Waking up at 5am everyday (Five hours sleep)

[ChrisD]

For the past 4 years of CFS/ME/Fibro, probiotics have been my absolute go to tool for getting 8 hours sleep that is mildly more refreshing than usual.
But since an infection in my groin that is strangely flared up by probiotics, I cannot take them. And since this my sleep has been far shorter.

I always go to bed at about 11:30 and get off okay with Melatonin but then I’m waking up every day at 4/5am as sometimes not being able to go back to sleep, other times getting 2-3 more hours of broken sleep. And it is breaking my health down!

Sometimes I’ll do a few days of probiotics which helps but of course comes with pain in my groin, so it’s like being between a rock and hard place. I’m amazed that even Melatonin doesn’t keep me down.

It all scares me a bit because as my health just gets worse with this poor sleep, I realise that potentially the only correction is FMT or some really complex reconfiguring of my immune system. I’ve already tried so many things to focus on gut/microbiome etc.

 

[PatJ]

My most reliable sleep combo is liquid melatonin (0.75mg) plus Dr. Christopher's Relax-eze liquid. Sometimes, for a few days, I use a 50:50 mix of THC:CBD oil for a break from the Relax-eze.

Vitamin D has also improved my sleep. I take it early in the day and notice deeper sleep at night. I (and many people) need to take magnesium with vitamin D to avoid side-effects.

 

[Wishful]

I usually go to bed around 9PM (tired of dealing with ME), though I may not actually fall asleep before 11 or 12. I used to be able to sleep until 7 or 8, but lately I've been wide awake at 4. I don't know if it's from ME, or just from getting older (nearing 60). FWIW, I generally wake every 2 hrs or so (bladder insists). It's the falling asleep again that's problematic.

Melatonin (or 5-HTP) can help me fall asleep earlier, but doesn't seem to let me sleep longer in the morning. If I take it around 3 or 4 AM, it might let me fall asleep again, but leaves me horribly groggy for much of the day, so I don't even try. I never noticed sleep improvement from VitD.

So far I haven't noticed any health problems I could attribute to lack of sleep.

 

[Pearshaped]

If you get worse,I would consider help of medication and not waiting too long for the problem solve itself out.

Which things(herbs/suppl.)have you tried so far to get back to sleep?
for me,Taurine and magnesium do the trick sometimes.

The prescrption drug trazodone is said to help with early awakening.Though for me it hasn't worked at all.
when wide awake it helps me to focus on the silence around me and enjoy the only few hours when the world around me is finally silent.

 

[Sarah94]

Maybe try an antihistamine? I find Nytol quite effective for keeping me asleep. I see you're from the UK - you can buy it over the counter in pharmacies. I mean the version of Nytol that comes in a blue box.

 

[Wishful]

Antihistamines made me groggy, but not sleepy. I found the effect quite unpleasant. Definitely one of those 'see if it works for you' things.

@ChrisD , I get insomnia in early morning if I eat quickly-digested carbs in the noon to evening period. Sugar, white flour; it doesn't even take much to make me wide-eyed at 2 AM. Fibre-rich carbs dont' cause that problem. Maybe your altered microbiome is affecting how you respond to such carbs (or for you, maybe fats or proteins). Maybe try some different diet regimes to see if that has any effect. It might be a different time of day for you, or different types of food, but food definitely can affect sleep.

 

[Lord Randal]

Dear @ChrisD, my father has been experiencing it for two years (always waking up at 5 a.m.). He took Melatonin without any result ...
Then this trouble went away on its own after two years, doctor said they didn't know why.
In some cases it could be caused by hormonal changes, in other cases by stress ...
I hope you will find a way to resolve it.

 

[lenora]

Hello ChrisD......I'm sorry that you've joined the insomniac brigade. My sleep patterns became messed up more than 35 yr. ago. I don't believe there's anything I haven't tried....I've been on melatonin (which left me even more awake...different brands and amounts), sleeping pills of all sorts (last for 2 nights max.) and, like you, I have to go to bed about 6:00 p.m. but don't fall asleep until about 1:00 a.m. for just a short period of time. It's true that an antihistamine can help, but it also contributes to restless leg syndrome and on and on it goes.

I sleep on average perhaps 3 hrs/day. I'll fall asleep during the daytime long enough to say drop a cup of tea on my computer, which really wakes me up and then I won't sleep for at least 10 hrs. Apparently this isn't uncommon among people with ME or neurological conditions of all sorts. I've had about 2 hrs. tonight and can't even remember the last time I had a decent night's sleep. I no longer fight it and find that works best. I'm a reader, so that helps considerably. Anesthesia guarantees at least 4 nights without any sleep whatsoever.

It doesn't seem fair to have to live almost 22 hrs./day, day after day, does it? But I function OK, well I don't work or do anything productive, and yes, I'm tired....a lot. I don't drive any longer b/c between the lack of sleep and meds I take I'm really afraid of hurting someone. This started out with the usual crummy sleep of people with ME. You're asleep but you can hear everything and everyone in the room around you. I now wear earplugs, although it took me time to get used to them (a long time). Sleep studies have proven useless and my neurologist is the only one who can talk any sense about it.( He has tried just about everything on me, including royphenol (?) and nothing but nothing works. II can say with all honesty that I don't think there's anything I haven't tried. I've also tried vitamins/supplements...you name it, it's probably in a drawer somewhere.

Keep an eye on research and track your sleep for at least 2 wks. See if there's a pattern...any feedback you can give your doctors is helpful. I've trained myself to accept it; there was no other choice and, oddly enough, that helps. I tell myself that it won't kill me, I have other rooms to go to, I don't argue too much with my husband out of exhaustion, and it's one more thing to deal with that ME has brought to me. I wish you better luck. Yours, Lenora

 

[sometexan84]

Old thread. But I've really wanted to post this tip!

So yea, I've gone through the exact same thing. Waking middle of night, can't fall back asleep. And I am really really proud of this idea, because it really works.

When trying to go back to sleep, I've been too wired. So I shut my eyes, get comfortable, and picture in my mind graphics like below. I picture a guy sleeping in bed, with little ZZZzzzz's floating above. And as long as I stay focused on that type of cartoony sleeping guy imagery, I start feeling tired, like legit tired, as if I'd taken another melatonin. Serious it worx! As if that image in my brain makes it shift back to parasympathetic instead of sympathetic activity. It's crazy!

 

[lenora]

Old thread. But I've really wanted to post this tip!

So yea, I've gone through the exact same thing. Waking middle of night, can't fall back asleep. And I am really really proud of this idea, because it really works.

When trying to go back to sleep, I've been too wired. So I shut my eyes, get comfortable, and picture in my mind graphics like below. I picture a guy sleeping in bed, with little ZZZzzzz's floating above. And as long as I stay focused on that type of cartoony sleeping guy imagery, I start feeling tired, like legit tired, as if I'd taken another melatonin. Serious it worx! As if that image in my brain makes it shift back to parasympathetic instead of sympathetic activity. It's crazy!



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Hi @sometexan84, it's the other Texan living in Dallas. I'm just coming off what would have been 9 days with no sleep. None...nada, but I also have other severe neurological problems and here I am up again at 5:00 a.m. after going back to bed at about 2:30 a.m. I did sleep for a few more hrs. but now I'm wide awake, up & at 'em. I do believe that works for you, and I'm glad. We should all use the first and easy line of defense first. You seem fairly young, so have at it!!! I hope it works forever for you.

We have such a wide range of problems, but all ideas are essential and needed. Your suggestion may work for many people, but as we get older we have so many other things "kick in." Did you ever find another doctor...if so, where? The hospital receptionist should have a list of new doctors and their specialties. Tell her to especially look for anyone who has ME/CFS/FM listed by their name. Good luck, and let's hear your answer. By the way, did you draw the attachments? They're very good. Continue to sleep well. Yours, Lenora.

 

[sometexan84]

You seem fairly young, so have at it!!! I hope it works forever for you.

Thx! Thankfully, I'm no longer waking up middle of night. I'd forgotten how great it feels to have a great night's sleep. I went from needing 11-12 hrs of sleep to less than 8 (which I hasn't been the case since like 2016/2017).

I didn't go to sleep til 5am cause I'm in a funny situation now where I'm no longer tired. Still haven't developed a new routine since I got my energy back.