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Simon Wessely and his statement, "Benefits can often make these patients worse" (1993)

Dolphin

Senior Member
Messages
17,567
I don't think Simon Wessely is that close to insurance companies, unlike Peter White, Michael Sharpe, etc.

But that doesn't mean he hasn't influenced whether people got disability payments or not.

See for example this presentation from 1993 to the Disability Living Allowance Advisory Board in the UK (a State disability payment), which ends, "Benefits can often make patients worse".


1993 talk summary to disability board.png
 

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
Sorry for this question but for those of us not in the UK, who is Simon Wessley (what is his title or position) and why is he so full of hate? What is wrong with this man?
 
Messages
13,774
I don't think he's full of hate at all. I think that the way he's treated patient's is despicable, but don't get any sense that it's motivated by his hatred of them.

He's now President of the Royal College of Psychiatrists, but he started building his career with psychosocial CFS stuff, and has had a lot of influence over how patients in the UK are treated.
 
Messages
15,786
Where's his evidence that doctors perpetuate ME/CFS in patients? The psychobabblers never miss a chance to wave the "you make ME patients sick by investigating or treating them" flag, yet I have never seen a single study on the subject, much less one which even remotely supports that statement.

The claim that belief in physical origins of symptoms leads to a bad prognosis has also since been disproven. Any retraction of that bullshit? Certainly not.

And, of course, it has also been demonstrated by a group of Dutch psychobabblers that exercise, even when gently graded and accompanied by CBT, results in no physical improvement. Maybe he should clarify that bit too, while he's at it :rolleyes:

Sir Simon Wessely has been proven wrong regarding pretty much every statement he's ever made about ME/CFS. I guess that's why he's moved on to GWS, since there's not quite so overwhelming an amount of information contradicting him there yet.
 

chipmunk1

Senior Member
Messages
765
I don't think he's full of hate at all. I think that the way he's treated patient's is despicable, but don't get any sense that it's motivated by his hatred of them.
He's now President of the Royal College of Psychiatrists, but he started building his career with psychosocial CFS stuff, and has had a lot of influence over how patients in the UK are treate

Psychobabble is a great way to advance one's medical career. You don't have a tangible product that you promote. You don't produce or create anything at all asides from random babbling.

you can sound like an expert by making up complicated terms despite complete lack of knowledge on the subject, you never have to prove your ideas scientifically as they exist only in a metaphysical world - the mind. Everyone looks down on "mental" patients they can't protest or question you without looking like fools.
 

WillowJ

คภภเє ɠรค๓թєl
Messages
4,940
Location
WA, USA
Sorry for this question but for those of us not in the UK, who is Simon Wessley (what is his title or position)

Employed as a researcher, professor, department head, Vice Dean, etc. and clinician at the Department of Psychological Medicine, Institute of Psychiatry, King's College London (& some other clinics). Is a Foundation Senior Investigator of the National Institute for Health Research. Was knighted recently. Apparently newly president of the Royal College of Psychiatrists (this year). Has friends in the House of Lords.

To hear him talk (I've heard recordings), sounds pleasant, funny, and charming. Exactly the sort of person one would invite to a Christmas party. It's not surprising his colleagues, the journals (e.g. BMJ, the Lancet) and some of the Lords think well of him (as they don't appear to actually read his studies).
 

Firestormm

Senior Member
Messages
5,055
Location
Cornwall England
Was it 'his statement'. I mean to say it wasn't a quote from him was it? It was a summary of what he said written by someone else.

I only mention really as I have seen it now on the internet as 'quote from Simon Wessely'.

Of course he does endorse it by what he said yesterday on Twitter.

Just thought I'd mention.

Not saying I don't think it wholly unfounded - unless you are talking in the abstract world of psychiatry and 'behaviour' with no objective evidence to back it up...

Totally the wrong thing to imply (or say) at a meeting with the DWP. No wonder we are where we are...
 

A.B.

Senior Member
Messages
3,780
Working for insurance companies or other entities with financial interests in dismissing illnesses can make you say nonsense such as "benefits can make patients worse" and "doctors contribute to perpetuating the illness".

His philosophy is all about disempowering patients. Keep them away from doctors, keep them away from support groups, dismantle their social networks, refuse financial assistence, blame them for everything.
 
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Antares in NYC

Senior Member
Messages
582
Location
USA
Working for insurance companies or other entities with financial interests in dismissing illnesses can make you say nonsense such as "benefits can make patients worse" and "doctors contribute to perpetuating the illness".

His philosophy is all about disempowering patients. Keep them away from doctors, keep them away from support groups, dismantle their social networks, refuse financial assistence, blame them for everything.
...and don't forget: make patients do jumping jacks to "get over" their "psychosomatic obsession" with the "so-called" fatigue.
 

WillowJ

คภภเє ɠรค๓թєl
Messages
4,940
Location
WA, USA

Gingergrrl

Senior Member
Messages
16,171
I started to read his quotes but had to stop as they were making me ill. I don't understand though why his opinion is given so much merit? Is it mostly financial and if the UK attributes ME/CFS to a psychological cause, they therefore no longer have to carry out a thorough medical investigation of symptoms (i.e. save money.)

Also, he seems to contradict himself b/c in one quote he admits that ME/CFS can occur after "serious" infections like mono, hepatitis, and viral meningitis so who is he to decide whose infection was "serious" vs. "non-serious?" His quotes were crazy-making to read!