• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

Oxymatrine in the UK?

olliec

Senior Member
Messages
111
Location
London, UK
I want to try Oxymatrine treatment, but cannot find a supplier in the UK. I contacted Dr Chia's Equilibrant team, but they will not ship to Europe as it seems they've had problems with customs.

Can anyone point me to a reputable supplier in the UK, or one that ships to the UK?
 

olliec

Senior Member
Messages
111
Location
London, UK
So it seems there are 45 species of sophora
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophora

Does anyone know which sophora plant is used in Equilibrant or White Tiger? If anyone has a packet they can look at, would appreciate it. The Equilibrant web site doesn't seem to specify the species of the plant.

The supplier I mentioned above has Sophora Tonkinensis, but I've no idea if that's the one Chia uses.
 

shannah

Senior Member
Messages
1,429
No Problem olliec - I used to order the White Tiger and now order Ku Shen from them all the time. That's the concentrated oxymatrine in powder form. I encapsulate myself - much less expense.
 

olliec

Senior Member
Messages
111
Location
London, UK
That sounds very sensible. How do you encapsulate the powder?

Do you find it helps much? Do you bother adding the other modulators like olive leaf extract that Equilibrant includes?
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,820
Yes, the 5:1 concentrated extract of Ku Shen (Sophora flavescens) you found at Bristol Botanicals is the one you want.

Ku Shen root herb normally contains 2% oxymatrine. So this means Ku Shen 5:1 extract (= five times stronger) powder should contain 10% oxymatrine.

Thus 2 grams of Ku Shen 5:1 extract powder will contain 200 mg oxymatrine.

I believe the usual starting dose is around 200 mg of oxymatrine once a day, slowly building up to 3 x 200 mg a day. Though I am not entirely sure, as the oxymatrine content of Equilibrant is not given.

The White Tiger brand of Ku Shen tablets contain 200 mg of oxymatrine per tablet.

Some other suppliers of Ku Shen / oxymatrine are here:

http://qiherbs.com/oxymatrine.html
http://www.maxnature.com/oxtati.html
http://www.chineseherbs.net/index.php?l=product_detail&p=287
http://www.ktbotanicals.com/ku-shen...p-14242.html?zenid=ac1i2vruokh9rml6ugd0no26u3
http://www.betterlife.com/product/oxymatrine-300-mg/lloyd-wright/34465
 
Last edited:

shannah

Senior Member
Messages
1,429
That sounds very sensible. How do you encapsulate the powder?

Do you find it helps much? Do you bother adding the other modulators like olive leaf extract that Equilibrant includes?

To encapsulate the powder, one needs to purchase empty capsules and a capsule maker. I see the empty capsules are available at the company you posted above. Didn't see any capsule makers though. There's a popular one called Cap 'N Quick which is very inexpensive and makes 50 at a time. Although it's much less expensive this way, it can be fairly labour intensive if you're doing a lot of different herbs.

http://www.bristolbotanicals.co.uk/cat-search?search=capsules

Not sure how the pricing compares. I'm in Canada. Usually buy 10,000 empty capsules at a time from the US.

I do find the Oxymatrine helps - but I'm still very ill. I was taking the Equilibrant for a time but started suddenly having blood pressure issues, so thought it best to avoid licorice for a while. I think those bp issues are from the thyroid medication though.

I do also encapsulate Olive Leaf extract - as well as a host of other supps.

Good luck with it!
 

Seewell

Senior Member
Messages
234
hi
I just wanted to say thank you for this post(or do you call it a thread)
I was just watching a youtube video "MECFSalert" 39-40
And doctor Chia mentioned Oxymatrine,i googled it and got here !:)
I like the fact that its a herb - Are there any risks/side effects to it.guess i all do some more looking.
 

olliec

Senior Member
Messages
111
Location
London, UK
I think Dr Chia warns people off using Oxymatrine if they have a history or family history of autoimmune disorders. I've seen many people talk of it making them dizzy, and lowering the dose. Do also be aware that Dr Chia uses his own product Equilibrant, which has other things in it too, e.g. olive leaf extract.

A thread is a set of posts, where each post is one message from one person :)
 

Seewell

Senior Member
Messages
234
I think Dr Chia warns people off using Oxymatrine if they have a history or family history of autoimmune disorders. I've seen many people talk of it making them dizzy, and lowering the dose. Do also be aware that Dr Chia uses his own product Equilibrant, which has other things in it too, e.g. olive leaf extract.

A thread is a set of posts, where each post is one message from one person :)

Are you going to try the Ku Shen from your link above :)
Im interested too.
The tincture may be absorbed better - The whole plant herb may not give the above symptoms.What do you think.

I tryed organic powdered "olive leaf extract years ago - i got up to 19 capsules per day in the end - but it had no great
affect:( At the time i thought this is it! ( no bad symptoms that i can recall from taking though)
 

olliec

Senior Member
Messages
111
Location
London, UK
I'm going for the powder initially. Over the years I've tried so many different things that I'm used to things being a waste of time. Hopefully this won't be, but at least it's not too expensive.
 

Rolo

Too ill to twist
Messages
29
Location
Antwerp, Belgium
I want to try Oxymatrine treatment, but cannot find a supplier in the UK. I contacted Dr Chia's Equilibrant team, but they will not ship to Europe as it seems they've had problems with customs.

I just have checked there site and it looks that they do ship internationally.
From there FAQ page:
Equilibrant is made in the US. Do you ship internationally?
Yes. Please register an account and proceed with purchasing, select international shipping options and checkout. Shipping options do not include additional costs associated with importing tariffs charged by the country of destination.


I partly completed the check out process. Delivery to an address in Belgium seams to be accepted. Although it cost 18$ dollars.

Is it possible that they changed there policy in the last month??

Regards,
Rolo
 

olliec

Senior Member
Messages
111
Location
London, UK
That's interesting to know, thanks for posting this information.

I bought some ku shen powder from Bristol Botanicals and some olive leaf powder from Amazon UK, and stuffed it into capsules. So far I've noticed nothing - no side-effects, no benefits, but I'll keep going for another couple of months and nudge the doses up a bit.
 

Rolo

Too ill to twist
Messages
29
Location
Antwerp, Belgium
Hi,

I was able to order White Tiger Oxymatrine via the site of Biomed bv from the Netherlands. It seams that they are the European distributor for White Tiger and they ship across Europe. You have to contact them via email or phone for more information about delivery costs and payment options.

Their website: http://www.biomedonline.nl/1/welcome/

I gone start one of these days. Wish me luck!! ;);)

Rolo