Dr Jack Kruse's explanation of what CFS is

[keenly]

The equator is generally considered to be south if you're in the northern hemisphere, right?

Perhaps this would explain why I normally feel better in the bedroom - no one said how far to move towards the equator did they? (I thought it was because it was cooler in there in the afternoon, but what do I know).

But then again if I moved yet another 20 feet south, and climbed out the window to do so, I doubt I would feel better, what with the broken legs and all, coz I live on the third floor). But wouldn't falling 30-40 feet also move me closer to the equator? So I should feel better?

So....possibly there is a limit, a short limit, on how much this move towards the equator and feel better theory should be applied? Or maybe advice on horizontal movement only?

Daft I know but......

.....I think it might be an idea to specify which aspect of moving closer to the equator is considered helpful. Is it perhaps the small decrease in effective gravity, which could also be achieved by living at high altitude, is it perhaps the increase in the number of air and waterborne parasites, the increase in average temperature, the differences in diet, the sometimes radically increased number of alligators/crocodiles, the different plant spores, the increase in conflict, etc.

How is your life worse is some people think you need sunlight, earthing and to avoid nnEMF?
You think Jack Kruse talks nonsense, yet have not read a single blog.

Learn about SUNLIGHT and circadian rhythm. Learn about quantum yields.

Learn about Dr Doug Wallace. He is the leading expert on mitochondria.

Learn about how mitochondrial function, and what is the best environment for them to flourish.

Do you really think mitochondria can flourish under artificial blue light? Surround by nnEMF?

 

[sb4]

I think it might be an idea to specify which aspect of moving closer to the equator is considered helpful. Is it perhaps the small decrease in effective gravity (due to the rotational speed of the planet being high the closer to the equator you get), which could also be achieved by living at higher altitude, is it perhaps the increase in the number of air and waterborne parasites, the increase in average temperature, the differences in diet, the sometimes radically increased number of alligators/crocodiles, the different plant spores, the increase in conflict, etc.

The dominant factor proposed is sun light, obviously there is a ton more the further south you get. Although I think the other things you state will play a role. Problem is finding a country that you can move to that doesn't have high nnemf, unemployment, crime and other such problems. Then there is sustaining yourself whilst there.

 

[Wonko]

How is your life worse is some people think you need sunlight, earthing and to avoid nnEMF?
You think Jack Kruse talks nonsense, yet have not read a single blog.

Learn about SUNLIGHT and circadian rhythm. Learn about quantum yields.

Learn about Dr Doug Wallace. He is the leading expert on mitochondria.

Learn about how mitochondrial function, and what is the best environment for them to flourish.

Do you really think mitochondria can flourish under artificial blue light? Surround by nnEMF?

Can you please stop just copying/quoting me and dropping it into one of your old posts rather than into a new post - as I said previously, you've a post count of over 500, why don't you know how to post properly?

I have no problem with you thinking you need whatever - if it makes you feel better that's okay by me.

I have a problem, but not a big one as I'm rapidly getting bored by this, with people spouting pseudo-scientific gibberish, paying to have semi-mystical sounding garbage papers written up to act as adverts for overpriced rubbish, literally littering the internet with garbage doctors recommendations about it, and conning people.

I am not a plant, I do not use photosynthesis to derive energy from sunlight, so what have quantum yields got to do with the price of cheese?.

The only part of the body that could possibly be affected by grounding is the skin, it's not at all likely that it's not grounded for reasons I've already posted, and linked to.

The skin is a pretty good electrical insulator, and is easily grounded in normal life, it's very difficult, it takes real work with a lot of cats, balloons and nylon to stop it being at the same electrical potential as it's environment.

If it wasn't so good at keeping out electrical charges from the rest of the body then van de graaff generators would kill people, as would nylon carpets. It takes high frequency current or a lot of current to get through this barrier, which is why plugging yourself into the mains is considered evidence of poor decision making skills by most people. The earth is not AC.

EMFs are EMFs - any EMF above set levels could cause damage, regardless of its source e.g. sitting in a giant microwave could have short term negative health impacts. Calling something non native EMF is nonsense, EMF is EMF - it's the intensity and wavelength that is important, not the source.

Mitochondria don't give a rats.......about anything, they were here before multicellular life evolved and they will probably be here long after. They're much more capable of evolving to meet new environmental challenges than we are, we're the ones with a problem, not the mitochondria.

If you want protection against any possible effects of blue light (which mainly only causes damage to one particular group of cells in the eyes in old age) then eat free range eggs regularly, there's a protein (Lutein) in the yolk that "absorbs" it before it does any cellular damage.

Tired now - nighty night.

 

[sb4]

The only part of the body that could possibly be affected by grounding is the skin, it's not at all likely that it's not grounded for reasons I've already posted, and linked

I have been looking at studies that do not have financial interests involving grounding. What I discovered is, it's very hard to search for them as you get all sorts of things like "grounding electrical systems", the only ones I did find had half off them commissioned by a grounding company, which left me with a handful that I think are public studies, most done in poland by similar people.

"Coupling the human organism with the Earth directly or via a wire conductor changes the electric potential not only on the surface of the body but also inside it, changing the potential of electric environment of the human organism." (http://www.medical-hypotheses.com/article/S0306-9877(11)00364-1/fulltext)
I only have access to abstract however these people have done studies on this before without £££ interest. They say that electric potential is changed inside the body from grounding (maybe via acupuncture points?).

From my searching I have only found handful of public studies but all had noticeable effects from grounding. I understand the methodology could be kaput however I haven't found any that say no effect, if they are out there I would like to know. I think this means maybe we cannot dismiss it so easy, particularly as it has barely been studied to my knowledge.

I am not a plant, I do not use photosynthesis to derive energy from sunlight

I wouldn't be so sure of this "Here we show that mammalian mitochondria can also capture light and synthesize ATP when mixed with a light-capturing metabolite of chlorophyll. The same metabolite fed to the worm Caenorhabditis elegans leads to increase in ATP synthesis upon light exposure, along with an increase in life span. We further demonstrate the same potential to convert light into energy exists in mammals, as chlorophyll metabolites accumulate in mice, rats and swine when fed a chlorophyll-rich diet. Results suggest chlorophyll type molecules modulate mitochondrial ATP by catalyzing the reduction of coenzyme Q, a slow step in mitochondrial ATP synthesis. We propose that through consumption of plant chlorophyll pigments, animals, too, are able to derive energy directly from sunlight."
http://jcs.biologists.org/content/127/2/388.long

That study was funded by the navy.

Calling something non native EMF is nonsense

I have to give pushback on this, the sun is a native EMF, schuman resonance is native EMF, Cell Towers, Wifi, the electric grid is non-native EMF (ie man made).

If you want protection against any possible effects of blue light (which mainly only causes damage to one particular group of cells in the eyes in old age)

I think it causes damage to mito whenever it hits it. http://www.jbc.org/content/280/22/21061.full

 

[keenly]

Can you please stop just copying/quoting me and dropping it into one of your old posts rather than into a new post - as I said previously, you've a post count of over 500, why don't you know how to post properly?

I have no problem with you thinking you need whatever - if it makes you feel better that's okay by me.

I have a problem, but not a big one as I'm rapidly getting bored by this, with people spouting pseudo-scientific gibberish, paying to have semi-mystical sounding garbage papers written up to act as adverts for overpriced rubbish, literally littering the internet with garbage doctors recommendations about it, and conning people.

I am not a plant, I do not use photosynthesis to derive energy from sunlight, so what have quantum yields got to do with the price of cheese?.

The only part of the body that could possibly be affected by grounding is the skin, it's not at all likely that it's not grounded for reasons I've already posted, and linked to.

The skin is a pretty good electrical insulator, and is easily grounded in normal life, it's very difficult, it takes real work with a lot of cats, balloons and nylon to stop it being at the same electrical potential as it's environment.

If it wasn't so good at keeping out electrical charges from the rest of the body then van de graaff generators would kill people, as would nylon carpets. It takes high frequency current or a lot of current to get through this barrier, which is why plugging yourself into the mains is considered evidence of poor decision making skills by most people. The earth is not AC.

EMFs are EMFs - any EMF above set levels could cause damage, regardless of its source e.g. sitting in a giant microwave could have short term negative health impacts. Calling something non native EMF is nonsense, EMF is EMF - it's the intensity and wavelength that is important, not the source.

Mitochondria don't give a rats.......about anything, they were here before multicellular life evolved and they will probably be here long after. They're much more capable of evolving to meet new environmental challenges than we are, we're the ones with a problem, not the mitochondria.

If you want protection against any possible effects of blue light (which mainly only causes damage to one particular group of cells in the eyes in old age) then eat free range eggs regularly, there's a protein (Lutein) in the yolk that "absorbs" it before it does any cellular damage.

Tired now - nighty night.

Blue light interferes with Melatonin production. Look into that.

 

[Wonko]

I have been looking at studies that do not have financial interests involving grounding. What I discovered is, it's very hard to search for them as you get all sorts of things like "grounding electrical systems", the only ones I did find had half off them commissioned by a grounding company, which left me with a handful that I think are public studies, most done in poland by similar people.

"Coupling the human organism with the Earth directly or via a wire conductor changes the electric potential not only on the surface of the body but also inside it, changing the potential of electric environment of the human organism." (http://www.medical-hypotheses.com/article/S0306-9877(11)00364-1/fulltext)
I only have access to abstract however these people have done studies on this before without £££ interest. They say that electric potential is changed inside the body from grounding (maybe via acupuncture points?).

From my searching I have only found handful of public studies but all had noticeable effects from grounding. I understand the methodology could be kaput however I haven't found any that say no effect, if they are out there I would like to know. I think this means maybe we cannot dismiss it so easy, particularly as it has barely been studied to my knowledge.



I wouldn't be so sure of this "Here we show that mammalian mitochondria can also capture light and synthesize ATP when mixed with a light-capturing metabolite of chlorophyll. The same metabolite fed to the worm Caenorhabditis elegans leads to increase in ATP synthesis upon light exposure, along with an increase in life span. We further demonstrate the same potential to convert light into energy exists in mammals, as chlorophyll metabolites accumulate in mice, rats and swine when fed a chlorophyll-rich diet. Results suggest chlorophyll type molecules modulate mitochondrial ATP by catalyzing the reduction of coenzyme Q, a slow step in mitochondrial ATP synthesis. We propose that through consumption of plant chlorophyll pigments, animals, too, are able to derive energy directly from sunlight."
http://jcs.biologists.org/content/127/2/388.long

That study was funded by the navy.



I have to give pushback on this, the sun is a native EMF, schuman resonance is native EMF, Cell Towers, Wifi, the electric grid is non-native EMF (ie man made).



I think it causes damage to mito whenever it hits it. http://www.jbc.org/content/280/22/21061.full

http://skepdic.com/earthing.html

So what the navy found was that if you take an animal cell and inject the bits from a plant cell that aren't normally present then it functions as a plant cell. Wow, that's amazing, totally predictable tho. What it doesn't mean is that animal cells can use light to generate energy by photosynthesis, there's a name for things that can generate energy using photosynthesis - they are called, by and large, with some notable exceptions, plants - people are not plants.

If we were then starvation would be a lot rarer, especially in early human history, before phones/tablets or rubber soles, when people lived and worked mainly outdoors, with no mobile phone masts, power pylons and easy access to sunshine to apparently fulfill their basic energy needs.

You're wrong about EMF, the body doesn't know or care what it's source is, it only cares if it's helpful or damaging.

You are aware that epithelial cells they used in that study are in the eyes? That they are talking about non pigmented cells (skin is pigmented)? It also appears that early on they drop the use of the term blue light and use the term visible light instead.

But that's enough, it's clear that I'm not going to change anybodies mind, you're happy believing this stuff, it's your life, get on with it, I hope it works for you.

 

[Wonko]

Blue light interferes with Melatonin production. Look into that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrinsically_photosensitive_retinal_ganglion_cells

Light can reset circadian rhythms, all light, but the particular cells, in the eyes, the link above refers to are apparently specifically for this purpose and are particularly sensitive to blue light. The production of melatonin is tied to circadian rhythms so if they are reset so is the production of melatonin.

Nothing whatsoever to do with mitochondria, blue light penetrating the skin, EMF, grounding etc.

Do I get a banana?

 

[gettinbetter]

Update I started grounding while I lay in bed and
My preliminary results are it's easier to get to sleep which is usually difficult for me
I am also investigating if grounding helps me stay asleep go back to sleep after awakening and if it improves the quality of sleep
I am very happy with the results so far

 

[sb4]

So what the navy found was that if you take an animal cell and inject the bits from a plant cell that aren't normally present then it functions as a plant cell. Wow, that's amazing, totally predictable tho. What it doesn't mean is that animal cells can use light to generate energy by photosynthesis, there's a name for things that can generate energy using photosynthesis - they are called, by and large, with some notable exceptions, plants - people are not plants.

If we were then starvation would be a lot rarer, especially in early human history, before phones/tablets or rubber soles, when people lived and worked mainly outdoors, with no mobile phone masts, power pylons and easy access to sunshine to apparently fulfill their basic energy needs.

"The same metabolite fed to the worm Caenorhabditis elegans leads to increase in ATP synthesis upon light exposure.

We propose that through consumption of plant chlorophyll pigments, animals, too, are able to derive energy directly from sunlight."

It says through consumption, not injection. It makes sense that animal who live in high light environments, eat lots of plant foods, could have found a way to gain an advantage from it.

I don't think this is the only or even main way animals can make energy through light. I think building big exclusion zones and photolysis is the way.

No one is saying you do not need food, you absolutely do, you just need a bit less when exposed to adequate light.

You're wrong about EMF, the body doesn't know or care what it's source is, it only cares if it's helpful or damaging.

I never said otherwise.

You are aware that epithelial cells they used in that study are in the eyes? That they are talking about non pigmented cells (skin is pigmented)? It also appears that early on they drop the use of the term blue light and use the term visible light instead.

My bad, I thought it was skin cells. There are others that show this though https://www.researchgate.net/publication/315304100_Blue_light-induced_oxidative_stress_in_live_skin "Blue light induced oxidative stress prefferentially in the mitochondria, but green, red, IR did not".

But that's enough, it's clear that I'm not going to change anybodies mind, you're happy believing this stuff, it's your life, get on with it, I hope it works for you.

I'm not happy believing this stuff at all. I am interested in debating it with someone who disagrees to see how well it stacks up. Having said that I understand if you feel like you want to spend your time elsewhere, then you can, and I totally understand, it doesn't mean you have "lost" the argument or anything silly like that.

 

[shah78]

Still waiting for a response to this.




Still waiting for a response to this.







I'm not sure you understand the meaning of the term 'irony' because it actually applies to your responses. One minute you are claiming that JK knows more than almost every other doctor on the planet and that listening to his interviews will change everyone's lives, and that JK's dictates about eating fish and avoiding blue light ARE cures. Next minute you're claiming no one has a cure for anybody else. [B]Which is it?
[/B]



This goes back to a previous comment I made about how you are consistently attempting to redirect rather than genuinely engage with people. I think it is pretty clear that I am not responding in a hostile way. Your attempt to accuse me of being the hostile one is another of your classic redirection attempts. I have given you several concrete examples of your fanatical behavior. Saying that you're not fanatical doesn't make it so. Like I said twice already, you have every right to follow whatever guru you want.

I am very happy to discuss actual JK ideas with you, but nothing in your responses gives me the impression you WANT to have a legitimate discussion about the ideas. So unless you have something to add that isn't a redirection or an insult, I will be not responding to this thread because it's not worth my time.


***Just FYI, I followed JK recommendations 5 years ago, because I though he had some interesting things to say about them. Specifically what I did was Intermittent Fasting and Cold Thermogenesis. The Intermittent Fasting wreaked serious damage on my GI system, I had IBS-C which was in remission at the time, but the IF made all hell break lose. It took me many months to recover from it and to this day I have to eat small frequent meals because eating too much at once tends to cause problems. Never had problems with eating big meals before doing IF. The CT was completely neutral - it did not bring any of the benefits it supposedly should have, but it also did not create any detrimental problems. So I gave up on it after many months.

I'm sharing this with you to show that I am no stranger to JK and [B]I have already done most of what he recommends[/B]. It either made no difference, or at worst created problems. His ideas are not ALL bad (though to be fair, most are not his ideas to begin with) but they are not a cure for anything.

I will answer your first question. Simply put : Jack is not limiting his mitochondria dysfunction causes modern disease to just cfs/fb. His claim is that up to 90% of all modern disease is cause by disrupted mito function. He bases this on the work of Doug Wallace. Cardiovascular disease, diabetes, cancer , PD,AD, ALS , blah, blah, blah. You get what your individual genetics ,interacting with the EMF shitstorm and circadian disruption caused by no sunlight and artificial blue light and no grounding to the earth. We are the lucky ones!!! we only have CFS/FB. We don't have Parkinsons or cancer. Be grateful. This is much easier and faster to cure. Our mito's are not as severely compromised, ie heteroplasty is lower.

 

[Valentijn]

We are the lucky ones!!! we only have CFS/FB. We don't have Parkinsons or cancer. Be grateful.

That you for demonstrating exactly how fundamentally nasty and absurd Jack Kruse's explanations are. No one should be told to feel lucky or grateful for any disease.

Our mito's are not as severely compromised, ie heteroplasty is lower.

Could you please explain exactly what you mean by this, especially in relationship to supposed heteroplasty in "90% of all modern disease"? Because in this context, it makes no sense to me at all.

 

[sb4]

Could you please explain exactly what you mean by this, especially in relationship to supposed heteroplasty in "90% of all modern disease"? Because it this context, it makes no sense to me at all.

I'll give it a go. It's based on Doug Wallaces work. He found that around 15% of disease was due to genetic problems and 85% was due to mitochondrial heteroplasmy. Basically the more disfunctional mitochondria you have in a cell, the higher % heteroplasmy. Which cells have dysfunctional mitos determines what diseases you get.

It's long but it pretty much explains what he found.

 

[sb4]

Diabetes is caused by mitochondria heteroplasmy? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28951827

 

[rodgergrummidge]

Diabetes is caused by mitochondria heteroplasmy? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28951827

\
The paper cited above only mentions heteroplasmy once and the authors do not claim that diabetes is caused by heteroplasmy (I have pasted the paragraph containing the 1 mention of heteroplasty at the bottom, with heteroplasty highlighted). The authors of the above cited paper also do support any claim that 85% of diseases are caused by heteroplasty.

Current scientific understanding from genome-wide sequencing and SNP analysis indicate there are a wide variety of genetic associations that predispose for the development of type II diabetes. The paper you cite is consistent with this scientific view and does not propose mitochondrial heteroplasty as a cause.

There are some diseases which have been very well described in the literature where mutations in mitochondria DNA lead to diseases. For example, maternally acquired mutations in the genes encoding the PDH complex have well described phenotypes and there are many published accounts of such patients. But of course such inherited diseases are, by definition, not due to heteroplasty.

It is also important to point out that there are many diseases where mitochondrial involvement is well established such as cancer. But I am not aware of any clear evidence that such diseases are in any way related to heteroplasty. Again the paper cited above does not support such a proposal.

text below with the 1 mention of heteroplasty pasted from, Volume 6, Issue 9, September 2017, Pages 1040-1051

'In contrast to nuclear DNA, many copies of the mitochondrial DNA exist in the cell; each mitochondrion contains several nucleoids in which the DNA and the accessory proteins are packed [57]. This also explains why mitochondrial DNA is more prone to mutation; every time new mitochondria form, mitochondrial DNA is replicated, increasing the likelihood of a mistake in replication. That mitochondrial DNA in cells is variable is termed heteroplasmy [58]. Contrary to nuclear DNA, where mutation of one base in one DNA copy is sufficient for a profound impact, a certain level of heteroplasmy is required for a mitochondrial DNA mutation to become penetrant. Of note, mitochondria and consequently mitochondrial DNA are exclusively maternally derived. Hence, mitochondrial genetic diseases have a typical maternal pattern of inheritance.'

 

[sb4]

The paper cited above only mentions heteroplasmy once and the authors do not claim that diabetes is caused by heteroplasmy (I have pasted the paragraph containing the 1 mention of heteroplasty at the bottom, with heteroplasty highlighted). The authors of the above cited paper also do support any claim that 85% of diseases are caused by heteroplasty.

Yes I am aware that the authors of the paper aren't saying it's caused by mitochondrial heteroplasmy but it does support Wallaces claims, whether they say it or not.

Current scientific understanding from genome-wide sequencing and SNP analysis indicate there are a wide variety of genetic associations that predispose for the development of type II diabetes. The paper you cite is consistent with this scientific view and does not propose mitochondrial heteroplasty as a cause.

I have no doubt that there are genetic factors that mean someone is more likely to get diabetes but I think it is the minor player here. The major player being the health of your mito which depends on enviromental factors more than genetic (diet, sun, stresses, emf, virus, bacteria, temperature, etc). This is what I believe is ol' Dougies view as well. I think that future scientific undeerstanding will shift in this direction.

 

[shah78]

Thank you sp4. I met Jack in playa del Carmen. I told him I never read his blogs. I only test his protacols . Furtunately they all work. Reading all this shit is a complete waste of time. Papers,papers papers. Let Jack and Doug Wallace ruin their life and health reading papers. Or if you have to,read them from paper in the sunshine. Read Mann's magic mountain. They used to cure TB with sunshine/grounding. We are all victums of this dystopian novel. There are no pills.there is only the sun,the earth. This should be welcomed news to the sick people who have no pills being offered for a disease Western medicine does't even acknowledge. Can't wrap my mind around this resistance. It costs no money.nada! There are no side effects.

 

[shah78]

You just have to believe in evolution.we evolved in constant touch with the sun and the earth,eating local foods,with no artificial light,warmth,cooling ,or nnEMFs. It's just evolution. We didn't suddenly come down from the trees wearing rubbersoled sandles and sunglasses.

 

[shah78]

I have every crappy metylation snp possible. If born today I'd be in special education for sure. Huge ADHD or autism spectum. My genetic genie report looks like I am a Florida Seminole or Arizona State sun devil or usc Trojan alumnus.All red and yellow.!! However I was born before all the vaccine and computer bullshit. I am not easilied cured. I needed to go to the chicxulub crater and sit in or near it for 77 hours in week to finally recharge my mitos. But it worked. It fucking worked! If your snps are much more benign, and you halatype is suitable to you environment,you can accomplish the same in your own country .

 

[Wonko]

We didn't suddenly come down from the trees wearing rubbersoled sandles and sunglasses.

I did, really very suddenly indeed, it's just gravity, it happens.

 

[shah78]

The Yucatan couldn't provide enough "quantum yield "for my mitos in the winter. Duh! I did have the best winter of my life,but far from a cure. I needed to return at the summer solstice to heal my heteteroplasty rate. Still, if I go to the local market and I don't bring my goofy red glasses the artificial blue lights remind me very quickly of my past life. It take more than a few minutes once back in the sunshine to recover.