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Live Blood Analysis

Discussion in 'Diagnostic Guidelines and Laboratory Testing' started by taniaaust1, Mar 29, 2012.

  1. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1 Senior Member

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    Im wondering who has had this done and what abnormal findings were found on your tests?

    Ive been thinking about having this done for years but never get around to it or have money for it. My sister who could get a CFS diagnoses and is trying thing after thing (she's just given up on homoepathy treatments which she'd been trying to convince herself were helping), the other day went and had live blood analyses done and got 5 different abnormal findings (the lady put it all up on the computer screen so she could see it)

    - rod like bacteria could be seen moving around in her cells

    - candida was all throu her blood

    - her red blood cells were bigger then usual

    - there was also something showing to do with her immune system which the lady doing the test said showed it had been fighting something for quite a while

    - It also showed her as being anemic. (I was astounded to hear her say when I asked her why on earth her doctor didnt pick up anemia, she said that he didnt even bother to test her for anemia (he actually didnt run any tests at all).. just kept telling her she was depressed.
    She's so put off now by doctors that she wont see go to them except to my allergist who obviously didnt think that a simple iron test hadnt been done by her doc, so that got missed again. He thinks her issues are due to swinging blood sugar as thou just within range, her swings to both ends of the scale)

    My sister is now trying a heap of herbs for the issues. (I tried Naturopathy and western herbal medicine on my ME with no success in the first couple of years of the illness..but I didnt have any of the tests due to lack of money). My sister is all happy now, believing she will be fixed. (Im not saying anything to her about it or my thoughts cause I dont wish to be negative).

    Anyway.. wanting to hear others stories of live blood analyses and what was found... and if you tried then herbal med to target specific findings from that test.. did it work? Was live blood analyses worth doing?
  2. silicon

    silicon Senior Member

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    I saw a naturopath about 10 years ago who used to do live blood analyses on me. Several times he noted that my red cells tended to "clump" together--I don't recall the significance of that, but it didn't sound good. Other times there was some sort of evidence of infection, but not always. I don't recall any specific interventions based on the live blood analyses, although perhaps he tailored homeopathic remedies to what he saw in the blood.
  3. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1 Senior Member

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    I think that clumping may be called hypercoagulation. There was one specialised blood place in which did a blood study on ME/CFS and found I think it was over 90% of us had abnormal hypercoagulation ie antiphosphoid lipid syndrome (? not 100% if i have that name right) .. or Hugh's? Hughe's? Syndrome.

    I already know I do have the hypercoagulation from a blood test (a hospital run some different tests to the more common ones the GPs had done)
  4. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member

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    I don't think that this testing has ever been shown to be useful for detecting anything.

    From what I've seen, it seems that it's likely to lead to inaccurate diagnoses and treatment recommendations.

    Difficult situation. It could be worth pointing out that this sort of testing is rather 'alternative', and that it might be worth having any diagnoses double-checked before it was assumed to be accurate.

    It's really common for people with CFS to have bad experiences with their GPs, due to something like unreasonable assumptions about depression, and to then turn to anyone else in the hope of finding someone who they can trust to treat them fairly. Unfortunately there's plenty of dodgy advice to be found outside of GP's offices too.

    Hopefully things will work out okay for you both.
    taniaaust1 and Valentijn like this.
  5. Sing

    Sing Senior Member

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    I had it done about 15 years ago. There were several negative findings. The only one I remember was the one I understood which was that it took about an hour and a half for her to find a white blood cell. She finally did. It was a trainee who was doing the test. I had had an abnormally low white blood cell count for some years before this, so was already tracking this idea.
    taniaaust1 likes this.
  6. fla

    fla Senior Member

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    I posted videos about M.E. live blood analysis here showing clumping/sticky/rouleaux formation blood. The videos showing very similar blood "clumping" when exposed to EMF/EMR to me are enough for M.E. patients to consider reducing EMF/EMR exposure as a precaution.

    There are plenty of scientific studies showing biological effects including immune and neurological changes under low power EMF/EMR long term exposure. It will take more time to understand how these biological effects translate into disease processes. Cancer is not necessarily the only threat, there could be chronic disabling immune activation of unknown etiology. A link between vaccines and autism is considered plausible by many parents but the autism rate increase correlates better with the rise in use of wireless technologies.
  7. jimells

    jimells Senior Member

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    I had this test a number of years ago. It was fascinating to see the blood cells. The only abnormal finding I can remember was that a number of red cells were deformed. They suggested that might be due to insufficient protein (I eat very little meat). I tried the supplements that were suggested, but none of them made any difference.

    The dried blood part of the test seemed rather bogus. As I recall, they put a drop of blood on some kind of absorbant paper and wait for it to spread out and dry into a series of rings (or something like that - I can't remember clearly) Supposedly each concentric ring represents different organ systems and they can identify possible cancer, etc. Kinda reminds me of the Chinese medicine people who can somehow detect "liver pulse" and other crazy-sounding stuff like that.

    All those expensive Chinese herb pills never helped either. Surprise.
  8. Sparrow

    Sparrow Senior Member

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    I'm on the fence with this one. I think a lot of practitioners read WAY too much into some of this, and there are other explanations for what they're seeing (and worse, some will deliberately mislead people, then miraculously "treat" them by showing clean results next time - e.g. allowing slides to be contaminated with normal environmental bacteria that will then look like they came from your blood). On the other side, some of what they're looking at is legit, so maybe in the hands of the right practitioner it could be useful to an extent.

    I had it done by a physician. I had:

    -a ton of cells with dark centres, which supposedly contained viruses
    -lots of clotting (not the same as the clumping), which supposedly indicated poor liver function
    -huge evidence of candida and other critters. There were a few things with tails swimming around on mine which freaked me out a little. Could have been poor sterilization as well, but it seemed legit.

    That said, I didn't find it very helpful at all to me in particular. Already suspected all of that was an issue. But having the test done was a required piece of seeing that practitioner, and I needed his help in other areas.
  9. Boule de feu

    Boule de feu Senior Member

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  10. Boule de feu

    Boule de feu Senior Member

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    I think that if there were such a way to figure out what is wrong with someone's health, hematologists would not bother going through all this trouble to analyze someone's blood. They are not stupid. They have years of knowledge behind them. If there were a fastest way, they would go for it. Everybody could do it. Let's look at your blood! Let's look at my blood!

    I took many courses in this field and worked with an hematologist. There is nothing easy about doing this.

    This scam is sitting on my shelf besides my second favorite one: Vega test!
    Sing likes this.
  11. Boule de feu

    Boule de feu Senior Member

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    ahimsa likes this.
  12. Sing

    Sing Senior Member

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    Hi Boule de feu!

    i like your point. This applies to so many tests and remedies recommended for us. How many pan out?
  13. fla

    fla Senior Member

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    I wouldn't trust any diagnosis from a naturopath nor would I take their suggested treatment. I would like to see if a large percentage of M.E. sufferers have clumping/coagulation/rouleaux/sticky blood that hinders circulation. Remember Ken Lassenen's theory about Hughes Syndrome/sticky blood.

    Since no standard medical tests are useful in diagnosing M.E. it logically follows that the eventual test for diagnosing M.E. is currently non-standard. Lets keep an open mind about non-standard forms of testing.
  14. Xandoff

    Xandoff Michael

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    I should think you need to find a ME CFS Doctor who can test you for EBV, HHV6 and all the other nasty chronic infections we have. Here is a lsit of my test results from October 2010.

    My lab results indicated that on top of being XMRV positive (sept 2010) I tested positive for HHV-6 ( 3.45), Chlamydia Pneumoniae AB IGM (>1:256), Cytomegalovirus AB IGG CMV IgG (3.1), anemia (on going) High C-Reactive Protein, Vitamin D defiency (29), (in spite of taking 3,000 I.U. a day!) Low DHEA Sulfate (15.0), Mycoplasma Pneumoniae IGG AB (104) Low Testosterone (258) on going, and it suggestive of a past Epstein Barr Virus infection.

    These are the test that really help the Doctor to know whats going on. No regular GP will run these tests. Maybe there is a few exceptions out there.

    Good Luck!
  15. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1 Senior Member

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    Yeah that dried blood thing does definately sound bogus. The one my sister saw didnt do that.. Ive been reading thou stuff online and it seems that many of them do do that too.
    .......

    thanks all for the posts and thanks to the Boule for the links.
  16. Rlman

    Rlman

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    did a test yesterday. Lots of deformed RBCs with thory/burr like projectionson the outer edge, also lots of clumping, doc said ow minerals, malabsoprtion but I'm sort of freaked out, gonna ask Gp for smear
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2014
  17. redaxe

    redaxe

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    I had a live blood examination this week by a doctor who is a specialist in CFS and a range of aging-related diseases

    I must say that his methodology was much better than the naturopath who did it to me nearly a year ago. Interestingly the naturopath said at the time that he saw Candida in my blood but my CFS doctor said that 'you cannot see Candida in the blood & that was something they used to believe and that it was probably platelet clumping instead'.
    This doctor was using a Metagenics screening program. It allows the input of abnormal characteristics of blood cells which then determine likely health problems. This doctor was also counting my white cells and looking at the proportion of neutrophils etc that were inactive vs active etc....
    The naturopath on the other hand wasn't really doing any real analysis using even basic statistics or counting the proportion of damaged cells etc so his advice was quite arbitrary.

    My CFS doctor on the other hand made observations using scientific jargon & identified problems with red and white cells
    -A disproportionally high number of red cells with abnormal shapes & sizes and many cells had membranes that were damaged, bent or spiky.
    -There was also too much clumping in red cells, platelets and white cells were also aggregating too much.
    - Neutrophils tended to have too much granulation which apparently is a sign of too many aged white blood cells.
    - Neutrophils weren't showing as much phagocytosis (i.e. cell membrane movement) as they should i.e. most phagocytes were round

    Some of the Metagenics conclusions were that the blood abnormalities showed systemic deficiencies in Folate, B12 & Iron. B12 for instance is needed for the production of blood cells and the presence of overgranulated neutrophils was a sign of poor cell turnover and reduced DNA synthesis....
    -Platelet clumping & too much 'dancing fat globules (I forgot the terminology here) was attributed to poor gut digestion, abnormal sugar metabolism and leaky gut.
    -Red cell clumping and poor membrane integrity is a sign of oxidative damage from toxins, recent illness or autoimmunity
    -Other red cell abnormalities also suggested iron deficiency
    -low movement in phagocytes suggests low energy availability (low ATP & poor Mito function)

    Seeing as other tests showed I had bowel inflammation I decided I would start taking digestive enzymes with meals to help digestion, nutrient absorption and reducing the movement of inflammatory proteins into the blood. The signs of nutrient deficiencies was a bit disturbing to be honest; I've been on B12 & multivitamins for months and months & the signs of deficiencies are still visible so it seems that recovery can take a very long time.

    But now that he has some numbers of white cells and characteristics when I have a follow up examination in a few months I think this information will provide some evidence of how my recovery progresses.

    All in all I think it is a valuable tool but It seems like not everyone that practices Live Blood Analysis is trained to the same level. My physician has infinitely better understanding of what is driving this condition then the Naturopath I saw initially.
  18. Rlman

    Rlman

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    did you eat or drink before your blood draw?
  19. Rlman

    Rlman

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    Went to another microscopist (nutritionist) and my results were much better. With the first doc (ND)I was not allowed to eat or drink until the test 11AM, but with the nutritionist I was allowed to drink. Big difference in results. No rouleaux, almost no RBCs with spikes, unlike first time. RBCs were not uniform shape (some small, big, oval), there was lots of clumping of RBC cells, WBC not moving but otherwise ok. Got same explanation as you redaxe. So drinking makes a big difference it seems.
  20. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member

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    I think that we can be pretty confident that live blood testing is a dodgy technique with unreliable results.

    There's been no good evidence for it's value, and it seems to lead to strange and unreliable results. I'd advise massive caution here. Sorry to not have beeter news for you - best of luck with everything.

    I just googled up an of article in case they may be of interest:

    http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/live-blood-analysis-the-modern-auguries/

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