Advice on Ciprofloxacin

[kjes22500]

I wanted to ask your opinion on this antibiotic,
my doctor want to put me somewhat empirically on Ciprofloxacin 250 mg for 10 days
suspecting a sibo

But i read many side effects of this drug including the symptoms i already have, so i am really worried
what do you think about this ??

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

I wanted to ask your opinion on this antibiotic,
my doctor want to put me somewhat empirically on Ciprofloxacin 250 mg for 10 days
suspecting a sibo

But i read many side effects of this drug including the symptoms i already have, so i am really worried
what do you think about this ??

I think it's overkill, and part of what may get killed is you, your gut biome (or whatever's left), and any hope of a happy future.

Why in God's name is he insisting on using an antibiotic that has more bad press than the Kardashians and Kanye combined? Did he give you his rationale?

I'm tagging in someone who I think will have more input. Several someones in fct .... @Pyrrhus , @ljimbo423 , @andyguitar (thanks guys !!!!)

 

[Viala]

I wanted to ask your opinion on this antibiotic,
my doctor want to put me somewhat empirically on Ciprofloxacin 250 mg for 10 days
suspecting a sibo

But i read many side effects of this drug including the symptoms i already have, so i am really worried
what do you think about this ??

There are a couple of threads here where people write it's not a good idea to take it, like in this thread:
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/threads/new-floxie-here.85261/

Better to try some safer type of antibiotic.

 

[kjes22500]

I think it's overkill, and part of what may get killed is you, your gut biome (or whatever's left), and any hope of a happy future.

Why in God's name is he insisting on using an antibiotic that has more bad press than the Kardashians and Kanye combined? Did he give you his rationale?

I'm tagging in someone who I think will have more input. Several someones in fct .... @Pyrrhus , @ljimbo423 , @andyguitar (thanks guys !!!!)

yeah i'm not responding to other antibiotics (amoxicilin, bactrim, tinidiazole..)

dunno what to do at this point, thanks for your opinion tho !

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

my doctor want to put me somewhat empirically on Ciprofloxacin 250 mg for 10 days
suspecting a sibo

So he suspects SIBO ... has he run any tests, like a basic breath test, which would measure the concentration of hydrogen and methane in your exhalation?

If nothing he's tried on you so far has worked, is it possible that you're not, in fact, dealing with SIBO?

The symptoms of SIBO (poor or no appetite, abdominal pain, nausea, bloating, extreme sense of fullness after eating anything, unintended weight loss, etc) are diffuse and can be indications of any number of other things. What does a differential diagnosis rule either in or out? Has he done one and discussed it with you, or is he just throwing shite at the wall to see what sticks?

If what he was recommending was just another ABX, it might be worth the gamble, but cipro is anything but .... if you haven't Googled the side effects yet, it might e a good idea to take a peak ....this is serious stuff and should probably be reserved for life or death situations where taking a gamble of that size and weight might be warranted ....

He's tried multiple ABX on you, one of them used mostly for tooth infections, and these alone cold cause an overgrowth of bad bacteria after killig off most or all of your good bacteria. It's possible that he's willing to risk your well-being by using this nuclear ABX response to cover his own posterior.

It's your body and no one can decide for you, but it might be a good idea to get more info, which hopefully can be provided by the more expert voices on this site ....

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

@kjes22500
Have you considered trying a specifically SIBO-targeted probiotic to try to normalize your gut microbiome to some extent before bringing out the really really big and potentially really damaging guns?

Do you have an idea of what caused your SIBO? Was it ME? A prior surgical intervention? Gastroparesis?

Did your Dr give you more than one course of the safer ABX, or did he just determine that if they failed to treat the SIBO they weren't worth repeating. Generally, it takes more than one course of ABX, and they should be given at close intervals ....

 

[Markus83]

Don't take it. In treatment for SIBO usually Rifaximin is used, but it's expensive.

 

[DrUniverse]

Seriously dont take it. Your body can get damaged very Bad for years. After 1.5 years im still fucked as hell.

 

[Shanti1]

I second what everyone has said above.
Rifaximin is the antibiotic of choice for hydrogen gas SIBO, when methane SIBO is present it is usually paired with another antibiotic, often as Neomycin, but it is important to know which type of SIBO you have if you have it at all. You could also trial a low FODMAP diet and see if there is an improvement.

 

[kjes22500]

I strongly recommend keeping a food/activity/symptoms journal, as detailed as you feel comfortable with. There have been lots of foods that made my symptoms worse, and some that reduced them. It's important to pay attention to changes in your symptoms, so that you can try to figure out what caused them.

Some foods will alter your gut and its microbiome, which may in turn affect your symptoms. Other foods contain chemicals (including natural nutrients) that may affect cell functions. Still others may trigger allergies or sensitivities.

Just as an example, I fairly recently discovered that proline (common non-essential amino acid) made my symptoms worse, and made me wake up frequently. Then I discovered that something in ruminant meat (likely CLAs) counteracted that sensitivity. It was a matter of noticing that some foods made me feel worse (or better), and then experimenting with different foods to figure out what was responsible.

It can be a lengthy process, but it can also make a significant different in your quality of life.

So he suspects SIBO ... has he run any tests, like a basic breath test, which would measure the concentration of hydrogen and methane in your exhalation?

If nothing he's tried on you so far has worked, is it possible that you're not, in fact, dealing with SIBO?

The symptoms of SIBO (poor or no appetite, abdominal pain, nausea, bloating, extreme sense of fullness after eating anything, unintended weight loss, etc) are diffuse and can be indications of any number of other things. What does a differential diagnosis rule either in or out? Has he done one and discussed it with you, or is he just throwing shite at the wall to see what sticks?

If what he was recommending was just another ABX, it might be worth the gamble, but cipro is anything but .... if you haven't Googled the side effects yet, it might e a good idea to take a peak ....this is serious stuff and should probably be reserved for life or death situations where taking a gamble of that size and weight might be warranted ....

He's tried multiple ABX on you, one of them used mostly for tooth infections, and these alone cold cause an overgrowth of bad bacteria after killig off most or all of your good bacteria. It's possible that he's willing to risk your well-being by using this nuclear ABX response to cover his own posterior.

It's your body and no one can decide for you, but it might be a good idea to get more info, which hopefully can be provided by the more expert voices on this site ....

@kjes22500
Have you considered trying a specifically SIBO-targeted probiotic to try to normalize your gut microbiome to some extent before bringing out the really really big and potentially really damaging guns?

Do you have an idea of what caused your SIBO? Was it ME? A prior surgical intervention? Gastroparesis?

Did your Dr give you more than one course of the safer ABX, or did he just determine that if they failed to treat the SIBO they weren't worth repeating. Generally, it takes more than one course of ABX, and they should be given at close intervals ....

Don't take it. In treatment for SIBO usually Rifaximin is used, but it's expensive.

Seriously dont take it. Your body can get damaged very Bad for years. After 1.5 years im still fucked as hell.

I second what everyone has said above.
Rifaximin is the antibiotic of choice for hydrogen gas SIBO, when methane SIBO is present it is usually paired with another antibiotic, often as Neomycin, but it is important to know which type of SIBO you have if you have it at all. You could also trial a low FODMAP diet and see if there is an improvement.

Thanks for your advices i think i won't take it

it's actually a doctor i see on video conference as i have a hard time to find a doctor in my country that believes in sibo leaky gut etc..
He believes i may have a sibo due to overuse of probiotics which indiced lactic acidosis (so i cannot take other probiotics to try to help)
i think it read somewhere that Rifaximin is useless against lactic acid producting bacterias


but yeah after hearing from you, i'm not sure i wanna risk it :/

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

He believes i may have a sibo due to overuse of probiotics which indiced lactic acidosis (so i cannot take other probiotics to try to help)

He seems to believe a lot of things based on .... nothing. Maybe on hunches, who knows. With no testing to support suppositions, just a willingness to give you one of the most toxic, damaging, and potentially lethal ABX known to man.

So so far, your gut microbiome has been damaged by the various ABX's the Dr's thrown at a possible systemic malfunction as yet unproven and untested, which may have been damaged prior to that by overuse of probiotics.

Maybe you could take a week or two to boost your water intake, which might help flush your system and allow your battered microbiome to start recovering or at least stop being hammered, investigate the use of prebiotic foods like beans and legumes (avoid fermented foods like sauerkraut and yogurt which will aggravate the problem) that could support the re-colonization of your commensal microbiome, and do some research.

You might want to boost your Vit C and magnesium, too.

Based on his performance and recommendations to date, I'd be very cautious about taking too much advice or treatment from your current Dr until you've done your own due diligence.

But i read many side effects of this drug including the symptoms i already have, so i am really worried
what do you think about this ??

I agree that the cipro will likely destroy wahatever is left of your gut and make recovery virtually impossible and extreemly difficult ....

It's sad, but an aptly named member here has said it best, @BeADocToGoTo1 ....

Good luck with all this, and I hope you find a solution. Keep posting to let us know how you're doing, yes?

And please think twice about ciprofloxacin ...

 

[geraldt52]

Not to argue for taking Cipro, but years ago, before all the bad press, I took a lot of Cipro over the course of many years, for persistent sinus infections. I never had a single side effect from it. Most doctors avoid it nowadays because of it being implicated in tendon ruptures, but many still use it for persistent sinus infections where other abxs have failed.

All of the more "modern" antibiotics have a list of side effects as long as your arm, but what are you going to do? I have trouble with most of them when I have to take them, but I think Cipro is unique regarding the tendon ruptures. I have zero knowledge about the wisdom of using Cipro for SIBO, but it is not usual to still see it used for persistent sinus infections...

 

[BrightCandle]

The doctor hasn't done the first simple and trivially inexpensive diagnostic test to determine the use of that drug is the right thing to do. Its just another throw random pills in patient and hope it works approach with a drug known to cause significant and permanent damage to mitochondria, which given your on this forum is not something you want less function in!

Hell no, your doctor is an idiot.

 

[Martin aka paused||M.E.]

Hell no, your doctor is an idiot.

+1
1) It’s an reserve antibiotic
2) it has a black box warning for good reason
3) it penetrates cells, tissues and nerves and is toxic
4) after six years I still have high amounts of it in my lymphocytes so your body is not able to detoxify it.

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

Along with mitochondrial damage and tendonitis, etc, cipro can also cause serious nerve damage which is often permanent, severe mood and "behaviour changes" which can occur after as little as one dose and which include severe anxiety, depression, restless leg syndrome, insomnia, hallucinations, and suicidal ideation, and low blood sugar to the extent of causing coma. It's also known to cause intestinal infections, hardly what @kjes22500 needs more of right now.

The FDA has issued repeated warnings to consumers regarding the considerable potential damages caused by fluoroquinolones like cipro for over a decade, but they're still one of the most heavily prescribed outpatient drugs in the U.S.

This is not a loaded cylinder I'd be willing to spin in a game of medical Russian roulette, but then, I'm not dealing with @kjes22500 's health issues, or the failure of those issues to be addressed by preliminary measures, soooooo ....

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

Not to argue for taking Cipro, but years ago, before all the bad press, I took a lot of Cipro over the course of many years, for persistent sinus infections. I never had a single side effect from it

Hmmmmm ... you could just be genetically lucky. Well, except for the continual sinus infections ....

And as for side effects, you're here at PR, aren't you ???? Could your ME be residual subtle neuro damage from all that Cipro, or could it have been a contributing factor?

 

[geraldt52]

And as for side effects, you're here at PR, aren't you ???? Could your ME be residual subtle neuro damage from all that Cipro, or could it have been a contributing factor?

No. All of the Cipro I took was substantially after I was diagnosised with CFS, and I was sick years earlier. In the early days of CFS, when Cipro was quite new, doctors were actually experimenting with it as a "treatment" for CFS...unsuccessfully of course.

As with all drugs, side effects are not universal. I'd personally try to avoid Cipro since there are so many other choices now, but no one should think that the potential side effects of Cipro, or any drug, are inevitable. Bacterial infections have to be treated, and it is becoming more and more difficult. As I said, the antibiotics I've taken recently have a list of potential side effects as long as your arm, but you can't leave a bacterial infection untreated.

 

[lenora]

yeah i'm not responding to other antibiotics (amoxicilin, bactrim, tinidiazole..)

dunno what to do at this point, thanks for your opinion tho !

Perhaps that's the reason this new antibiotic is being suggested. Talk to the pharmacist....not just someone working at the pharmaceutical counter. Pharmacists are a wealth of information and have plenty of good input. Sometimes I'll use them in lieu of a doctor....or a doctor may tell me to ask a pharmacist what he/she recommends under the circumstances. Doctors usually will prescribe the antibiotic most likely to clear the infection. If you have concerns, read about them and discuss them with your doctor...or even ask a pharmacist of the name of one given in lieu of what the doctor is suggesting. Just be gentle when asking. Yours, Lenora.

 

[lenora]

Yes, there are antibiotics that are used as a last resort only. Unfortunately @Martin was caught in a bad place, so care must be taken.

Unfortunately the tuberculosis resurgence has led to certain antibiotics that used to work being rendered useless. We should all take this seriously....and if a Dr. tells us we don't need an antibiotic (at a certain time) don't pressure him/her. I have problems with constant bronchitis (no, I've never smoked) and sometimes I need an antibiotic to clear it as it has gone into another infection and then there are times when I don't. Yes, it's a nuisance, but unfortunately the human population has brought this on all of us....and we're all responsible. Sadly, stronger antibiotics have to be used for once common infections. Good luck. Yours, Lenora.

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

Unfortunately @Martin was caught in a bad place, so care must be taken.

Unfortunately, @Martin aka paused||M.E. wasn't the only one. The history of wreckage that the floxacins have left in their wake is terrifying, at least in terms of deciding whether or not to use it for a stubborn, resistant infection.