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Temporary or Permanent Muscular damage?

Discussion in 'Skeleton, Skin, Muscles, Hair, Teeth, and Nails' started by ChrisD, Feb 7, 2018.

  1. ChrisD

    ChrisD Senior Member

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    East Sussex
    It's a question that I have posed to this thread before about whether people are seeing physiological changes, but I cannot find my original thread for the life of me and want to change the question slightly.

    I'm finding myself on a very very gradual but stable recovery (although at this pace it feels like it could take years) but my main concern is the issues with my muscles all over my body.

    So firstly I want to ask if other people experience constant and/or severe muscle stiffness with crepitus (Noisy muscles and joints - cracking and popping)?

    If you do, do you experience periods of muscle recovery - perhaps with good nutrition/certain supps/meds - but only to return to a weak, fatigued, damaged state with a flare?

    Which muscles are affected and how badly? For me, my outer hips feel very damaged and they are always stiff and pop/crack, my upper back muscles, muscles in my arms pop with movement (Fingers and hands also when in flare mode), My knees constantly crack, my neck - all of these locations and probably more previously would be painful when they 'cracked' too but now the pain is less so with rigorous anti-inflammatory supplementation and diet.

    Is this all simply to do with low energy being delivered to the muscles and joints and therefore they cannot function properly? Or could it be an inflammatory process that is damaging the connective tissue either temporary before repair or because it is now so persistent, perhaps it is permanent and will become a regular occurence?

    I certainly feel like the form and structure of many of my joints has changed significantly, particularly my knees turning in and my upper back having less strength to hold shoulders out, and I know for a fact from a spinal X-ray that I have significant spinal degradation that I feel is quite noticeable in my posture. Anyone else?
     
    pattismith likes this.
  2. pattismith

    pattismith Senior Member

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    Hi @ChrisD ,
    Glad you feel a bit better,

    being ill for 35 years now, my knees and hips has become more and more cracking these times, as my muscles became more weak, so I thought there was a link too.

    from time to time, I happened to block one hip when doing some movments because of this, it is rather painful.

    Since I started T3 to improve my Low T3 Syndrome, my joins still crack but I didn't block my hip, so I have some hope, but I started not long ago so It may not be meaningful...
     
  3. AdamS

    AdamS Senior Member

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    I regularly get joint pain/cracking (mainly in my elbows, knees and neck). I’ve also found that my upper back, like yours seems to have less endurance, so I tend to lay down now if i’m using a laptop.

    I’m unsure about what causes this and whether it is permanent damage. I also have EDS type 3 so maybe that could be a factor but I don’t think that explains it fully because other than a couple of sports injuries, I never really had any major joint issues before my onset of ME.
     
  4. InitialConditions

    InitialConditions

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    Reading, UK
    One of my first symptoms was constant crepitus in my knees when turning position / swiveling whilst standing.
     
  5. ChrisD

    ChrisD Senior Member

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    East Sussex
    When ever I do any kind of exertion, even just standing, my upper back is the first thing to weaken and lose support, then my jaw stiffens and cracks (perceived by my doctor as anxiety - i.e. clutching my jaw, even though it's not at all). Initially I wondered if over training of certain areas when I had PVFS had permanently caused weakness, so for example; Upper back from pull ups, Outer hip from Hip Press and so on - these are the workouts where I would potentially over do it when in a slightly better state of health (No PEM at that point).

    Or maybe these are sites that are just universally weakened for all. At what point did you get your EDS diagnosis?
     
  6. AdamS

    AdamS Senior Member

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    Interestingly, weakness is not something i've experienced to a great degree with ME. It's more my endurance which is greatly affected. I had quite severe issues with joints/ligaments though in my milder/PVFS days where I could still work, especially when over exerting. In this phase I had the following:
    • Severe joint pain in right elbow (lasted around 8-9 months), still flares up now and again.
    • Plantar fasciitis (Lasted about 10 months before I did Graston Therapy which helped tons).
    • Medial Knee pain which gradually improved as I scaled back exertion.
    So can training when in PVFS/very mild phase of the illness cause damage to joints? Maybe, but what makes the joints more susceptible to damage in that phase i'm unsure...inflammation...autoimmunity, who knows?

    My EDS diagnosis was made around 4-5 months after my first major relapse. Sadly the only treatment offered was physio/exercise which obviously isn't feasible with ME. I just make sure I support my back with a big pillow if using a laptop now to counteract any pain, or lay down, my back is okay usually when standing but obviously standing too long causes it's own issues as I have POTS too!
     

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