Prusty talks about his upcoming research on a podcast

Oliver3

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After listening to Dr. Prusty's interview I really cannot understand why we are not as the whole ME/CFS community persuing clinical trials with anti-purinergic therapy.

On the following post I have compiled a lot of literature indicating that anti-purinergic therapy seems to revert the abnormalities described by Dr Prusty and Dr Phair as part of their HHV-6/Fibronectin1 and itaconate/IFNa etiopathigenic models for ME/CFS, respectively:

https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...d-abnormalities-in-me-cfs.90173/#post-2435206

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11302-022-09852-8
 
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Yes, I fear we might have to re-listen to the podcast again and I think even after that it won't be clear since he might just have forgotten to mention if it's cFn or pFn, plus the talk was a little unstructured.

Unfortunately, I don't have the energy to re-listen to the podcast (I can't listen to things well), but I've been trying to use a transciption software for audio and video files. It's currently transcribing. If it turns out any good I will upload the transcript here.
I think he said both plasma and cellular is elevated. Cant remember what source i heard that from though, maybe it was in Tess Falors live tweets.
 

Osaca

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I think he said both plasma and cellular is elevated. Cant remember what source i heard that from though, maybe it was in Tess Falors live tweets.
In Isabel Ramirez-Burnett Tweets it says "Both cellular and plasma fibronectin is increased in mecfs", however from there onwards it isn't clear when he is talking about what, the same holds for the interview. For the nIgM I think we can maybe assume it's lower for the set of pFn and cFn. We'll have to wait for the paper for the proper details.
 

Osaca

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I believe this is the study Prusty was referring to in connection to Fibronectin: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34024298/. It has a very similar flair to his finding (apart from the nIgM finding) and argues that Fibronectin could be a better biomarker than an PCR-test for Trypanosoma cruzi as it measures treatment effects better (since PCR doesn't asses tissue damage and cardiac alternations). They saw that in T. cruzi a cysteine protease (the major enzyme on this illness that causes protein degradation) degrades fibronectin during infection, and this may play a role in host cell invasion.

They looked at 2 things pFn and dFn (fibronectin degradation fragments, something like fibronectin is being broken down). It seems like cFn levels weren't relevant to their results (or maybe it's harder to test for). Their main results were mouse studies where they observed, that:

In the acute phase pFn went down and pFn stayed decreased in the chonic phase of the disease. Looking at the dFn levels they showed that treatment can reverse degradation of fibronectin in the acute phase, but in the chronic phase it can only halt the degradation. They were able to show dFn correlated with disease severity. Their conclusion was that fibronectin degradation can be a biomarker for cardiac tissue damage.

Relevant to us they state "These results warrant the development of easier and more quantitative tests to measure fibronectin degradation, including as ELISA or immunochromatographic rapid tests for the point of care monitoring of disease progression and response to treatment in patients. Fibronectin is present in blood at a relatively high concentration of about 0.6 mg mL−1 in mice and 0.3 mg mL−1 in humans (Mosesson and Umfleet, 1970; Zardi et al., 1979) supporting the feasibility of such tests. On the other hand, fibronectin degradation may not be specific to T. cruzi infection as it is a target for other pathogens (Speziale et al., 2019), and this should be further investigated."

So maybe this team has already developed fibronectin tests that could be relevant to us. It should also be possible to assess our dFn levels. None of this is specific, but could be made part of a biomarker platform.
 

Judee

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Did I just found a connection with the clotting and platelets theory ?

Screenshot 2023-06-05 082243.jpg

I also read something regarding microvesticles and possibly low IgM. It sounded like clotting.

I couldn't remember the terminology but another thread title reminded me. I'll try to search later for the actual study 'cause I still don't remember the wording.

Edit: Here it is: https://ashpublications.org/blood/a...al-IgM-antibodies-inhibit-microvesicle-driven

Natural IgM antibodies inhibit microvesicle-driven coagulation and thrombosis​

so if IgM is low...?
 
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Osaca

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Natural IgM antibodies inhibit microvesicle-driven coagulation and thrombosis​

Has the coagulation factor X/Xa, which is somehow the problem here and is the thing with which the nIgM LR04 competes and in turn lowers coagulation, been looked at before in ME/CFS or LC research? (I don't really find anything relevant, I can find someone mentioning it for acute Covid, but not specifically or very relevant as by now anything that exists has been mentioned in connection to acute Covid). In Pretorius' work for example factor XIII seems more relevant.
 

Oliver3

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In Isabel Ramirez-Burnett Tweets it says "Both cellular and plasma fibronectin is increased in mecfs", however from there onwards it isn't clear when he is talking about what, the same holds for the interview. For the nIgM I think we can maybe assume it's lower for the set of pFn and cFn. We'll have to wait for the paper for the proper details.

Scuse my ignorance but is this the sane thing being talked about post COVID infection
 

Rufous McKinney

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Scuse my ignorance but is this the sane thing being talked about post COVID infection

Dr. Aguirre-Chang posts alot of info on micro-clotting, how to determine if you have clotting trouble, and protocols for clearing it. Have you looked at any of that info? I think he has posted some of it here in PR.
 

Countrygirl

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https://www.healthrising.org/blog/2...RF2QkCoMqWBBxmZHqfNw7rvkABcgYS-MDd2_SMWleh4eo

Prusty on Herpesviruses, Messed Up Mitochondria and a Biomarker for ME/CFS and Long COVID (?)​

by Cort Johnson

Bhupesh Prusty is good at making waves. He and Bob Naviaux raised eyebrows in 2020 when their study showed that an HHV-6 infection might not only be damaging the mitochondria – putting the cell into a cell danger state – but also appeared to cause the cell to be pumping something into the serum that was doing the same thing to other cells.

Explaining ME/CFS? Prusty / Naviaux Study Ties Infections to Energy Breakdowns

Then last year Prusty found that miRNA’s produced by herpesvirus-infected cells were at least in part responsible for the mitochondrial fragmentation found. Plus in a small autopsy study he found evidence of widespread HHV-6/EBV activation across the brains of people with ME/CFS.

The Prusty Files: HHV-6 Found in the Brains of ME/CFS Patients

An enthusiastic researcher Prusty primed the pump in the weeks leading up to the Charite and Invest in ME conference he recently presented at on his Twitter account stating:

“We will announce a biomarker for #MECFS and #LongCovid very soon. A very interesting piece of the puzzle to unfold in coming weeks. Knowingly I did not use the word ‘Novel Biomarker’ as a lot is known about it and that is actually a very good news. Fingers crossed!”
I saw Prusty’s presentation at the Charité conference, but it was so complex that I got completely lost halfway through. How good it was, then, to find (thanks to Jutta) the TLC Living with Long-COVID podcast where Prusty talked about his recent findings. Without that podcast, which focused on what appears to be a very large paper with multiple authors and multiple cohorts that was recently submitted, this blog would not exist.
 

Osaca

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344
A couple of weeks ago I commented about MBL and its possible connection to Prusty:
I thought it could be interesting to go through Prusty's Twitter profile and there are only two comments relevant for this dicussion that Prusty recently liked:
  • “The thing causing mito fragmentation was for a pwME subset the C1q auto abs. So when you showed that in 2019 I ran to get tested & I was positive. So maybe there’s something missing in the complement system (innate immunity), which is the first line of defence, now malfunctioning”
  • “Does a MBL2 gene mutation and subsequent mannose-binding lectin deficiency establish a vulnerability/predisposition for disease in your model?”
The first one is about the high levels of anti-C1q aabs we’ve already talked about.

The second one is a comment about a MBL2 gene mutation which leads to a deficiency in the protein mannose-binding lectin (MBL). MBL plays an important role in the immune system by fighting foreign invaders by attaching to them. This attachment then activates the lectin complement system. It is an alternative pathway to the classical complement C1q pathway with a similar mechanism. The clinical significance of MBL-Deficiency is debated and it seems like it only leads to a higher susceptibility to infections (unlike C1q deficiency, which leads to Lupus-like diseases). As of today reduced MBL levels seem to play some role in ME/CFS, but the results aren’t really significant, especially when compared to controls https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8465819/ (funnily enough Prusty was the editor of this paper!). It is something that also sees to play a part in Post-Covid Syndrome (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-32507-6) and is something that for example Scheibenbogen tests for in her current IA trial (https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT05710770). Both C1q and MBL modulate cytokine production at the mRNA and protein levels and as such play an important role at in the inflammatory response and the avoidance of autoimmunity.

MBL also has a second role, sort of as dirt “cleaner”, in which it binds senescent and apoptotic cells and enhances engulfment of apoptotic cells, as well as cell debris by phagocytes.

MBL is known to bind to SARS-COV-2, HIV, influenza A and seems to play a very small role in HSV-2, HSV-1. The relationship between MBL deficiency and HHV-6 and EBV is not really proven by anything substantial/interesting to us.

Finally there are no treatments at all, or that I could find, that address MBL deficiency. Furthermore it’s mostly produced in the liver and hardly has a connection to the bone marrow.

To summarise: Something to keep an eye on for the future, but probably nothing revolutionary, unless one of you can find out something that I was not able to.

Well here's the possible connection: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4354681/.
 

Rufous McKinney

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13,495
really outstanding summary....overview/ THANK YOU

the Discussion of sudden versus gradual/slow burner onset...is interesting. I was mildly SOMETHING for decades; but when I got MUCH worse that seemed to occur quite quickly....withim a few weeks.

I Like this theory because it's consistent with The Flow being impaired. I'd like to Go With the Flow, but something is often interfering with that...
 

wastwater

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I think it maybe the low C3 high C5 complement imbalance but this seems to be good for a few diseases like the earlier video I posted on acute covid
Others I’ve found that seem to share this imbalance are lupus,schizophrenia,aHUS,Alzheimer’s and maybe more,but they have different seemingly unrelated outcomes
Anyone tried Trypsin as suggested in the earlier video
Could lowering of C3 even in normal range be enough to cause diseases

My c3 and c4(low)are normal just got result
 
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Osaca

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344
Nope and he submitted to a journal that uploads the preprints once they accept to review (at least that's what he said).

The progress to accept or decline to review usually only takes a couple of days or at most a month, at least that's my knowledge. Maybe, there's some journals that take a bit longer with their decision and there's the possibilty of unlucky coincidences for example combinations of sick leaves and academic holidays, but usually this process is very quick (at least in terms of the duration of the publication process).

So if we don't hear anything in the next month or so, it's probably a decent guess that the submission (or the first few submissions) weren't successfull. I would think that Prusty would contact the journal himself around that point in time, would he not have heard back from them until then. Till then we'll have to wait and hope that the first submission is successful.
 
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