@
Beyond.
I've got a theory for my sleeping 5 hours and then lying wide awake for 2, being very alert. It fits all the symptoms and medical data I have.
SHORT VERSION:
after 5 hours I get excess noradrenaline on the brain. This prevents GABA rising and REMsleep commencing and makes one very alert.
Oral supplementing of the neurotransmitter Progesterone makes me sleep for 7 or 8 hours straight. Maybe because one of its metabolites, Allopregnanolone, dampens neurons firing and promotes GABA. It is as potent as benzo's and sleepingpills, which is what most people use for this kind of insomnia.
Progesterone is NOT a female sex hormone.
LONGER VERSION:
In the brain a small amount of noradrenaline is needed after the 4,5 hours of nonREMsleep to stop the REM-off neurons from firing and let REM-on neurons start. When REM-on neurons get active GABA will rise and REMsleep will start.
REM sleep depends on high GABA.
Too much noradrenaline makes this impossible. GABA will not rise and insomnia will cause more noradrenaline. Noradrenaline is the neurotransmitter that makes you very very alert.
Reason might be MAO A not breaking down noradrenaline sufficiently due to a mutation.
Another reason might be too low Progesterone (I have this, tested and proven). Progesterone is not a female sex hormone, it is a human hormone. Testosterone is made from it. Cortisol is made from it. And it is a neurotransmitter in the brain.
In the brain Progesterone increases MAO's activity slightly.
Progesterone’s most profound neuronal effect, however, results from its direct effect on the neuronal membrane. Progesterone has an inhibitory effect on neuronal excitation, depressing neuronal firing.
One of its metabolites in the brain is Allopregnanolone. This is a neuroactive steroid that does something with GABA. It has a potency similar to that of the most potent benzodiazepines (Valium etc) and approximately a thousand times higher than pentobarbitals (sleeping pills).
(I still need to check my sources but
this one put me onto Allopregnanolone and
this one researches REMsleep)
CONTEXT:
Noradrenaline is noradrenergic, meaning to do with the Sympathetic Nervous System.
Onset of REMsleep and GABA is from cholinergic brain input, it is about the Parasympathetic Nervous System. (
source here)
The nervous system is not limited to the brain, of course.
REMEDIES:
- stop noradrenaline from rising (how? how? How do I get the Sympathetic Nervous System to shut up?)
- stop REM-off neurons from continious firing (how? by taking benzo's? by taking Allopregnanolone?)
- raise GABA (how? taking precursors?)
SUPPLEMENTING:
Taking GABA is useless, it cannot go through the blood brain barrier (BBB) because it is too big a molecule, say people on the forums here. If a GABA supplement does have a soothing effect it means your BBB is leaky (search forums on this, Hip and Gestalt say smart things about this)
Progesterone: only take progesterone, no progestins. Be vigilant about this. Read the label.
Take the oral pill, not the cream, someone one the forums here said the pill form is the only form that yields Allopregnonalone. As is my own experience too.
In Europe the (only) correct brand for Progesteron is Utrogestan. It is not over the counter. Your doctor will probably resist and needs to be educated. Both on Progesterone/Progestins and on males needing this basic hormone.
A 100 mg pill gets converted to 10mg active Progestrone (the liver filters out the rest, working hard). This 10mg is the dose a regular human body needs for a regular day, it's a physiological doses. It is what a normal body produces on its own. Supplementing the full 10mg is too much for a man who -presumably- produces at least some of his own in his adrenals. Problem.
Females need more because they also use Progestrone to balance out Estrogens. Their physiological dose varies every day and can range from 10 to 60mg. (60mg on day 21 of cycle)
Larger Utrogestan pills (200/500mg) are for females in pregnancy. They may need much more than the daily 60mg to keep their baby on board which is where the hormone gets its name: PRO-GESTational-hoRmONE and our association with it being a female sex hormone.
HRT = RISKY
There is no knowing in advance how your body choses to convert the Progesterone. It may raise your Testosterone, your Cortisol, your Aldosterone. Taking too much may numb the receptors or lower your own production.
HRT is risky business. Always start low and go slow.
10 mg Progesterone is excess of what a man needs, I feel. I'd want 20 or 50mg pills to start with but these are not produced. You could cut open a capsule and take only the white liquid, I guess. It looks like paint.
One thing about taking physiological doses is that your body is able to get rid of it within the day. You are not overdosing as is often the case with conventional HRT or other drugs.
ME/CFS people probably have decreased capacity for elimination so should even take less, of any drug or supplement. On a positive note: we notice effects sooner so small doses give us information fast.
MY EXPERIENCE
On some nights I take 100mg Utrogestan pills for my menstrual cycle and then I sleep through the night every time, unless it's the last week before my period. I was told sleepiness was a symptom of too high a dose. Now I am not so sure. It feels awful during the day and I avoid it. But at night I sleep well and wake up with new vigour. And now I found a plausible explanation for it.
As long as my liver can stand it and I wake up feeling refreshed I am now taking Progesterone at night. The correct thing to do is find out with how low a dose I sleep through. But because my need as a female differs each day and I have CFS I'm not up for cutting up pills and taking notes yet.
For you I have no quick solution, sorry. Only this theory that, to me, makes sense and fits both our symptoms.
Sent from my iPad
