Possible UTI and nitrofurantoin safety, troubleshooting

[frozenborderline]

I did not know that ketamine can affect the bladder, but I just learnt that it can. And it looks like it can turn into a potentially irreversible issue called ketamine bladder syndrome (aka ketamine cystitis). This article says:



I guess the question is, do you have this ketamine cystitis, or just an UTI?

I don't know how I would tell. Not only are there overlapping symptoms but there may be similar etiology. Apparently a lot of people with interstitial cystitis which.can be triggered by ketamine also have chronic utis , there is controversy about that.

When I searched for stuff on the overlap it seems like many ketamine users think they get utis caused by it.

 

[frozenborderline]

Have you looked into biofilm busters like nattokinase or lumbrokinase? Supplements can be mighty useful and have less than a nuclear bomb effect some pharmaceuticals have...

I had those st home but didnt take on plane flight. Don't you still need an antibiotic even if the biofilm busters help with the biofilm ?

Nitrofurantoin raised risk of. oxalates and kidney stones by 2-3 times. About 10% of the males in the US have them and getting rid the f them is awful.... Best to not nksdt all your oxalate degrading with an antibiotic.

I could see this as a long term risk but do you think it is a significant short term risk. Bc my doctor says that this is the first step to tell if I have a UTI. Its diagnostic, not just therapeutic. I
I'm fine with possible short term issues my main concern is just making sure 5his antibiotic isn't similar to fluoroquinolones and doesnt cause permanent damage with one course.

 

[frozenborderline]

I did not know that ketamine can affect the bladder, but I just learnt that it can. And it looks like it can turn into a potentially irreversible issue called ketamine bladder syndrome (aka ketamine cystitis). This article says:



I guess the question is, do you have this ketamine cystitis, or just an UTI?

I guess next step would be a urologist to see if I had this. I just don't know why at the modest doses I've taken i.could be on it for years and then suddenly I have a problem. Thays why i wondered if a UTI could play a role. Is it really an either or? I'm wondering if it could be a problem that is combined... like the UTI makes one more sensitive to inflammation from ketamine.

 

[Hip]

I guess next step would be a urologist to see if I had this. I just don't know why at the modest doses I've taken i.could be on it for years and then suddenly I have a problem. Thays why i wondered if a UTI could play a role. Is it really an either or? I'm wondering if it could be a problem that is combined... like the UTI makes one more sensitive to inflammation from ketamine.

Yes, I could it be case of having both. Hopefully it is just an infection, which should be treatable, so that you can continue with getting pain relief from ketamine.

Did you see this post about LDN being effective for neuropathic pain?

 

[frozenborderline]

Did you see this post about LDN being effective for neuropathic pain?

I often take ldn but I also don't have neuropathic pain... it's more like arthritic pain, caused by an acute inflammatoty injury to tissue rather than nerve signaling. So it would be treated different than nerve pain I think

Yes, I could it be case of having both. Hopefully it is just an infection, which should be treatable, so that you can continue with getting pain relief from ketamine.

I'll keep my fingers crossed. I find it comforting that most people don't get these issues with my dose range, but I also seem to have terrible luck, so trying 6o not get my hopes up

 

[Learner1]

Oxskates

I had those st home but didnt take on plane flight. Don't you still need an antibiotic even if the biofilm busters help with the biofilm ?

I could see this as a long term risk but do you think it is a significant short term risk. Bc my doctor says that this is the first step to tell if I have a UTI. Its diagnostic, not just therapeutic. I
I'm fine with possible short term issues my main concern is just making sure 5his antibiotic isn't similar to fluoroquinolones and doesnt cause permanent damage with one course.

Oxalates are pretty much a permanent problem, caused by antibiotics. There are no probiotics in the market to make them go away, htstva difficult diet and diligent supplement use. If I were in your shoes, I'd be looking at natural ways to get rid of the UTI, if in fact you have one.

Antibiotics fail to be effective in many cases because the bugs are covered with a nice later of biofilms. The biofilm buster breaks up the biofilms so the antibiotics or other treatment can do their job.

 

[frozenborderline]

Oxalates are pretty much a permanent problem, caused by antibiotics. There are no probiotics in the market to make them go away, htstva difficult diet and diligent supplement use. If I were in your shoes, I'd be looking at natural ways to get rid of the UTI, if in fact you have one.

Its something I will consider more now but I feel in a very difficult position as my doctor recommended this as the way to find out if I have aUTI, and if I don't have a UTI and have ketamine sensitivity I need to know asapso I can cure that. If I do have a UTI thays great and I need to treat it so I can go back to taking ketamine. This is ultra important. Besides d mannose , which has evidence for treating some bacteria I haven't found super strong evidence based treatments for utis yet. I'm more nervous about taking the course of antibiotics now but I also don't know if I have a choice. It's hard to know whether 5o go based on advice of my doctor or not.

Like if I don't deal with this I won't ever know whether I can take this quality of life saving med or not.

 

[frozenborderline]

Antibiotics fail to be effective in many cases because the bugs are covered with a nice later of biofilms. The biofilm buster breaks up the biofilms so the antibiotics or other treatment can do their job.

Right I'm aware of this. I just don't know what antibiotic I would use wi th the biofilm busters as they don't work on their own

 

[Learner1]

Right I'm aware of this. I just don't know what antibiotic I would use wi th the biofilm busters as they don't work on their own

You might try the biofilm buster with natural treatments. Or consult with your doctor.

 

[frozenborderline]

You might try the biofilm buster with natural treatments. Or consult with your doctor.

My doctor wants me to try nitrofurantoin before getting any tests. So I think I have no other choice

 

[Learner1]

My doctor wants me to try nitrofurantoin before getting any tests. So I think I have no other choice

Actually, you are not the hostage of your doctor and can do whatever you like.

Typically, it is good to follow the advice of someone with more years of medical education than you do, but doctors are not always correct. They are making their best guess of what they think is good for you. And, they typically make that guess pretty fast. I have seen doctors change their minds about what to do when given more information or asked about the risks or asked about other alternatives.

There are pros and cons to any treatment, and unfortunately, sometimes there is no undoing what has been done, even if it was the wrong thing to or it seemed like a good idea at the time. I have been damaged by multiple drugs, even have been apologized to by my doctors when faced with the evidence, and if I had things to do over, I wouldn't be so quick to follow my doctor's advice.

If us always good to ask questions, understand the potential risk sbc benefits of any treatment, and if the doctor is insistent and not offering sound explanations, sometimes it's best to go get a second opinion before doing something that can't be undone.

Or, you can just sign your fate over to your doctor.

 

[frozenborderline]

Actually, you are not the hostage of your doctor and can do whatever you like.

Typically, it is good to follow the advice of someone with more years of medical education than you do, but doctors are not always correct. They are making their best guess of what they think is good for you. And, they typically make that guess pretty fast. I have seen doctors change their minds about what to do when given more information or asked about the risks or asked about other alternatives.

There are pros and cons to any treatment, and unfortunately, sometimes there is no undoing what has been done, even if it was the wrong thing to or it seemed like a good idea at the time. I have been damaged by multiple drugs, even have been apologized to by my doctors when faced with the evidence, and if I had things to do over, I wouldn't be so quick to follow my doctor's advice.

If us always good to ask questions, understand the potential risk sbc benefits of any treatment, and if the doctor is insistent and not offering sound explanations, sometimes it's best to go get a second opinion before doing something that can't be undone.

Or, you can just sign your fate over to your doctor.

I get what you're saying, and I think if you have read everything I've posted you'd know that I do not blindly follow doctors, but I cant question or second guess every single prescription and every decision a doctor makes. I do a lot of my own research but since I'm currently very I'll and near Whitney's level of illness I can't expend my energy on anything beyond a path of finding some level of palliative care and comfort with the tiny bit of energy I have left. If i had to research every single prescription i had , or ask my doctor to change it to something else often, not only would i not be building a relationship with my doctor where they'd see me as a patient who was willing to work with them, I'd also exhaust myself over minor stuff like. a UTI prescription, when I think I'll need my energy t figure out more important things.

In this case it doesn't seem like any "natural" things have that much evidence for them, and the other antibiotics used, including fluoroquinolones , are often worse.

I think it's not reasonable for patients to have to do all their own research.

 

[5vforest]

Hey @frozenborderline, just wanted to check in on you since it's been a few weeks since you posted in this thread. Did you end up taking the antibiotics?

I also have had chronic UTI. Saw all the urologists, even had a cystoscopy (terrible experience), antibiotics, etc etc but never any answers.

I ended up getting a culture done from https://microgendx.com/ which was moderately helpful.

 

[ChrisD]

Sorry for hijacking this thread but I want to add and share my story:

ME since 2017
Epididymitis orchalgia occurred in 2018 after a high dose probiotic regimen.
It responded to doxycycline but made my fatigue worse and then after course the pain came back.
Almost 3 years of orchalgia pain which I never considered could be a UTI until recently when I was recommended to see a UTI specialist.
They recognised my symptoms as a UTI and prescribed Cefalexin and Hiprex to which I responded a little bit not much.
Have just started new course of Lymecycline and Hiprex to see if that penetrates deeper.

My ME symptoms are quite bad at the minute but it's complex because I also have Lyme and Bart, so the abx may be interacting with those infections too.

I'm a little bit sceptical about whether Hiprex could have ill effects on ME as it makes the urine acidic and even though I don't necessarily subscribe to the whole acid/alkali diet/lifestyle business. I'm wondering if there's any reason that creating an acidic state could be bad??

 

[lenora]

Sorry for hijacking this thread but I want to add and share my story:

ME since 2017
Epididymitis orchalgia occurred in 2018 after a high dose probiotic regimen.
It responded to doxycycline but made my fatigue worse and then after course the pain came back.
Almost 3 years of orchalgia pain which I never considered could be a UTI until recently when I was recommended to see a UTI specialist.
They recognised my symptoms as a UTI and prescribed Cefalexin and Hiprex to which I responded a little bit not much.
Have just started new course of Lymecycline and Hiprex to see if that penetrates deeper.

My ME symptoms are quite bad at the minute but it's complex because I also have Lyme and Bart, so the abx may be interacting with those infections too.

I'm a little bit sceptical about whether Hiprex could have ill effects on ME as it makes the urine acidic and even though I don't necessarily subscribe to the whole acid/alkali diet/lifestyle business. I'm wondering if there's any reason that creating an acidic state could be bad??

Chris.....Sorry that you're feeling so bad and hope it won't be long until you're at least back to your "normal". No words of wisdom, but it just goes to show that our bodies are all different. Yours, Lenora.

 

[Markus83]

They recognised my symptoms as a UTI and prescribed Cefalexin and Hiprex to which I responded a little bit not much.

Males don't have UTI's, they have prostatitis (I assume that you are male). This has to be treated different (at least 4 weeks of abx in chronic stage) and with special antibiotics. Did you have an antibiogram, so that you know which bug causes the problem and which antibiotic could theoretically work?

Tetracyclines (like lymecycline) can penetrate prostate quite good, but this alone doesn't help if the bug is not sensitive against the antibiotic. So the most important thing to have is an antibiogram.