Can't sleep

[RestingInHim]

Is anybody there? It's after 3:am & I can't sleep. I took my sleep meds...but now I'm wondering if one didn't make it into my mouth. Ever been here...done this?

Not frazzled..yet, but not resting too well

forgive me if this thread is lame....it is 3:16 am!

 

[Katie]

It's 11.22am here in Blighty! I've been convinced that I've taken my pills before and laid there for hours waiting for sleep to come only to find them on the floor in the bathroom. Do you have an American version of Horlicks (a malt drink)? Or maybe have a warm bath to relax your body again to get it into sleep mode?

I've seen 3am a lot recently, it's amazing how awake you feel at that hour!

 

[Victoria]

Thanks, RestingInHim,

It's 11.00pm Tuesday night here & you've just reminded me I forgot to take MY sleep pill.

My older brother brought over a new supportive office chair for me & I got sidetracked this evening.

And since the computer (& forum) are playing up tonight, I'll get off the computer, go & take that pill & go to bed.

So I'll end my lame post & go to bed.....

(have I said "go to bed" twice now - must be getting brain fog. Big yawn.....).

So goodnight & hope you sleep better for the rest of the night.....

PS And on going out to the kitchen, I discovered I forgot to wash the dinner dishes....Oh well, bed calls.

 

[gracenote]

Resting,

It's 4:46 a.m. I'd been struggling to stay asleep for over an hour and just decided to get up and do something while letting a half dose of my sleep meds kick in. I actually wake up less stiff and achy in the mornings when I get up and move around during the night. Hope you get some rest.

 

[RestingInHim]

sleepless at the beach...

Thanks Katie, Victoria, and gracenote!! sorry you all have a hard time sleeping...but good to know i'm not alone. what sleep meds are you on?

Gracenote, so you take a 1/2 dose later if regular dose doesn't kick in? i'm assuming you've found that works well?

Katie, i'll look up the Horlicks. do you take it along wth meds?

BTW....slept the rest of the night and slept well the next night :sleepy:...however woke up sideways on the bed (was away without my hubby, so was sleeping alone). Wierd!! :In bed:

Thanks again for your your mid-night (at least for Victoria and me ) words of encouragement.

resting...much better!! Yea!! :victory:

 

[RestingInHim]

at least for Victoria and me

oops...that would by gracenote!

 

[gracenote]

Gracenote, so you take a 1/2 dose later if regular dose doesn't kick in? i'm assuming you've found that works well?

I've been taking Ambien for many, many years. It usually now only gives me 3 to 4 hours and then I wake up. Most of the time I can't get back to sleep for a couple of hours no matter what I do, or my sleep quality is so poor that it's not worth it. About a year ago, I starting taking another 1/4 to 1/2 of an Ambien when I'd wake. I chew it and it works pretty fast that way. Sometimes I will purposefully wander around my house for awhile to get the kinks out of my body and my brain before I'm ready to go back to sleep. (I'll occasionally check the forum like I did the other night!) In the last months, I've woken up again after another 3 to 4 hours, so I've stared taking another 1/4 so I can get another 2 hours of sleep. It is working pretty well I feel like I'm getting my needed sleep (though of course I can't say I don't feel tired can we ever with this disease?). I feel sane instead of desperately fatigued.

I keep trying to find things that will help me take less Ambien as I don't like being so dependent on it. Somethings seem to help for a night or two and then they don't really. Recently I've tried Magnesium Glycinate, Phenibut and Xanax. Xanax worked but it seems to depress my whole system after a couple of nights, and besides, it's another drug.

It's important to me and my sanity to keep myself on as normal a schedule as possible go to sleep around the same time, get up around the same time ("around" being the operative word). Sleepless nights throw everything off for a long time. Taking drugs is the lesser evil.

So . . . I'm still working on it.

Hope I answered your question Resting. I hope you sleep well tonight.

 

[RestingInHim]

sigh...

just composed way long reply then somehow lost it. ugh!! i'll try to replicate it...the important points, at least.

i began taking ambien 16 years ago. i believe the sleep it provided was the reason i experienced a remission for several years, which, tho not symptom free, enabled me to continue to teach in-depth Bible studies along with training and leading the leadership of these studies...until i experienced a relapse about 3 years ago, which led to my retirement after 30 years of serving in BSF, Intl.

about 3 months ago i began to have difficulty falling asleep. staying asleep hasn't been an issue for me. then, i would occasionally take an additional 5mgs when it began to not work at the 10mgs prescribed, which is the ceiling for ambien. but, since it's a controlled substance, as i'm sure you know, i would nervously approach the time for a refill, trying to get it filled at the first available date. i knew something had to change. my doc tried switching me to ambien cr, then lunesta, neither of which worked for me.

after reading Cort's article re: the combinations of meds that docs prescribe for cfs patience...http://aboutmecfs.org/Trt/TrtSleepPrescrip.aspx...
i printed the meds chart and took it to my doc. she prescribed trazadone with the ambien. one of the helpful things about trazadone is that it has a higher ceiling...i.e., more wiggle room to increase it. the first night i took trazadone i slept well. over the course of a few weeks, i increased it by 1/2 of the 50mg tabs till i reached 2 tabs each night, along with 10mgs of ambien. this seems to be my majic formula. i have slept well every night since beginning this combination, with the exception of the night i posted this thread. and an additional help...both meds are generics, so not expensive.

i used to struggle over the dependence i have on sleep meds. by through docs who understood the need, then discovering the Pheonix Rising website, and later this forum, i have gained freedom from that concern. it is evident that this illness requires us to take what is provided to give us the rest from the struggle with sleep and the deep sleep which is so vital to optimum health within the perimeters of cfs.

i encourage you to take the chart to your doc. i realize our bodies each react differently to the same meds. i'll be praying you are able to hit on the exact combination you may need.

hugs!
resting well

 

[RestingInHim]

Administrators...can you put this thread into the sleep forum if you think it belongs there?

Thanks!
resting

 

[gracenote]

RestingInHim,

I tried Trazedone a few years ago. I couldn't tolerate it. It left me completely groggy all day. I was encouraged to keep taking it for two weeks, but after about day 10, when I was still miserably groggy, I stopped.

My doctor prescribes extra Ambien for me. The extra is not covered by insurance, but since I get the generic, it's pretty inexpensive to pay for out of pocket.

I've looked at the lists, and have tried a lot of things. I'll keep trying.

Thank you for your reply. And thank you for replying all over again.

gracenote

 

[RestingInHim]

you must have a very helpful doc. that's good to hear. i know the trial and error of meds can be frustrating. we get something that works...then in a year or two...it doesn't anymore...so we go thru trial and error again.

your reply proved my comment...not that it was a new revelation or anything...that meds work differently in each of us.

still praying you and your doc find the right combo...and that in the meantime...ambien works!

sleep well! :sleepy:

 

[Hysterical Woman]

Gracenote/magnesium

Hi Gracenote,

You said that magnesium glycinate is one of the things you are trying? Can you share what dose you are taking, what brand, and when you are taking it?

Thanks,

Magnesium Maniac
aka Hysterical Woman (but not when I take my magnesium :Retro smile

 

[gracenote]

Hi Gracenote,

You said that magnesium glycinate is one of the things you are trying? Can you share what dose you are taking, what brand, and when you are taking it?

Thanks,

Magnesium Maniac
aka Hysterical Woman (but not when I take my magnesium :Retro smile

I was just peeking in here. I'm half back to sleep.

Magnesium Glycinate
Pure Encapsulations
120 mg - 2 capsules
an hour before sleep

I think I got the idea to try the magnesium from you, you Magnesium Maniac.

I'm not sure it helps. It doesn't make things worse, except looser stools the next day.

I just finished my bottle of it and am wondering if I want to try it again.

 

[Katie]

Katie, i'll look up the Horlicks. do you take it along wth meds?

BTW....slept the rest of the night and slept well the next night :sleepy:...however woke up sideways on the bed (was away without my hubby, so was sleeping alone). Wierd!! :In bed:

Thanks again for your your mid-night (at least for Victoria and me ) words of encouragement.

resting...much better!! Yea!! :victory:

Horlicks is just a normal drink but it's caffeine free and warming which helps the body to relax. I think Ovaltine is similar. I use it when I'm having a rough time sleeping and it calms my body and mind without using chemicals. So glad to hear you slept then next night, funny how it works like that! I've had my best nights sleep after a week of being up at 4am.

 

[Hysterical Woman]

I was just peeking in here. I'm half back to sleep.

Magnesium Glycinate
Pure Encapsulations
120 mg - 2 capsules
an hour before sleep

I think I got the idea to try the magnesium from you, you Magnesium Maniac.

I'm not sure it helps. It doesn't make things worse, except looser stools the next day.

I just finished my bottle of it and am wondering if I want to try it again.

Hi Grace,

I notice a definite drowsiness when I take the magnesium glycinate, so if you don't, it might not be working for you. If you are interested in trying a different brand (I think brands do make a difference), you might want to try the Douglas Labs ones. It is the one Dr. Cheney recommends, and according to my friend who sees him he feels that specific brands of supplements can definitely vary. Unfortunately, there are no guarantees. As far as the loose stools, I believe that all magnesium can cause that, the glycinate less so. That's why I had to start with only 100 mg at bedtime and work my way up.

Even so, as I have said before, I believe for me personally that I had a magnesium deficiency for at least a decade before I got cfs, so the incredible difference I have seen might not be true across the board for all CFS people. However, both Klimas and Cheney talk quite a bit about CFS for the most part being deficient. I am not sure about other docs. Peterson? Does he recommend magnesium? I don't believe that Lerner does, but then his complete focus is on anti-virals.

Good Luck with whatever you try, Grace.

Take care,

Magnesium Maniac

ETA:

Unfortunately, absorption of magnesium can also be a complicated issue. If you don't have enough stomach acid to break down the bond between magnesium and glycine, you won't absorb it and won't get any help from it. Taking zinc or calcium too close to time of taking magnesium can interfere with absorption. In addition, there are medications that can block magnesium absorption as well as the other way around. Here is just a short partial list:

http://www.mgwater.com/adequate.shtml

 

[Frickly]

There has only been one thing that has helped me sleep without any unwanted side effects. Calmplex2000 can be ordered over the internet and has been used for ADHD for years. It's an herbal remedy and I always sleep good all night long. I highly recommend giving it a try. It is also very good for anxiety and can be taken during the day at half the dose.