Martial
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- Ventura, CA
@Martial Well, this all contradicts the 'starting slow' for minimal startup reactions! Does the 'paradoxical' part of the folate deficiency mean that by taking just small amounts of folate you can actually cause a deficiency? Is the only side effect of taking too much folate compared to b12 that it robs me of more b12? Is there any logic in taking a handful of folate for a day or two and then starting back up with the b12, at much higher doses than I'm currently taking?
The Jarrow's B-right does have folic acid in it. The Country Life dibencozide also has folic acid in it. Does this negate some of the b12 I'm absorbing or does it screw other things up? I'm not taking any NAC, glutathione, or whey. I'm also 99% gluten/grain/legume and dairy free, and the only sugars I have are in the forms of minimal fruit, honey, or wine. So, besides the additives in these supplements I mostly know exactly what I'm eating and have very... consistent, I guess I'd say, digestion.
I got the NOW Potassium Chloride because of a post that said the potassium gluconate lowers blood pressure, and I already have pretty low blood pressure (100/70 or 80). I don't know if the lightheadedness and dizziness is a part of that, but I definitely didn't want to be fainting all over the place, and wasn't sure by how much the gluconate might lower it further. In the first week I didn't notice any stomach upset from the potassium diluted in water... I think I've been upping my daily intake, though.
Do I need to scrap the Jarrow's B-right and change the Country Life to a different brand? I know I opted for the Jarrow's mb12 even though the Enzymatic Therapy was more highly recommended. I wanted to keep the initial costs down to even see if this protocol was possible.
I do hope one day I'll be an expert at this, like so many of you seem to be. So, thanks for the hand holding in the interim!
I am no expert as to the ways other people use the protocol and all of that either lol, as for starting low to avoid start up symptoms I feel in my experience it will just cause more issues because of induced paradox deficiency then any real benefit. This is of course just me, you don't have to follow my suggestions just stuff I have found more effective in my personal use and conversations with Fred. I do not remember him mentioning to start really slow anywhere before and with my conversations he always insisted against starting on super low dosing, The one thing I do know is if sulfur/sulfite is a problem, as well as having the B6 comt mutation you would need to fix this before starting the protocol, something to help with excess ammonia/sulfurs, also if one is over methylating then vitamin b6 bio available form (P5P) to convert excess methyl groups and Niacin 20mg three times a day for a few days to settle things down, along with molybdenum 300mg daily for excess sulfurs. Choline is another important nutrient to include as well. These were recommendations that Rob Lynch made on his site, apparently having too much methionine; from methylation without proper b vitamin balances can cause issues, most common for people with the b6 comt unless they are using the P5P form.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1359575 This discusses issues of too much methionine, it induces parkinsom like symptoms in studies used on rats, likewise too much homocysteine can be an issue and can cause heart failure, therefore it is imperative that one is sure they do things in a safe and professional matter.
FYI in my own case I have chronic lyme plus co infections so ammonia is an issue for me, I found methylation support has really helped me heal faster and to herx far less often and far less severe. I take certain herbs and supplements to help bind the excess ammonia from the lyme, among other bio toxins while continuing methyation support, and lyme treatment. It has become quite a balancing act to get the body into a state of harmony, clearing the infection, de toxing all the neuro toxins, and keeping methylation strong and functional. Once I got everything put together though the results have been amazing!
Toss the country life adenob12 and Jarrows B Right, you don't want any folic acid, it only causes problems you don't want to deal with. For a b complex use Thorne basic B Complex, this is what I use and will cover you well! For Adeno b12 use brandname Anabol Naturals, it comes in 10,000mcg so you can break the pills however you desire for different doses.
Excess folate can deplete the cobalt (B12) a bit, and using too little will push folate out of cells, you need enough folate to get the system going and avoid paradoxical folate deficiency, and enough cobalts to counter balance the rest. Folate and B12 are absorbed together, and dependent on each other for absorption at that. Therefore it makes sense to keep them in ranges that are at least somewhat close to each other. I would either start at the right doses, or drop the methylation completely, focus on clearing some sulfurs if necessary and letting things reset, and then approach when everything is set in the best fashion possible.
Well it sounds like the potassium chloride is working fine so I would stick with it or replace with glycinate if blood pressure is a concern, sounds like the diet is great as well! You are definitely doing everything well to get this all started and hopefully start healing soon enough!
Hope this helps!
p.s. one of the best things you can do for methylation is healing the gut! Your diet already supports this but be sure to clear any possible parasites, tapeworms, yeast, etc.. Correcting any possible gut dysbiosis. If a person has a bad gut even with perfect methylation support it will not work 100%, you want to get all those toxins out from a leaky gut and get balance going again. If you decide to stop methylation at any time this would be great to work on, or during methylation support either way!