Can a B12 Deficiency Cause Vitreous Eye Floaters?

[LynnJ]

I should have mentioned - in case anyone here is curious and also struggling with floaters - that a number of people over at an eye floater forum all said they got their floaters not too long after taking a B-Complex.

Maybe blame B2 specifically.

 

[Violeta]

What do your floaters look like?

I have probably 40+ white transparent bubbles that are the least annoying (although I still want them gone), at least two larger "crystal worm" types - basically a transparent floater in a worm-like shape.

And the two worst floaters that TRULY bother the heck out of me are fairly dark, greyish dots that, when I can get a clear look at them when my eye is positioned just so (because usually the floaters dart around like crazy), are actually probably 50-100 tiny transparent bubbles all stuck together.

If I only saw them occasionally, they wouldn't be such an issue. But alas, the dark ones can be seen pretty much all the time. Very stressful and surprisingly depressing.

LynnJ, look up images of aspergillus niger and yeast an see if there's anything that looks like what you are seeing.

And have you ever looked at a bright light through a small space in a dark washcloth or towel with one eye at a time? You can see what's floating around.

 

[LynnJ]

My understanding is that while many people suspect their floaters could be parasites or yeast, this is actually fairly rare. I mean, sure, my floaters DO resemble photos of parasites and yeast that I've seen. But almost all floaters kind of do, since they're usually all either circles, worm-shaped, or strings.

If I'm mistaken, please tell me! I'm not ruling out the possibility entirely. It's just that based on what I've read, while floaters can appear alive or look like REAL worms and parasite eggs, that's usually not the case at all.

I've never done that. A little worried I'll see more than I see right now in my day-to-day life, which would probably only stress me out more!

 

[Violeta]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12546451 I don't know.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17060517

 

[LynnJ]

I know very little about testing for parasites or yeast overgrowth. Not sure if there are simple blood/saliva tests.... But I'll look into it.

I confess, though, that I still have a very bad feeling about the Activated B w/SRT supplement I took. My floaters began to form not long after I started popping those, and I'd never been on a B-Complex before. There's so much information out there on excessive B2 being terrible for HA levels, and I've encountered numerous people who reported floaters not long after starting these complexes with what's probably way too much B2, considering many of us eat foods already enriched with it.

Can B12 deplete B2? I feel like I read somewhere that it can, but now I'm not positive.... Maybe it was folate that can deplete it?

 

[Violeta]

What do you consider excessive B2 levels? How much B2 was there in the B complex you took? The B2 I Love you thread explains which nutrients make one need more B2. B2 is water soluble and excess will be excreted. B2 is changing my life. It's good for mobilizing iron out of the liver, brain, and other organs and glands. If you think it's low HA, maybe just supplement with it, or whatever people do when they think their HA levels have been compromised.

 

[MikeM]

I had a conversation with my acupuncturist just recently about floaters. If you are open to alternative treatments, then perhaps this could help. His explanation is that while floaters are generated by normal processes in the body, usually the circulatory system flushes them out. When it fails to do this efficiently, you are left with annoying floaters.

One possible reason - he explained - for an inefficient body-cleansing system, can be an under-active liver (in the Chinese meridian system, the eyes are linked to the liver meridian). So, by strengthening the liver, one can theoretically help flush the floaters.

I'm trying a few methods to achieve this, so I'll report back!

 

[Johnmac]

The heavy metal chelation people claim that floaters are caused by HMs, & that chelation reduces or clears them.

I thought I noticed about a 30% reduction after a year of chelation, but to be honest I'm now not sure.

 

[Violeta]

Do yours come and go? Mine do. And I just realized that mine have been bothering a lot less frequently since I started working on viruses.

 

[out2lunch]

And have you ever looked at a bright light through a small space in a dark washcloth or towel with one eye at a time? You can see what's floating around.

Ah, yes. The do-it-yourself slit lamp test.

My eye doc can see the large floaters in both of my eyes, which technically are Weiss rings caused by vitreous detachment around the optic nerve. The ring has collapsed into more of a pancake shape, which is typical for these kinds of floaters, and looks like a large grey cloud with a dark grey outline. Some days, it really bugs me.

Two important things to consider about floaters before chasing down supplements or toxins or what have you:

1) Do you have astigmatism? Folks of all ages with astigmatism tend to be prone to floaters. I've had severe astigmatism since childhood, and floaters have been a part of my life as long as I can remember.

2) Floater frequency will increase with age. And the combination of advancing age with astigmatism will set you up for floaters, especially the Weiss ring vitreous detachment floater, guaranteed. So if you're older than 40, you might not be able to do much about them.

 

[Violeta]

Ah, yes. The do-it-yourself slit lamp test.

My eye doc can see the large floaters in both of my eyes, which technically are Weiss rings caused by vitreous detachment around the optic nerve. The ring has collapsed into more of a pancake shape, which is typical for these kinds of floaters, and looks like a large grey cloud with a dark grey outline. Some days, it really bugs me.

Two important things to consider about floaters before chasing down supplements or toxins or what have you:

1) Do you have astigmatism? Folks of all ages with astigmatism tend to be prone to floaters. I've had severe astigmatism since childhood, and floaters have been a part of my life as long as I can remember.

2) Floater frequency will increase with age. And the combination of advancing age with astigmatism will set you up for floaters, especially the Weiss ring vitreous detachment floater, guaranteed. So if you're older than 40, you might not be able to do much about them.

I'm over 40 and mine have decreased quite a bit.

 

[Darius]

Im sorry but people you wrote here so many myths and misinformation about floaters, that people can be confused. First B12 no its not related to floaters.
"Floaters can indeed be caused by anemia according to my doctor" again not related to floaters
All studies you provide injected b2 directly into vitreous you cant concluded the same in vivo model due to metabolism.(Eyes were irradiated also). The best is study "The influence of riboflavin on vitreous homogenate" they irradiated vitreous homogenate so I dont wonder they obtain such results(normal eyes have protective barriers and system which look at vitamins level).Remember that B2 is water solube. Thats why excessive intakes, as its low solubility keeps it from being absorbed in dangerous amounts within the digestive tract and any excess relevant doses is excreted in the urine, important note we talking about oral doses, studies you show overcome digestive tract thats why result in accumulation.
" And the combination of advancing age with astigmatism" please astigmatism have nothing to do with floaters(astigmatism is cornea problem not vitreous) myopia yes, "I had significant floaters for some years, as my condition worsened. After building up to theraputic levels of B12/folate, they disappeared. No more since." wow the biggest example of ignorance and problem with understanding science, do you hear about anecdotal evidence?. Many people feel better after smoking this mean that smoking is healthy? Some floaters can disappear like this from blood leaks. That its why correlation dont imply causation. Heavy metals and parasites problem are fake, they are spreaded by quacks who try get money from people.
"in the Chinese meridian system, the eyes are linked to the liver meridian" this my frend is biggest quackery If you can normally flush floaters then if you have problem with "detox" them then you will be have the same problem whith all chemical compounds in other word you will be dead right now. Many scientist look connection to find liver floaters connection, no one find.
My speciality is toxicology/neurology but because I have floaters they are also in interest of my research.

 

[justpat]

B12 Deficiency can cause optic neuritis and optic neuropathy and lead to early macular degeneration, As a former moderator on the PAS forum, I noted many members who complained of floaters in the eyes. Once these members began self treatment, the eye floaters disappeared. I do believe that low B12 can cause floaters in the eyes but there are other conditions that can cause it as well. Floaters in the eyes seem to be prevalent in people with hypo/hyperthyroidism but then there is also a connection between B12 Deficiency and thyroidism.

 

[Darius]

B12 Deficiency can cause optic neuritis and optic neuropathy and lead to early macular degeneration, As a former moderator on the PAS forum, I noted many members who complained of floaters in the eyes. Once these members began self treatment, the eye floaters disappeared. I do believe that low B12 can cause floaters in the eyes but there are other conditions that can cause it as well. Floaters in the eyes seem to be prevalent in people with hypo/hyperthyroidism but then there is also a connection between B12 Deficiency and thyroidism.

One more time there is no mechanism that b12 or thyroid problem will cause floaters, please dont spread myth, dont forget that correlation dont imply causation, "Once these members began self treatment, the eye floaters disappeared. I do believe that low B12 can cause floaters in the eyes but there are other conditions that can cause it as well. " im sorry but this is purest quackery first check what floaters are then you will be know that this simply inst true(tell me one thing how logicaly how b12 treatment can cause that floaters disappear?). "Floaters in the eyes seem to be prevalent in people with hypo/hyperthyroidism " or maybe because floaters are very common??? you know that people who eat vegetables also have floaters? so maybe vegs also cause them? The same about "and lead to early macular degeneration" studies only observe correlation we dont know if vitamin b12 cause this or other factors you drawn your conclusion from epidemiologial studies. I will show you your flaws. Rate of smoking is lower that 40 years ago yet cancer rates increase, based on this epidemiological findings we can conclude that smoking have protective effect on cancer, do you see error here? that it why spreading such claims based on epidemiological studies is bad science.

 

[justpat]

One more time there is no mechanism that b12 or thyroid problem will cause floaters, please dont spread myth, dont forget that correlation dont imply causation, "Once these members began self treatment, the eye floaters disappeared. I do believe that low B12 can cause floaters in the eyes but there are other conditions that can cause it as well. " im sorry but this is purest quackery first check what floaters are then you will be know that this simply inst true(tell me one thing how logicaly how b12 treatment can cause that floaters disappear?). "Floaters in the eyes seem to be prevalent in people with hypo/hyperthyroidism " or maybe because floaters are very common??? you know that people who eat vegetables also have floaters? so maybe vegs also cause them? The same about "and lead to early macular degeneration" studies only observe correlation we dont know if vitamin b12 cause this or other factors you drawn your conclusion from epidemiologial studies. I will show you your flaws. Rate of smoking is lower that 40 years ago yet cancer rates increase, based on this epidemiological findings we can conclude that smoking have protective effect on cancer, do you see error here? that it why spreading such claims based on epidemiological studies is bad science.

I think you are rather rude, Darius. I am not spreading a myth.

I don't consider a 10 year study to just be a correlation of B12/Folate Deficiency and AMD.


The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition

Bamini Gopinath, Victoria M Flood, Elena Rochtchina, Jie Jin Wang, and Paul Mitchell

Homocysteine, folate, vitamin B-12, and 10-y incidence of age-related macular degeneration

"Results: After adjustment for age, sex, current smoking, white blood cell count, and fish consumption, each 1-SD increase in serum tHcy was associated with increased risk of incident early and any AMD [ORs (95% CIs): 1.33 (1.09, 1.63) and 1.33 (1.11, 1.60), respectively]. Participants with a serum vitamin B-12 deficiency (<185 pmol/L) had higher risk of incident early and late AMD [ORs (95% CIs): 1.58 (1.06, 2.36) and 2.56 (1.38, 4.73), respectively]. Folate deficiency (<11 nmol/L) was associated with 75% and 89% increased risk of incident early and any AMD, respectively, 10 y later. Participants who reported supplementary vitamin B-12 intake had 47% reduced risk of incident any AMD (OR: 0.53; 95% CI: 0.33, 0.85).

Conclusion: Elevated serum tHcy and folate and vitamin B-12 deficiencies predicted increased risk of incident AMD, which suggests a potential role for vitamin B-12 and folate in reducing AMD risk."


I will only post one such link above because I am sure you will not agree with it. As for the rate of smoking being lower now than 40 years ago, I also think you are wrong there. It is more like 20 years ago and not 40 years which is why we are still seeing an increase in cancer. However, the decline in smoking was short-lived because it has increased amongst teenagers.

 

[leela]

@Darius, bad science is also the habit of failing to acknowledge that science itself is the history of continually improving on, or proving wrong, its current dataset.

Please refrain from speaking with such disrespect to other members, insisting their thoughts and experience are "quackery", "myth" etc.
I realize there is a language barrier, but that does not excuse you from the courtesy and the forum rule of presenting your own thoughts and experience without disrespecting another member. When you post here you are agreeing to the forum rules.

 

[Darius]

First respond to leela, sorry for my language, but because I also have floaters this is very personal to me and I also spend many hours to study this issue and therefore when someone wrote theory without basic explanation probably like all suffers I get irritated, but I will try hold myself. Backing to you justpad, you quoted fragment from study I also do the same from the same study.
"Study limitations also deserve discussion. First, we could not exclude the possibility of residual confounding; eg, the apparent beneficial effect of dietary vitamin B-12 intake on AMD risk could be explained by other health-related factors, because older adults with higher vitamin B-12 intake are also likely to lead a healthier lifestyle than those with poorer dietary vitamin B-12 intake. Second, the number of participants who developed incident late AMD were small; hence, we may have underestimated some of the associations. Third, analyses only examined associations between baseline intakes of dietary folate equivalents and the incidence of AMD; hence, there is a possibility that synthetic folic acid in foods could have increased because of fortification over the 10 y. " I understand that not everyone will see study flaws and limitation(when I start my journey in toxicology neurolgy I aslo have problem with this). I give you information also which authors dont wrote, check table one from this study, Age(we know is one of the biggest factor of AMD), people in amd group was older about five years, there is no information/adjustment for other diseases which can increase your risk for AMD like for example diabetes, obesity name few, that is why risky drawing conclusion from epidemiological studies when we seek assocation with diseases(the funny part is that when we try find if something dont cause some diseases epideiological studies are ideal).

About smoking https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Pages/NR11-031SmokingChart.aspx
Here you have nice graph showing for example 30 years ago to our time percentage of smoking.
" It is more like 20 years ago and not 40 years which is why we are still seeing an increase in cancer." you wrote very good point now extrapolate this to your theories and epidemiological studies, how you can be sure that there is no other factors from past that authors don adjusted? in this fragment you only show that epidemiological studies cannot be cited as a proof.