven to be effective at helping mast cell issues in studies. Has it? As when I took it my "wired" symptom and "reaction" to foods etc was significantly reduced. Utterly convinced I have MC issues..

Thanks

IIRC, Prozac was developed from Benedryl/diphenhydramine.

 

[Fogbuster]

IIRC, Prozac was developed from Benedryl/diphenhydramine.

Well this depressing to come across....

Exactly a year ago I wrote that comment and I'm back still looking for answers.

Can anyone from the UK recommend to me which shops I can get certain antihistamines to trial? Is it just H1 and H2 blockers I need to try to see I improve on? As mast cell stabilisers are prescription only I presume.

 

[rosie26]

I haven't read all this thread yet, it will take me weeks I think to retain some info here. I have to say though, I very hesitantly took 5mg of cetirizine yesterday afternoon to try an reduce some inflammation and after 2 hours had past I was happy that I hadn't experienced any side affects so I decided to take another 5mg of the 10mg tablet. Lol !!

It wasn't a good idea, I can tell you. By 6pm I could hardly keep my eyes open and by 7.30pm my eyes were red from trying to stay awake. I gave in at 8pm and went to bed, woke up at 4am from a gruesome murder dream, absolutely horrible, vividly graphic. I haven't remembered dreams for the last 2 years. I have to say, what a creepy tablet this is. I have only taken 5mg today and I really hope I don't have anymore of those kind of dreams with just 5mg.

 

[Timaca]

Well this depressing to come across....

Exactly a year ago I wrote that comment and I'm back still looking for answers.

Can anyone from the UK recommend to me which shops I can get certain antihistamines to trial? Is it just H1 and H2 blockers I need to try to see I improve on? As mast cell stabilisers are prescription only I presume.

I'm just jumping into this conversation, not reading the previous posts. Perhaps quercetin could be of help to you? If you google quercetin and mast cell you'll get some articles that may help you. I think the Low Histamine Chef also has info. Good luck. Here's the Google Search.

Best,

 

[rosie26]

I haven't read all this thread yet, it will take me weeks I think to retain some info here. I have to say though, I very hesitantly took 5mg of cetirizine yesterday afternoon to try an reduce some inflammation and after 2 hours had past I was happy that I hadn't experienced any side affects so I decided to take another 5mg of the 10mg tablet. Lol !!

It wasn't a good idea, I can tell you. By 6pm I could hardly keep my eyes open and by 7.30pm my eyes were red from trying to stay awake. I gave in at 8pm and went to bed, woke up at 4am from a gruesome murder dream, absolutely horrible, vividly graphic. I haven't remembered dreams for the last 2 years. I have to say, what a creepy tablet this is. I have only taken 5mg today and I really hope I don't have anymore of those kind of dreams with just 5mg.

I think I will stay with 5mg a day for now. I had a very pleasant sleep last night, no dreams, just sleep. I do have a very slight headache but it's not bothering me. I had it yesterday as well, it may disappear on 5mg. I think I can feel some reduction in inflammation - but not sure yet.

 

[hb8847]

Another interesting thread I'm resurrecting. Again if anyone has updated info on which medications worked for them I'd be very interested to hear about it.