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In this thread I will outline my ongoing attempt to remodel my gut microbiom using E. coli bacteria and other probiotics and prebiotics.
Two months ago I send my stool sample to Ubiome, and at the same time to a German lab (ordered online). The Ubiome results took more than 6 weeks to get back (probably due to a hold up on the border).
Good news is, both lab tests came back with equal results. Giving that they both use quite different ways of testing the sample (to Ubiome you send back a small cotton stick, to the other lab I had to send back a whole small bottle full of poop), that gave me confidence that they are both actually doing a pretty good job at testing.
The major findings:
Interestingly Ubiome said that I am deficient in GABA and Serotonin producing bacteria:
Indeed from 2011 to Jan 2018 I took a SSRI for anxiety and panic disorder. Since one year I don't take it anymore but feel that I should, as stepping out of the general comfort zone comes again with panic attacks, which during that time have been rare.
The bacterii mentioned here are Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium, as well as Streptococcus and Enterococcus.
On a different page Ubiome basically shows 0% Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium. Personally I don't know if it is truly 0% but it seems to be low.
The German lab has the same findings:
They didn't test for Streptococcus, but for a different bacteria which Ubiome doesn't seem to test for, or at least it doesn't include it in their major findings. And that bacteria is E. coli.
While most of us associate E. coli with the consumption of some bad food and some days being ill, it is actually quite a necessary citizen of the gut. It provides the anaerobe living conditions which other bacterii like Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium need for survival. Now you can see why these are missing, too. They don't have any good habitat to live in.
Any supplementing with probiotics would be absolutely futile without addressing the E. coli problem first.
Streptococcus and Enterococcus on the other hand get their daily food via so called cross feeding by byproducts from Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium. Again, it is no surprise that these are missing, too.
In conclusion, the low level of both GABA and Serotonin producing bacteria start with the absolute lack of E. coli bacteria in my gut. I don't know what caused this in the first place (no use of Antibiotics as far as I can remember), but that problem would have to be addressed first.
The solution:
Thankfully there is the possibility for supplementing with E. coli without getting sick doing so. Already 1917 there was the Nissle strain of E. coli discovered in Germany. While being very beneficial for the body it has no side effects. Many things could be written about that strain, but you can find all the information on the English Mutaflor website:
https://www.mutaflor.com/mutaflor-w...=false&cHash=b4e7d1c7a0d545f53d051a2226ff3b9b
In Germany you can get it in three different forms:
a) Mutaflor
b) Mutaflor Mite: which is around 1/5 of the dose per capsule of the Mutaflor. It is used in the first two weeks for easing into the program.
c) Mutaflor Suspension: which is so low concentrated that it is used to treat new born babies. It seems that some of these poor creatures already have to go through antibiotic treatment. These are then used to rebuild the gut from the get go. By the way, this is the best sign that you are really not dealing with any harmful species here.
The goal is to take 2 capsules in the morning of the normal Mutaflor for 3 months. One package with 100 capsules comes around 100 bucks, so it is not the cheapest of probiotic treatments. The capsules have to be stored in the fridge and have to be ordered in a way that they are delivered cool.
Personally I startet two weeks ago with the Mutaflor Mite, and are now taken 2 capsules per day of the normal Mutaflor with no ill effects.
At the same time I am using another probiotic to build up the Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium. Personally I used Dr. Wolz Darmflora Plus Select Intens, which is not only the strongest probiotic I could find when it comes to bacteria per capsule. But it also has the widest variety of them. Also many strains are included which I have come along regarding treatment of depression etc. The content is as follows:
100 x 10^9 cultures:
Lactobacillus acidophilus
Lactococcus lactis
Bifidobacterium lactis
Lactobacillus salivarius
Lactobacillus reuteri
Lactobacillus delbrueckii subsp. bulgaricus
Bifidobacterium breve
Lactobacillus gasseri
Lactobacillus fermentum
Lactobacillus rhamnosus
Bifidobacterium longum
Bifidobacterium infantis
Lactobacillus brevis
Streptococcus thermophilus
Lactobacillus paracasei
Lactobacillus casei
Lactobacillus plantarum
Bifidobacterium bifidum
An English product website would be:
https://www.wolz.de/en/products/for-a-healthy-intestinal-tract/darmflora-plus-select-intens-dr-wolz/
You can see that this product also includes one strain of Streptococcus, which hopefully later helps with the Serotonin production. At the moment there is no way of supplementing Enterococcus.
At the moment I take 2 of the capsules in the morning and 2 in the evening, as intended by the manufacture. With no ill effects.
I will give it some time and then will additionally supplement with Inulin as a prebiotic to feed these bacteria. I am still waiting a litte bit, because obviously I don't want any of the guys already living in my gut feasting on the delicious Inulin and further growing. The new kids on the block need a little HQ first and then hopefully will have a better chance fighting their grounds.
In 1-2 months I will also get another test done by the German lab (Ubiome would take too long), to see if there is already some changing taking place. But I expect the whole treatment to take at least 3 months.
Two months ago I send my stool sample to Ubiome, and at the same time to a German lab (ordered online). The Ubiome results took more than 6 weeks to get back (probably due to a hold up on the border).
Good news is, both lab tests came back with equal results. Giving that they both use quite different ways of testing the sample (to Ubiome you send back a small cotton stick, to the other lab I had to send back a whole small bottle full of poop), that gave me confidence that they are both actually doing a pretty good job at testing.
The major findings:
Interestingly Ubiome said that I am deficient in GABA and Serotonin producing bacteria:
Indeed from 2011 to Jan 2018 I took a SSRI for anxiety and panic disorder. Since one year I don't take it anymore but feel that I should, as stepping out of the general comfort zone comes again with panic attacks, which during that time have been rare.
The bacterii mentioned here are Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium, as well as Streptococcus and Enterococcus.
On a different page Ubiome basically shows 0% Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium. Personally I don't know if it is truly 0% but it seems to be low.
The German lab has the same findings:
They didn't test for Streptococcus, but for a different bacteria which Ubiome doesn't seem to test for, or at least it doesn't include it in their major findings. And that bacteria is E. coli.
While most of us associate E. coli with the consumption of some bad food and some days being ill, it is actually quite a necessary citizen of the gut. It provides the anaerobe living conditions which other bacterii like Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium need for survival. Now you can see why these are missing, too. They don't have any good habitat to live in.
Any supplementing with probiotics would be absolutely futile without addressing the E. coli problem first.
Streptococcus and Enterococcus on the other hand get their daily food via so called cross feeding by byproducts from Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium. Again, it is no surprise that these are missing, too.
In conclusion, the low level of both GABA and Serotonin producing bacteria start with the absolute lack of E. coli bacteria in my gut. I don't know what caused this in the first place (no use of Antibiotics as far as I can remember), but that problem would have to be addressed first.
The solution:
Thankfully there is the possibility for supplementing with E. coli without getting sick doing so. Already 1917 there was the Nissle strain of E. coli discovered in Germany. While being very beneficial for the body it has no side effects. Many things could be written about that strain, but you can find all the information on the English Mutaflor website:
https://www.mutaflor.com/mutaflor-w...=false&cHash=b4e7d1c7a0d545f53d051a2226ff3b9b
In Germany you can get it in three different forms:
a) Mutaflor
b) Mutaflor Mite: which is around 1/5 of the dose per capsule of the Mutaflor. It is used in the first two weeks for easing into the program.
c) Mutaflor Suspension: which is so low concentrated that it is used to treat new born babies. It seems that some of these poor creatures already have to go through antibiotic treatment. These are then used to rebuild the gut from the get go. By the way, this is the best sign that you are really not dealing with any harmful species here.
The goal is to take 2 capsules in the morning of the normal Mutaflor for 3 months. One package with 100 capsules comes around 100 bucks, so it is not the cheapest of probiotic treatments. The capsules have to be stored in the fridge and have to be ordered in a way that they are delivered cool.
Personally I startet two weeks ago with the Mutaflor Mite, and are now taken 2 capsules per day of the normal Mutaflor with no ill effects.
At the same time I am using another probiotic to build up the Lactobacillus and Bifidobacterium. Personally I used Dr. Wolz Darmflora Plus Select Intens, which is not only the strongest probiotic I could find when it comes to bacteria per capsule. But it also has the widest variety of them. Also many strains are included which I have come along regarding treatment of depression etc. The content is as follows:
100 x 10^9 cultures:
Lactobacillus acidophilus
Lactococcus lactis
Bifidobacterium lactis
Lactobacillus salivarius
Lactobacillus reuteri
Lactobacillus delbrueckii subsp. bulgaricus
Bifidobacterium breve
Lactobacillus gasseri
Lactobacillus fermentum
Lactobacillus rhamnosus
Bifidobacterium longum
Bifidobacterium infantis
Lactobacillus brevis
Streptococcus thermophilus
Lactobacillus paracasei
Lactobacillus casei
Lactobacillus plantarum
Bifidobacterium bifidum
An English product website would be:
https://www.wolz.de/en/products/for-a-healthy-intestinal-tract/darmflora-plus-select-intens-dr-wolz/
You can see that this product also includes one strain of Streptococcus, which hopefully later helps with the Serotonin production. At the moment there is no way of supplementing Enterococcus.
At the moment I take 2 of the capsules in the morning and 2 in the evening, as intended by the manufacture. With no ill effects.
I will give it some time and then will additionally supplement with Inulin as a prebiotic to feed these bacteria. I am still waiting a litte bit, because obviously I don't want any of the guys already living in my gut feasting on the delicious Inulin and further growing. The new kids on the block need a little HQ first and then hopefully will have a better chance fighting their grounds.
In 1-2 months I will also get another test done by the German lab (Ubiome would take too long), to see if there is already some changing taking place. But I expect the whole treatment to take at least 3 months.
