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Parasites escaping my red blood cells 48 hours later? Microscope image.

nsdn

Senior Member
Messages
183
According to the test those filaments that come out appear at 48 hours and not before. What do you think?

Best regards.

@Hip @vortex @serg1942

campo oscuro.jpg
 

nsdn

Senior Member
Messages
183
Very likely nonsense. It's a so called dark-field microscopy done by an alternative physician, right?
She's a doctor. She is the most successful doctor in Spain in treatment, especially in multiple chemical sensitivity. Although she sells her own genetic test, she interpreted several Livewello reports to adapt the treatment to my genetics and immunological analyses. Today I got the picture but I haven't talked to her yet. I know she doesn't do aggressive treatments.
 

Markus83

Senior Member
Messages
277
I know such pictures from German quacks, and they often, too, wait several days before "something" comes out of the erythrocytes. In Germany they nearly always see the Lyme spirochete, I guess because that's the "latest" disease here which is diagnosed by quacks. In the past they have diagnosed candida and so on. But I'm not a microbiologist and I don't want to say something wrong concerning your picture. After all there parasites like the malaria plasmodium which are diagnosed via microscopy. But this is done by special trained microbiologists and it is restricted to a few infections (e.g. it is not suitable for Lyme disease, but the quacks claim it would be). So to be sure, ask a microbiologist who works with parasites, maybe in a medical lab or university hospital.

I hope others can say more but I'm convinced that it is most likely nonsense what your doc told you.
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
According to the test those filaments that come out appear at 48 hours and not before. What do you think?

It will be interesting to hear how your doctor explains this. I have not come across this before, and don't know if it is considered a legitimate means of diagnosis or just some alternative medicine stuff.


I found this page and video (in Spanish) which describes the difference between two types of filaments that can appear in the blood: espiroquetas (spirochetes) and condritos (I cannot find the English translation, so I don't know what they mean by "condritos").

The page says:
With this video we want to clarify the error that some therapists make by confusing spirochetes with chondrites that appear in the blood in vivo. The video shows the totally different structure of spirochetes (corkscrew shape) and chondrites (pearl shape or dotted).

This does not mean that spirochetes can not be seen in the blood in vivo, simply that we should not confuse between them.
 

nsdn

Senior Member
Messages
183
Thank you all for your opinions. The curious thing is that they only appear after 48h. Before the extraction he explained to me that what he wants is to "drown them" and get them out. She relies more on this test than on laboratory tests. After receiving this PDF I haven't had a consultation with the doctor nor do I know if the treatment is going to change. I will inform them.
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
@nsdn, do you know the English translation of the Spanish word "condritos" found in the blood?

The only translation I can find is "meteorite" (a rock that falls from space).
 

nsdn

Senior Member
Messages
183
I'm sorry. I forgot to answer you.

I don't know. I wrote an email to the address on the YouTube video. If he responds I'll tell you.
 

Markus83

Senior Member
Messages
277
Here you can see a vid from a german doc. Looks pretty much like yours, but he says it's Lyme:
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
There is an old thread here about detecting Borrelia spirochete bacteria using a microscope.

It details Prof Morten Laane's microscopy technique for detecting Borrelia in the blood. Here is a post from that thread:
An article about Prof Morten Laane's microscopy technique can be found here, and a video here.

His 2013 paper is here:
A simple method for the detection of live Borrelia spirochaetes in human blood using classical microscopy techniques

In this paper he says the technique is simply to add a tiny amount of sodium citrate solution to the patient's drop of blood on the microscopy slide, "which for unknown reasons seems to further stimulate replication of Borrelia". Under these conditions, he says that Borrelia might appear both inside and outside the red blood cells.



This 2017 paper talks about using sodium citrate as an anticoagulant in the blood to increase the yield of Borrelia from from blood plasma samples.
 
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Markus83

Senior Member
Messages
277
Laane's microscopy technique was debunked in a 2016 study. 85% in the healthy control group were positive for borrelia or babesia: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27030913

The structures interpreted as Borrelia and Babesia by the LM-method could not be verified by PCR. The method was, thus, falsified. This study underlines the importance of doing proper test validation before new or modified assays are introduced.

Keep in mind that Laane is a professional, so you can think what normal MDs are seeing.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
85% in the healthy control group were positive for borrelia or babesia: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27030913

Thinking of my ubiome results, which identified 7.7% of my microbiome at the phylum level as Spirochaetes, not further identified from the order down to the specie level, there must be many more species than borrelia or babesia only. Though harmless in comparison.
 

Mel9

Senior Member
Messages
995
Location
NSW Australia
Thinking of my ubiome results, which identified 7.7% of my microbiome at the phylum level as Spirochaetes, not further identified from the order down to the specie level, there must be many more species than borrelia or babesia only. Though harmless in comparison.


Yes, there are many common Spirochaetes apart from Borrelia.

If Next Generation Sequencing was used for your Ubiome testing, the company will have the sequences for each Spirochaete found.

They could easily compare these sequences with known sequences of known species in the NCBI data base (to give you the identity of these Spirochaetes).

But This involves a lot of time and effort on their part so is usually avoided.

I wonder if the paper (Aase et al, 2016) above used incorrect PCR primers for their PCR? The false positives do look ‘odd’.
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
Maybe these filaments that grow out of blood cells are actually filopodia "tentacles" extending from macrophages in the blood.

Macrophage cells will sprout these long filaments called filopodia in order to help the macrophage find the bacteria in its immediately vicinity, which the macrophage then ingests and destroys by phagocytosis.

The image below shows filopodia extending from a macrophage as it tries to "feel" for the bacteria, and the tiny elongated objects all around the macrophage are E. coli bacteria.

1556066509172.png

A lung macrophage and its filopodia searching for bacteria.
Electron microscope picture.

Source: here
 
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roller

wiggle jiggle
Messages
775
I wonder if the paper (Aase et al, 2016) above used incorrect PCR primers for their PCR? The false positives do look ‘odd’.

three test methods: dark field, microscope (conventional method), PCR
and the wrongest method of all was the conventional microscope which found nothing nowhere.
its the one the regular patient is subjected to ?
 

Mel9

Senior Member
Messages
995
Location
NSW Australia
Maybe these filaments that grow out of blood cells are actually filopodia "tentacles" extending from macrophages in the blood.

Macrophage cells will sprout these long filaments called filopodia in order to help the macrophage find the bacteria in its immediately vicinity, which the macrophage then ingests and destroys by phagocytosis.

The image below shows filopodia extending from a macrophage as it tries to "feel" for the bacteria, and the tiny elongated objects all around the macrophage are E. coli bacteria.

View attachment 32407
A lung macrophage and its filopodia searching for bacteria.
Electron microscope picture.

Source: here


Beautiful electron microscope photo! But it is a white cell rather than red blood cell. Also, there is no scale bar so one cannot be sure about the length and thickness of the filaments. Actually, that’s a problem with the rbc light photo too isn’t it?
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
Beautiful electron microscope photo! But it is a white cell rather than red blood cell. Also, there is no scale bar so one cannot be sure about the length and thickness of the filaments. Actually, that’s a problem with the rbc light photo too isn’t it?

True, though I was thinking that because white blood cells are mixed in with red blood cells, and in nsdn's picture the cells are closely clumped together, it is not too clear which cells those filaments come from.

99% of all blood cells are red blood cells, which have a diameter of 6 to 8 μm (6 to 8 micrometers). Only 1% of blood cells are the white cells. So most of the cells in nsdn's picture will be red blood cells.

Macrophages are larger in size, around 21 μm. Monocytes in the blood have size 15 to 30 µm, and are the precursors to macrophages (when monocytes enter the tissues, they turn into macrophages).

I was thinking these monocytes might perhaps convert to macrophages in this blood sample as it is left for 48 hours, and then grow these filopodia.

But I am not actually sure whether macrophages can exist in the blood, or whether they can only exist in tissue.


In any case, since macrophages are quite a bit larger than red blood cells, perhaps they would be visible in nsdn's picture if they were the source of these filaments.
 

nsdn

Senior Member
Messages
183
The author of the video "Condritos o espiroquetas" Pablo Lastras tells me that if 48 hours or more have passed since the extraction there is no doubt, they are condritos. The condritos are a product of degeneration of the blood due to the oxidation that suffers the blood to have extracted it from its natural environment that is the bloodstream. There is nothing to worry about.

@Hip
 

nsdn

Senior Member
Messages
183
The same author titles this image as "Red blood cells in a defensive state".

estado defensa.jpg