Dark Side of Vitamin A(retinol)

[uglevod]

Vitamin A supplementation may cause immune system to 'forget' past infections.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/06/150630121406.htm

Although vitamin A supplementation can have profound health benefits when someone is deficient, new evidence is emerging to show that vitamin A supplementation above and beyond normal levels may have negative health consequences. A new research report published in the July 2015 issue of the Journal of Leukocyte Biology may help to explain why too much vitamin A can be harmful. Too much vitamin A shuts down the body's trained immunity, opening the door to infections to which we would otherwise be immune. This study adds to the arguments that vitamin A supplementation should only be done with clear biological and clinical arguments. Furthermore, it also suggests that low vitamin A concentrations in certain situations may even be "normal."

"This study helps to explain the mechanisms of anti-inflammatory effects of vitamin A and by doing so opens the door to identifying novel ways to modulate the immune response and restore its function in situations in which it is dysregulated," said Mihai G. Netea, M.D., Ph.D., a researcher involved in the work from the Department of Internal Medicine at Radboud University Medical Center in Nijmegen, The Netherlands............

Moderator note: to continue reading the article, please go to the above link.

 

[uglevod]

https://medium.com/@joshg99/i-belie...the-primary-cause-of-auto-immune-d636d4e4b272

I believe a Canadian engineer named Grant Genereux has discovered the primary cause of auto-immune disease. He used his discovery to cure himself of eczema, kidney disease and some other problems simply by changing his diet. He tried to narrow down the possible list of chemicals that could be causing auto-immune disease by asking a simple question: of the chemicals that are we more exposed to now than in the past (and more in the 1st world than the 3rd world), which ones are known to cause symptoms that are similar to auto-immune diseases. He hit upon a very simple answer: retinol, otherwise known as vitamin A.
The fact that vitamin A is toxic has been known since the early 1900's. (Just google hypervitaminosis A.) And if you look into the established symptoms of acute and chronic hypervitaminosis A, they overlap almost exactly with all the symptoms of known auto-immune diseases. That is not controversial. The only thing controversial is that hypervitaminosis A is only thought to occur at extremeley high doses of vitamin A consumption — although there are plenty of studies that have shown that it can occur even at much lower doses than thought to be toxic. Since vitamin A is a fat-soluble vitamin, it accumulates in the body (mainly the liver and fat tissue). So even if you don’t consume a massive amount on any given day, it can easily build up over time.

(continue reading the article at the link provided above)

 

[uglevod]

Vitamin A Deficiency DOES NOT EXIST:

"Vitamin A deficiency" doesn't exist and has never existed. What was called "Vitamin A deficiency" has always been deficiencies of OTHER nutrients in the diet. Animal studies and human studies, up to 2 years long, have shown NO problems with extremely low Vitamin A intakes, proving it is NOT an essential nutrient. Grant Genereux has been on a absolutely minimal Vitamin A diet for SIX YEARS, getting his serum retinol down to 3 microg/dL (0.1 micromol/L) without any health problems, while watching his life-threatening kidney disease and horrible eczema DISAPPEAR.

Slideshow (with reference hyperlinks): https://docs.google.com/presentatio...j22wkw9_N4xc4g/edit#slide=id.ga853fb132c_1_22

PATHOGENESIS DUE TO VITAMINE DEFICIENCY IN THE RAT. (A. D. EMMETT & F. P. ALLEN)
“The rats were fed on definite dietary planes which would produce normal growth except for the lack of either vitamine A or B. From these groups, animals were selected which were representative. Care was taken to see that the animals were free from infection. Control tests were made on tissues from rats fed a complete diet.
[...]
In the rats which lacked vitamine A in their diet, there were no special outstanding pathological findings. In marked contrast with the lack of vitamine B the livers showed no fatty changes, the adrenals no hypertrophy, and the thymus no atrophy. The control animals proved to be normal as far as histological examination showed.”

Carotenoids (2013 review paper)
“None of the carotenoids are considered essential nutrients. No carotenoid is directly involved in a vital metabolic pathway, nor has the relative absence of a carotenoid been linked exclusively to the induction of a specific deficiency or chronic disease (hence, the lack of FDA-approved “health claims”).”

VITAMIN A DEFICIENCY AND THE REQUIREMENTS OF HUMAN ADULTS
“Twenty-three 'conscientious objectors', twenty men and three women, volunteered to live on a diet designed to be deficient in these substances but complete in every other respect. The absence of vitamin A and its precursors was confirmed spectrophotometrically and biologically. [...] The disappearance of carotene from the blood plasma of the deprived volunteers confirmed the absence of these substances from the diet.
[...]
With efficiency for dark adaptation and plasma values for vitamin A as criteria, none of the sixteen deprived subjects became depleted within a year.”

Vitamin A and epilepsy: a dietary contretemps.
“In order to investigate further a possible connection between vitamin A and epilepsy, Sharman (30) then studied 8 epileptic patients given a vitamin A-depleted diet for 2 years. No cases of night blindness were observed. When their plasma retinol level had reached 230 IU/L, they were given a vitamin A supplement. Although the patients reported fewer fits during the depletion period, there was no increase in the fits during repletion. The author (30) called his experiment a “dietary contretemps.””

VITAMIN A REQUIREMENT OF HUMAN ADULTS: An Experimental Study of Vitamin A Deprivation in Man.
“The great majority of clinical examinations revealed no significant differences between the deprived and a non-deprived group, or in the same person before and after deprivation of vitamin A.
[...]
In several of the subjects follicular hyperkeratosis was present at the start and varied during the experiment, but the variations bore no relation to the vitamin A intake.”

Vitamin A deficiency in Latin America and the Caribbean: an overview. (1998)
“Vitamin A deficiency (VAD) has been known to exist in Latin America and the Caribbean since the mid-1960s; [...] there was little interest in controlling it because of the low frequency of clinical findings.”
“In most countries of the Region, however, VAD was not considered a problem of public health significance because ocular [EYE] lesions leading to permanent blindness were not frequently observed despite prevalences of low serum retinol [Vitamin A] hovering near the cutoff of 15% then recommended by WHO.”
“On the other hand, ocular [EYE] signs attributable to clinical VAD were extremely rare in the 1980s and they have not been assessed more recently.”

Retinol deficiency and urinary stone disease: clinical evidence is missing.
“It was found that 68% of subjects in lower socioeconomic group had serum retinol levels between 10 and 19 ug%, and 4% below 10 ug%, but none of them showed any symptoms of retinol deficiency.”
[...]
Me, Dr. Garrett Smith [..]:
Had psoriasis, mid-back pain, and urinary/prostate issues
Minimized VA intake for 2+ years to this point
Psoriasis, mid-back pain, urinary/prostate issues gone, health improved
Grant and I are currently aware of approximately 1000+ people restricting their VA intake in an effort to fully correct their chronic disease states.
We are “putting our money where our mouth is”, and we are regularly seeing people improve their supposedly “chronic and incurable health conditions

Bonus, from the same Doc:

Why Vitamin D Supplements Are Extremely Toxic:

 

[pamojja]

[...]
Me, Dr. Garrett Smith [..]:
Had psoriasis, mid-back pain, and urinary/prostate issues
Minimized VA intake for 2+ years to this point
Psoriasis, mid-back pain, urinary/prostate issues gone, health improved

Made the opposite experience. Had started Linus Pauling's therapy against cardiovascolar disease (and a walking disabiltiy thereof) 12 years ago. Beside recommending high dose Ascorbic acid and Lysine, he recommended it in the context of comprehensive supplementation and lifestyle changes. The only item he recommends I've been more cautious with was vitamin A at 25.000 IU daily. Though always starting low dose with anything and increasing gradually only, with vitamin A it took me 9 years to almost reach his dose (retinol 425-831; RBP 30-60 lab normal ranges):

year: vitA  RBP  A/RBC intake(avg. for previous 3 years)

      µg/l  mg/l   ≥7   µg/d

2012:  501   44   11.4   1,3

2015:  597   53   11.4   5,4

2018:  705   47   14.9   6,7

2020:  795   63   12.7   6,2

Serum retinol levels alledgedly increase more rapitdly, before liver stores follow: https://www.nap.edu/read/10026/chapter/6?term=night+blindness#99.

When dietary vitamin A is provided to vitamin A-deficient children, plasma retinol concentration increases rapidly, even before liver stores are restored (Devadas et al., 1978; Jayarajan et al., 1980). Thus, a low concentration of plasma retinol may indicate inadequacy of vitamin A status, although median or mean concentrations for plasma retinol may not be well correlated with valid indicators of vitamin A status.

In my case infrequent psoriasis ceased completely once reacing above 20.000 IU of supplemented vitamin A daily (=6mg). Same story with vitamin D:

In below table I added max. pain-free walking distance (PFWD; in kms at about 4/hr), Erythrocyte sedimentation rate (ESR), C-reactive Protein (CRP), and Ankle Brachial Index (ABI; normal ≥9). Vitamin D intake (mcg), serum level (25-OH-D), whole-body sun-exposure (hrs/year), and total testosterone (TT) for their very strong correlation. The very high inflammation in '06, 2 years before the PAD diagnosis, was caused by a Myopericarditis.

year:   PFWD   ESR    CRP   ABI    mcg    hrs    25-D    TT    CIMT

2006:    -     74    96      -       -      -      -      -     -
  -      -      -     -      -       -      -      -      -     -
2008:    0.3    5     -     0.7      -      -      -      -     -
2009:    1      8     1.6    -      50      -      -      -     -
2010:    4     15.5   3.4    -     160     60     63     399    -
2011:    6      4     2.4   0.5    240     60     43     220    -
2012:    3      -     5.2   0.8    300     60     62     262    1.3 mm
2013:    3.5   68.5   3.7    -     200    220     84     320    -
2014:    5      9     4.8   0.7    190    220     50     340    1.9 mm
2015:    8     11.5   2.5    -     210    220     78     351    -
2016:    9      8     1.1   0.7    170    240     72     468    1.8 mm
2017:    9     18     1.7    -     220    340    101     631    -
2018:    -     32     5.1   0.9    160    340     93     681    1.0 mm
2019:    -     18.5   2      -     190    340     85     368    -

With the highest vitamin 25(OH)D3 serum level in 2017 I experienced remission from my walking disabilty, in 2019 also from remaining ME/CFS symptoms (mainl constant PEMs, since I worked part-time). With that also lower-back pains gone, before always part of my PEMs.

 

[pamojja]

My experience makes me very suspicious of studies of isolated nutrients (in vivo and humans), not considering nutrients are taken as vast combinations in real live, along with life-style choices.

A surprising outcome of the TACT trial:

Effect of high-dose oral multivitamins and minerals in participants not treated with statins in the randomized Trial to Assess Chelation Therapy (TACT)

Intervention
Daily high-dose oral multivitamins and multiminerals (6 tablets, active or placebo).

Results
The primary end point occurred in 137 nonstatin participants (30%), of which 51 (23%) of 224 were in the active group and 86 (36%) of 236 were taking placebo (hazard ratio, 0.62; 95% confidence interval, 0.44-0.87; P = .006). Results in the key TACT secondary end point, a combination of cardiovascular mortality, stroke, or recurrent MI, was consistent in favoring the active vitamin group (hazard ratio, 0.46; 95% confidence interval, 0.28-0.75; P = .002). Multiple end point analyses were consistent with these results.

After 55 months there was a 9% absolute risk decrease in mortality compared to placebo!

Though for some nutrients they used a crazy dose (like 20mg of Manganese), the fat solubles for example were:

25,000 IU Vitamin A
100 IU Vitamin D3
400 IU Vitamin E
60 μg Vitamin K1

So the vitamin D and K amounts again almost not worth mentioning. Still such encouraging results, if for once they stop testing supplemented nutrients in isolation, but as they are actualy taken in combinations.

 

[Wishful]

by adopting a carnivore diet. They haven’t realized it yet, but the reason their diet works is that it’s a low vitamin A diet.

As long as you skip the liver.

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

My experience makes me very suspicious of studies of isolated nutrients (in vivo and humans), not considering nutrients are taken as vast combinations in real live, along with life-style choices.

Totally, totally agree, and have noted that in every article debunking or demonizing some vitamin or supp or other, it's always in isolation, or in a form that either doesnt exist in nature, or only in small or tiny amounts.

 

[linusbert]

Vitamin A Deficiency DOES NOT EXIST:

"Vitamin A deficiency" doesn't exist and has never existed. What was called "Vitamin A deficiency" has always been deficiencies of OTHER nutrients in the diet. Animal studies and human studies, up to 2 years long, have shown NO problems with extremely low Vitamin A intakes, proving it is NOT an essential nutrient. Grant Genereux has been on a absolutely minimal Vitamin A diet for SIX YEARS, getting his serum retinol down to 3 microg/dL (0.1 micromol/L) without any health problems, while watching his life-threatening kidney disease and horrible eczema DISAPPEAR.

Slideshow (with reference hyperlinks): https://docs.google.com/presentatio...j22wkw9_N4xc4g/edit#slide=id.ga853fb132c_1_22

PATHOGENESIS DUE TO VITAMINE DEFICIENCY IN THE RAT. (A. D. EMMETT & F. P. ALLEN)
“The rats were fed on definite dietary planes which would produce normal growth except for the lack of either vitamine A or B. From these groups, animals were selected which were representative. Care was taken to see that the animals were free from infection. Control tests were made on tissues from rats fed a complete diet.
[...]
In the rats which lacked vitamine A in their diet, there were no special outstanding pathological findings. In marked contrast with the lack of vitamine B the livers showed no fatty changes, the adrenals no hypertrophy, and the thymus no atrophy. The control animals proved to be normal as far as histological examination showed.”

Carotenoids (2013 review paper)
“None of the carotenoids are considered essential nutrients. No carotenoid is directly involved in a vital metabolic pathway, nor has the relative absence of a carotenoid been linked exclusively to the induction of a specific deficiency or chronic disease (hence, the lack of FDA-approved “health claims”).”

VITAMIN A DEFICIENCY AND THE REQUIREMENTS OF HUMAN ADULTS
“Twenty-three 'conscientious objectors', twenty men and three women, volunteered to live on a diet designed to be deficient in these substances but complete in every other respect. The absence of vitamin A and its precursors was confirmed spectrophotometrically and biologically. [...] The disappearance of carotene from the blood plasma of the deprived volunteers confirmed the absence of these substances from the diet.
[...]
With efficiency for dark adaptation and plasma values for vitamin A as criteria, none of the sixteen deprived subjects became depleted within a year.”

Vitamin A and epilepsy: a dietary contretemps.
“In order to investigate further a possible connection between vitamin A and epilepsy, Sharman (30) then studied 8 epileptic patients given a vitamin A-depleted diet for 2 years. No cases of night blindness were observed. When their plasma retinol level had reached 230 IU/L, they were given a vitamin A supplement. Although the patients reported fewer fits during the depletion period, there was no increase in the fits during repletion. The author (30) called his experiment a “dietary contretemps.””

VITAMIN A REQUIREMENT OF HUMAN ADULTS: An Experimental Study of Vitamin A Deprivation in Man.
“The great majority of clinical examinations revealed no significant differences between the deprived and a non-deprived group, or in the same person before and after deprivation of vitamin A.
[...]
In several of the subjects follicular hyperkeratosis was present at the start and varied during the experiment, but the variations bore no relation to the vitamin A intake.”

Vitamin A deficiency in Latin America and the Caribbean: an overview. (1998)
“Vitamin A deficiency (VAD) has been known to exist in Latin America and the Caribbean since the mid-1960s; [...] there was little interest in controlling it because of the low frequency of clinical findings.”
“In most countries of the Region, however, VAD was not considered a problem of public health significance because ocular [EYE] lesions leading to permanent blindness were not frequently observed despite prevalences of low serum retinol [Vitamin A] hovering near the cutoff of 15% then recommended by WHO.”
“On the other hand, ocular [EYE] signs attributable to clinical VAD were extremely rare in the 1980s and they have not been assessed more recently.”

Retinol deficiency and urinary stone disease: clinical evidence is missing.
“It was found that 68% of subjects in lower socioeconomic group had serum retinol levels between 10 and 19 ug%, and 4% below 10 ug%, but none of them showed any symptoms of retinol deficiency.”
[...]
Me, Dr. Garrett Smith [..]:
Had psoriasis, mid-back pain, and urinary/prostate issues
Minimized VA intake for 2+ years to this point
Psoriasis, mid-back pain, urinary/prostate issues gone, health improved
Grant and I are currently aware of approximately 1000+ people restricting their VA intake in an effort to fully correct their chronic disease states.
We are “putting our money where our mouth is”, and we are regularly seeing people improve their supposedly “chronic and incurable health conditions

Bonus, from the same Doc:

Why Vitamin D Supplements Are Extremely Toxic:

just read this and saw his video, and i got sceptical.
1. he disabled comments , why would you disable scientific discourse when you bring up a hypothesis. makes no sense.

2. he said people removed vitamin D but still got the calcium problems, because they didnt get rid of vitamin A.
this makes me suspect that the problem is a imbalance and neither of D or A beeing a culprit.

and this is something some vitamin D experts are saying for quite some time. that you need Vitamin D and vitamin A and some others together because they prevent each others toxicity.
and this interaction you can see a lot throughout micronutrition. thiamin/potassium are another example. having both deficient is better than having only one deficient. this could be even dangerous taking one and not the other if really deficient.

there is even a study on pubmed saying that giving one isolated thing in a otherwise nutritional deprived human (or did they test on rats? can't find the study anymore -.-) can make really sick.

therefore i strongly believe that the culprit isnt neither A nor D but rather the imbalance. as others are saying, you need everything and the right balance.

Totally, totally agree, and have noted that in every article debunking or demonizing some vitamin or supp or other, it's always in isolation, or in a form that either doesnt exist in nature, or only in small or tiny amounts.

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

therefore i strongly believe that the culprit isnt neither A nor D but rather the imbalance. as others are saying, you need everything and the right balance.

I agree, tho it gets pretty daunting to try to keep up with everything that intersects with everything else.

I try to keep it simple, maintaining a balance between all fat soluble vits which I take judiciously, since they tnd to linger in your system, specificlly, your fatty tissue, and balancing Vit D and calcium with MK-7 ... simple stuff like that ... and nothing in huge amounts ..... and an excellent multi-vit as the foundation for all the rest.

just read this and saw his video, and i got sceptical.
1. he disabled comments , why would you disable scientific discourse when you bring up a hypothesis. makes no sense.

Oh, wow !!! Totally agree. Most scientists and researchers, while jealous of their work, are also anxious to test drive it with their peers, and disabling comments just seems .... bizarre ....

2. he said people removed vitamin D but still got the calcium problems, because they didnt get rid of vitamin A.
this makes me suspect that the problem is a imbalance and neither of D or A beeing a culprit.

Vit D releases calcium into your bloodstream, and without Vit K, specifically MK-7, or to a lesser extent M-4 (fewer studies), that calcium can be at best useless, and at worse, an artery, soft tissue, and joint clogger. I would imagine the problems with calcium had more to do with the lack of Vit K than either a lack or an exess of D or A .....

 

[Judee]

So my Mom had COPD and fish oil Vitamin A was something that helped her with that. She would ask me for some anytime her lungs were bothering her.

I take it now too once in a while when my lungs feel constricted. It really does help a lot and I get relief within a short time after taking it but it has to be that form of vitamin A.

Unfortunately, it's getting harder to find Vitamin A supplements that use only that instead of the harder to process version of Retinyl Palmitate. NOW used to make it that way but lately I can only find this one: https://www.amazon.com/Bluebonnet-N...9&sprefix=bluebonnet+vitamin+a,aps,132&sr=8-5

I don't take it often...like I said just when my lungs are bothering me but still I ordered a bottle of that recently just in case they change their formula too. (I keep supplements like probiotics and those made from oil or glandulars in my refrigerator to prolong their shelf life.)

Anyway, I admit I just read parts of this thread (brain protesting reading more) but wanted to add that.

Here's another long page that I was only able to skim a tiny bit but I noticed it does talk about an anti-Vitamin A campaign. Maybe that paper is from one of them. ?? https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition/vitamin-a-saga/#gsc.tab=0

 

[linusbert]

So my Mom had COPD and fish oil Vitamin A was something that helped her with that. She would ask me for some anytime her lungs were bothering her.

I take it now too once in a while when my lungs feel constricted. It really does help a lot and I get relief within a short time after taking it but it has to be that form of vitamin A.

Unfortunately, it's getting harder to find Vitamin A supplements that use only that instead of the harder to process version of Retinyl Palmitate. NOW used to make it that way but lately I can only find this one: https://www.amazon.com/Bluebonnet-Nutrition-Vitamin-000-Count/dp/B000Z92ZEK/ref=sr_1_5?crid=3LEIDW7CMFOG5&keywords=bluebonnet+vitamin+a&qid=1672003179&sprefix=bluebonnet+vitamin+a,aps,132&sr=8-5

I don't take it often...like I said just when my lungs are bothering me but still I ordered a bottle of that recently just in case they change their formula too. (I keep supplements like probiotics and those made from oil or glandulars in my refrigerator to prolong their shelf life.)

Anyway, I admit I just read parts of this thread (brain protesting reading more) but wanted to add that.

Here's another long page that I was only able to skim a tiny bit but I noticed it does talk about an anti-Vitamin A campaign. Maybe that paper is from one of them. ?? https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition/vitamin-a-saga/#gsc.tab=0

i have the same effects with just vitamin D. usually after a highdose of vitamin D like 5k+ i get relief for asthma and allergies the next day for like 1-2 weeks.

i think what you want is not-fortified pure natural cod liver oil.
in germany its called "Lebertran" , and i recently tried the one from lamotte which i thought was ok.
it has 10k pure natural retinol and 1k pure natural vitamin D per daily dosage, thats like one big spoon.

its really hard to find pure cod liver oil without any artificial vitamin A or vitamin D. they just mix the vitamins in later which is not what i want as the natural forms work different/better. often i am even intolerant to the artificials.

 

[brenda]

It seems that the emphasis on here has been on taking too much of a vitamin A supplement. However, there is a great storm in alternative health circles, to recognise just how big the problem is, not just with supplementing it but from the amount in food and the variation in people of the ability to use it up without it being stored in the liver and causing chaos to the system.

After reading up on the evidence and looking at my own health, in which my liver is not in a great state through massive mercury and pesticide poisoning events, I have decided, along with a growing crowd of others with autoimmunity, to reduce Vit A in my diet and who are seeing results.

I see that one of my problems - dry eye, which has been much worse in the past is more than likely a symptom of Hypervitaminosis A and other problems I have had - all on the list of symptoms, and have spent quite some time researching it. There is a lot of info on the Ray Peat forum.

In an effort to be healthier I have inadvertently taken in far too much by way of liver, sweet potatoes, kale, carrots. but never supplements. We all differ on how much retinol our bodies can deal with.

https://paoladziwetzki.com/how-common-is-vitamin-a-poisoning/

The researchers are often not medical professionals which is good as they are not serving the system, but are investigating trials and showing what they say.

I would urge people to look deeper into this as it is set to take the world by storm according to the ones who have studied it. The low vitamin A diet must not be rushed into and I have just cut out the high ones for now and will gradually cut back. The liver has to get rid of its stores and it can take a long time.

 

[pamojja]

In my case infrequent psoriasis ceased completely once reacing above 20.000 IU of supplemented vitamin A daily (=6mg). Same story with vitamin D:

Also retinal migraine flare-ups, I didn't mention in this thread.

Serum retinol levels alledgedly increase more rapitdly, before liver stores follow: https://www.nap.edu/read/10026/chapter/6?term=night+blindness#99.

Since 2021 (corona) haven't done blood-tests anymore. Therefore, due to serum levels already having been at the upper-end of normal, I decreased Retinol intake to 2 mg/d. Now for a 6-week vacation I sharply cut out many supplements, so no Retinol at all. Just yesterday - beginning of 6th week - I had my first retinal migraine flare up for 8 years.

 

[cfs since 1998]

New research suggests that vitamin A inhibits trained immunity, leading to tolerance of the innate immune cells upon stimulation with mitogens, antigens

Wouldn't this be a good thing for people with autoimmune diseases?

 

[brenda]

It's about 7 weeks now since I cut back on Vit A, which was liver, eggs and goat cheese along with high carotene from sweet potatoes, and other veg. I still eat one food with high Vit A as my diet is so restricted now as I had to give up all grains and dairy , that is tinned sardines in small servings. on a grain free seed bread.

I have had some very rough days of extreme sleepiness which could be Vit A dumping or I have discovered, it may be Vit B12 deficiency (taking it now). So I will continue. A lot of folk on the Ray Peat forum are doing it, some for years now and reporting the disappearance of many illnesses.

In an effort to eat healthy I may have given my weak liver too much to cope with I think my brain is working better

 

[linusbert]

It's about 7 weeks now since I cut back on Vit A, which was liver, eggs and goat cheese along with high carotene from sweet potatoes, and other veg. I still eat one food with high Vit A as my diet is so restricted now as I had to give up all grains and dairy , that is tinned sardines in small servings. on a grain free seed bread.

I have had some very rough days of extreme sleepiness which could be Vit A dumping or I have discovered, it may be Vit B12 deficiency (taking it now). So I will continue. A lot of folk on the Ray Peat forum are doing it, some for years now and reporting the disappearance of many illnesses.

In an effort to eat healthy I may have given my weak liver too much to cope with I think my brain is working better

i hear of those theories. there are a lot, also poisoning of vitamin b6. i dont know how they make sense.
usually these vitamins are rare in western foods anyways. to get retinol in you need to eat stuff most people do not eat like lots of eggs and lot of liver. beta carotene is irrelevant.
maybe there is a genetic anomaly which leads to accumulation of those, like copper and iron storage diseases.

yet for some funny reason, vitamin A is one of the only nutritions in my blood which is high normal. everything is low normal.

 

[brenda]

Yes I have a problem with copper and iron, due to the many environmental toxic exposures in my life starting in my first year with mercury. My liver must be wrecked but also there is a genetic problem with detoxing. The state of the liver affects the amount of Vit A you can cope with. Perhaps it is not getting into your cells and just hangs around causing damage.

People will increasingly have this problem with the toxins in everything. I found out with a hair mineral analysis just how bad things are as my hair has stopped pushing these toxins out.

 

[linusbert]

if you want to dump retinol from the liver, take high amount of vitamin D.., its a usually not wanted side effect.

 

[brenda]

if you want to dump retinol from the liver, take high amount of vitamin D.., its a usually not wanted side effect.

Thanks but I won't take supplemental Vit D but use a sun lamp.

 

[linusbert]

not sure it works with natural vitamin D to annihilate the retinol liver stores.