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Prof. Carmen Scheibenbogen Recommendation of nutritional supplements

SWAlexander

Senior Member
Messages
1,865
Translation:
Her latest video shows various options for treating ME/CFS and LC for the time being.
Recommendation of nutritional supplements
Nutritional supplement mitochondria metabolism.
Vitamin B1, B2, B3, B6 (vitamin B complex) for 4 weeks
CoenzymQ10 max 100 mg/day (Castro-Marrero J, 2021)
Ribose 3 x 5g (Teitelbaum, 2006)
N-acetylcysteine/NAC 2-3x 600mg capsules ( Shungu D, 2016)

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Mitochondria
Citrate cycle Glycolysis Glucose PDH
Pyruvate Ribose Lactate Fats
Lagin NADH
Vitamin B1 Amino acids
Respiratory chain
Coenzym010 NAD
H 82/3/6 H20/ROS
N-acetylcysteine ATP
 
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SWAlexander

Senior Member
Messages
1,865
B vitamins only for 4 weeks?
I don't know, she didn't elaborate.
My assumption would be coagulation.

Here is something from my archive:

Vitamins B1 (Thiamine), B2 (Riboflavin), B3 (Niacin), and B6 (Pyridoxine) are not directly involved in blood coagulation. The process of blood clotting primarily involves a different set of nutrients and biochemicals:
  1. Vitamin K: This is the most significant vitamin related to blood coagulation. Vitamin K is essential for the synthesis of various proteins that are required for blood clotting (coagulation factors). A deficiency in Vitamin K can lead to problems with blood clotting.
  2. Calcium: It plays a critical role in several steps of the coagulation cascade. Calcium ions are necessary for the proper function of many coagulation factors.
The B vitamins, on the other hand, have different primary functions:
  • Vitamin B1 (Thiamine): It plays a crucial role in energy metabolism, particularly in the metabolism of carbohydrates.
  • Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin): This vitamin is involved in energy production, cellular function, growth, and development. It also helps in the metabolism of fats, drugs, and steroids.
  • Vitamin B3 (Niacin): Niacin is important for DNA repair, metabolism, and the production of steroid hormones in the adrenal gland.
  • Vitamin B6 (Pyridoxine): It is involved in amino acid metabolism, red blood cell production, and the creation of neurotransmitters.
B vitamins are essential for overall health and play roles in many different physiological processes, they are not directly involved in the blood coagulation cascade unless von Willebrand factor (vWF) is present.
 

Alvin2

The good news is patients don't die the bad news..
Messages
2,941
Nutritional supplement mitochondria metabolism.
Vitamin B1, B2, B3, B6 (vitamin B complex) for 4 weeks
CoenzymQ10 max 100 mg/day (Castro-Marrero J, 2021)
Ribose 3 x 5g (Teitelbaum, 2006)
N-acetylcysteine/NAC 2-3x 600mg capsules ( Shungu D, 2016)
Tried all of them over the years, some minor effects but not game changing.
 

Alvin2

The good news is patients don't die the bad news..
Messages
2,941
I also feel some improvement, but no real benefit for the muscles or energy.
Maybe because I still have some cytosine elevation.
The Ribose helps me recover from PEM.
The Q10 gives some transient cognitive working memory improvement, but it doesn't last and if stop and restart it sometimes works again, sometimes not.
NAC helped improve sleep initiation and that has been permanent. Did nothing for my non 24 sleep timing though.
My everything i've tried thread explains it all.
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/threads/everything-ive-tried.87069/
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,182
Maybe I've never taken all these things at the same time.

NAC: I found a bottle of that, and now I can't find that.

It's been several years since I've taken NAC.

Ribose: I maybe tried and stopped for some vague reason.

generally: Im bad at taking anything consistently, so I read these things and think well, if I was just consistent.
 

heapsreal

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10,076
Location
australia (brisbane)
I pretty much take that and the couple of things I don't take,I've taken in the past. I don't think its earth shattering. The B vitamins are good for lowering high Homocysteine levels which are inflammatory, along with methylfolate.
It mentions nac twice. Looks like a good standard vitamin protocol for cfs. Id add a few more antioxidants and not limit the B vitamins to a few weeks.
Are they 2 different types of nac? One says nac Atp??
 

lenora

Senior Member
Messages
4,857
Q-10 (Enzyme CoQ-10) is only useful to the body until you're 50. You should then taken another form of it called Ubiquinol......and it's usually used for the heart. Mainstream medicine is beginning to adopt this formula. Yours, Lenora
 

SWAlexander

Senior Member
Messages
1,865
NAC helps with producing ATP
I'm not sure.
Bringing down inflammation would be my suggestion.
After experiencing the effects of methotrexate, I've realized that reducing inflammation and cytokines could potentially restore bodily functions, at least temporarily, in cases where there's no permanent damage.

Methotrexate significantly alleviated my inflammation, bringing a sense of normalcy and even quieting my lupus symptoms.
This experience confirmed that my body could function properly in the absence of inflammation.
However, I'm aware that methotrexate is a potent drug with potential side effects, making it unsuitable for long-term use as a permanent solution.
 

lyran

Senior Member
Messages
183
Q-10 (Enzyme CoQ-10) is only useful to the body until you're 50. You should then taken another form of it called Ubiquinol......and it's usually used for the heart. Mainstream medicine is beginning to adopt this formula. Yours, Lenora
Yes I have also read the same. Conversion of Ubiquinone to Ubiquinol slows down as we age. Also if you use statins, take either one depending of your age because statins reduce cholestrol and Q10 is formed from cholestrol.
 

SWAlexander

Senior Member
Messages
1,865
statins reduce cholestrol and Q10 is formed from cholestrol.
I read this too. Both cholesterol and CoQ10 share the same biosynthetic pathway.

Coenzyme Q10 (CoQ10) levels in the body can be influenced by a variety of factors:
  1. Age: As you age, the natural production of CoQ10 in your body tends to decrease. This reduction is one of the reasons why CoQ10 supplementation is often considered for older adults.
  2. Nutritional Status: Your diet plays a significant role in CoQ10 levels. Foods like organ meats, fatty fish, and whole grains are rich in CoQ10. A diet lacking these foods might lead to lower levels of CoQ10.
  3. Health Conditions: Certain health conditions, especially those affecting the heart, liver, or kidneys, can impact CoQ10 levels.
  4. Oxidative Stress and Inflammation: High levels of oxidative stress and chronic inflammation can deplete CoQ10, as it is used to combat oxidative damage in the body.
 
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Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
5,639
Location
Alberta
Does she have any reliable data showing that the supplements have a noticeable effect on symptoms? There are plenty of supplements that have theoretical benefits, but as many of us have learned, they don't make a real difference in how we feel. Occasionally we might find one that does have a positive effect, but possibly not via the theoretical mechanism, and it doesn't have that effect on anyone else.
 

lenora

Senior Member
Messages
4,857
I have been on every single one of those supplements over the years, sometimes together for long periods of time. I found they make no difference....and where is B-12? Now they may help some people, but it's definitely not a blanket approach. She deserves high marks for trying, though. Yours, Lenora