• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of, and finding treatments for, complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia, long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

My OAT results....help please

Messages
39
Hi,

These are my OAT results. I am not sure if I have Candida (high arabinose), SIBO (high hippuric) or both....

Anyone could help me to interpretate them?.... I am from Spain but I think they are understandable

My symptons are bloating, bad digestions and diarrhea...and I would like to know a possible treatment...

I have seen some users with great expertise. It would be an honor if they could help me..


@alicec @Learner1 @Jonathan Edwards

I have uploaded the info here because some users cant see it...

https://ibb.co/z8j8xZp
https://ibb.co/sjPyfp7
https://ibb.co/VCNx1MH
https://ibb.co/bQwd0SB
https://ibb.co/z8j8xZp

Igs of candida are negative in my blood tests...

I look forward to hearing from you


Regards
1.png
2.png
3.png
4.png
5.png
 

Attachments

  • 1.png
    1.png
    83.3 KB · Views: 10
Last edited:

gumman123

Senior Member
Messages
103
Water kefir grains and milk kefir grains are the best probiotic there is. Ebay or health food shops sell them.
 

Mary

Moderator Resource
Messages
17,385
Location
Southern California
@Trunks00 - I'm going to re-tag the members here that you tagged because I don't think your tags worked - I'm not sure how you did it but they don't look right, so here they are again: @alicec, @Learner1, @Jonathan Edwards

I can't help interpret your OAT results. However, I have had digestive issues in the past. Many years ago I discovered I had low stomach acid, and starting taking betaine HCL with pepsin with meals, and it made a huge difference in my digestion. It became much better. A simple test which might help to see if you have low stomach acid is to dissolve 1/2 or 1/4 teaspoon baking soda in 8 ounces of water and drink on an empty stomach. If you don't burp within a few minutes, it can indicate low stomach acid.

SIBO can be connected to low stomach acid. Stomach acid helps keep "bad" bacteria in check so if stomach acid is low, it can let certain bacteria grow out of proportion to what it should be.

Also about four years ago I had diarrhea for several months. I tried several different types of probiotics with no help. Then I tried kefir and within a week it had cleared up. For quite awhile I would drink it a couple of times a week, and it worked great. Now I forget about it, but will drink kefir when I remember to do so.
 

Learner1

Senior Member
Messages
6,305
Location
Pacific Northwest
@Trunks00 I took a look at your OAT. It is difficult to look at in this format. Can you PM me the entire pages - not your personal info, but the results?

At first glance, yes, it looks like you may have a Candida problem. A strict anti-Candida diet - low carbohydrate - no alcohol, bread, fruit, pasta, rice, corn, potatoes, but yes to meat, fish, nuts, fats, and non-starchy vegetables and a rotation of Nystatin and Diflucan over 2-3 months might help. You may have a clostridia problem or other symbiosis problem, too. A lactulose breath test would identify SIBO.

Beyond that, it looks like you are very deficient in B6 and B2. Taking them will help methylation and help your mitochondria. I couldn't tell from what I could see, but you may be short in branched chain amino acids and antioxidants, too.

Whoever ran such a test should be able to give you advice - what did they suggest?
 

BeADocToGoTo1

Senior Member
Messages
536
I agree with what Learner1 mentioned.

In addition, was there anything in initial summary interpretation pages about "need for priobiotics" or "need for pancreatic enzymes"?

Have a very close and honest look at everything you eat and drink. You can use a tracker tool on your phone for ease of monitoring, or just write it all down for a week or so. You might be surprised how easily carbohydrates and sugars are too high in our meals and drinks.

And because your symptoms can also be related to not enough pancreatic enzymes, it might be worth testing for via a comprehensive stool test. That would be good to do anyway with your symptoms. Have you checked for gluten, caseine or lactose sensitivities?

Some tests to consider:

1. Genova Diagnostics - Comprehensive Digestive Stool Analysis 2.0 with Parasitology (microbiome dysbiosis indicators), Fecal Fat Distribution (checks if you have issues with different types of fat intake and digestion), Elastase (for EPI, pancreas enzyme marker)and Chymotrypsin (for EPI, pancreas enzyme marker). Doctor's Data has similar tests. There are also individual stool tests a doctor can order for 24 hour fecal fat and pancreatic elastase.

2. Small intestinal bacterial overgrowth (SIBO) breath test, for example, Commonwealth Diagnostics International. But the first one will also provide you with SIBO indicators.

2. But also look at HbA1c as a quick, standard indicator of excess sugar intake which impacts your microbiome, pancreas functioning amongst many other things. 5.2% or lower is what I strive for.
 
Messages
39
@Trunks00 - I'm going to re-tag the members here that you tagged because I don't think your tags worked - I'm not sure how you did it but they don't look right, so here they are again: @alicec, @Learner1, @Jonathan Edwards

I can't help interpret your OAT results. However, I have had digestive issues in the past. Many years ago I discovered I had low stomach acid, and starting taking betaine HCL with pepsin with meals, and it made a huge difference in my digestion. It became much better. A simple test which might help to see if you have low stomach acid is to dissolve 1/2 or 1/4 teaspoon baking soda in 8 ounces of water and drink on an empty stomach. If you don't burp within a few minutes, it can indicate low stomach acid.

SIBO can be connected to low stomach acid. Stomach acid helps keep "bad" bacteria in check so if stomach acid is low, it can let certain bacteria grow out of proportion to what it should be.

Also about four years ago I had diarrhea for several months. I tried several different types of probiotics with no help. Then I tried kefir and within a week it had cleared up. For quite awhile I would drink it a couple of times a week, and it worked great. Now I forget about it, but will drink kefir when I remember to do so.
Thank you. I have already take hcl for digestion. But my I would like to understand better my OAT and how to improve them. Thank you for tag them

Regards
 
Messages
39
@Trunks00 I took a look at your OAT. It is difficult to look at in this format. Can you PM me the entire pages - not your personal info, but the results?

At first glance, yes, it looks like you may have a Candida problem. A strict anti-Candida diet - low carbohydrate - no alcohol, bread, fruit, pasta, rice, corn, potatoes, but yes to meat, fish, nuts, fats, and non-starchy vegetables and a rotation of Nystatin and Diflucan over 2-3 months might help. You may have a clostridia problem or other symbiosis problem, too. A lactulose breath test would identify SIBO.

Beyond that, it looks like you are very deficient in B6 and B2. Taking them will help methylation and help your mitochondria. I couldn't tell from what I could see, but you may be short in branched chain amino acids and antioxidants, too.

Whoever ran such a test should be able to give you advice - what did they suggest?
I have sent them to you....you can see them here too now...
I have heard that a strict anticandida diet is not that good....wouldnte be better fruit diet?...Besides...I would like to be sure that this test indicates candida ...


Regards

Thanks
 
Messages
39
I agree with what Learner1 mentioned.

In addition, was there anything in initial summary interpretation pages about "need for priobiotics" or "need for pancreatic enzymes"?

Have a very close and honest look at everything you eat and drink. You can use a tracker tool on your phone for ease of monitoring, or just write it all down for a week or so. You might be surprised how easily carbohydrates and sugars are too high in our meals and drinks.

And because your symptoms can also be related to not enough pancreatic enzymes, it might be worth testing for via a comprehensive stool test. That would be good to do anyway with your symptoms. Have you checked for gluten, caseine or lactose sensitivities?

Some tests to consider:

1. Genova Diagnostics - Comprehensive Digestive Stool Analysis 2.0 with Parasitology (microbiome dysbiosis indicators), Fecal Fat Distribution (checks if you have issues with different types of fat intake and digestion), Elastase (for EPI, pancreas enzyme marker)and Chymotrypsin (for EPI, pancreas enzyme marker). Doctor's Data has similar tests. There are also individual stool tests a doctor can order for 24 hour fecal fat and pancreatic elastase.

2. Small intestinal bacterial overgrowth (SIBO) breath test, for example, Commonwealth Diagnostics International. But the first one will also provide you with SIBO indicators.

2. But also look at HbA1c as a quick, standard indicator of excess sugar intake which impacts your microbiome, pancreas functioning amongst many other things. 5.2% or lower is what I strive for.
Thank you for your answer. I usually have fatty stools..do you recommend a diet low in carbohydrates?How about fruit?...What if I have SIBO and candida? What would be the treatment?......fosmaps would be a good idea?...


Regards
 

BeADocToGoTo1

Senior Member
Messages
536
Thank you for your answer. I usually have fatty stools..do you recommend a diet low in carbohydrates?How about fruit?...What if I have SIBO and candida? What would be the treatment?......fosmaps would be a good idea?...

If you have fatty stools (yellower, sticks to the bowl, smellier) that is not something to take lightly and indicates you are not breaking down food properly, in particular fat. This can be gallbladder related with inadequate bile salts being produced and delivered and/or exocrine pancreatic insufficiency (EPI), where you are not producing or delivering enough pancreatic enzymes to break down food. This causes nutrient deficiencies, dysbiosis and slowly breaks down the body. Please have a look at the following thread for EPI (and SIBO, Candida):

https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...y-epi-and-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-cfs.62997/

Please ask your doctor for a pancreatic elastase and 24 hour fecal fat stool tests for EPI. Or you can do the Genova stool test I mentioned earlier.

Although I use prescription pancreatic enzymes (Creon), you can get over the counter versions as an immediate stop gap, as the doctors will unlikely prescribe it until confirmed. They will need to be taken with each meal or snack in order to get more of the nutrients from food by breaking it down properly. Undigested food particles can cause autoimmune reactions, overgrowths of bacteria and yeast in areas where they should not, systemic inflammation, etc.

It might be best to find a functional/integrative medicine doctor who has experience with SIBO and Candida treatments. In my experience Rifaximin alone is not effective for methane related SIBO. You will also need supplements to attack the biofilm, pre- and pro-biotics. I took a 10 day course of both Neomycin and Rifaximin together along with all the other steps. For Candida yeast overgrowth some of the steps are similar, but the anti-fungal I used was Nystatin (From a compounding pharmacy, 1 million units per day for a month is what I did) along with things like botanical agents, enzymes, molybdenum, probiotic yeast, biofilm attacking supplements. But you have to also tackle food and beverage intake and be quite strict for a few months to not overfeed the critters whilst trying to rebalance the microbiome. I dedicated a chapter to the SIBO and Candida steps I had to take to rebalance as it requires a multi-pronged approach. Temporarily stricter on yeast containing products (if you have Candida overgrowth), no milk, very limited fruit, no juices, no sodas, no alcohol, no deli meat (sugar), no gluten, etc. Have a look at what Mark Sisson or Chris Kresser mention about food, SIBO, Candida. There are herbal anti-microbial drops like Biocidin, oregano oil, molybdenum, Serralase (enzymes), Interfase Plus (biofilm disruptor), coconut oil (MCT), cinnamon, garlic, mustard, thyme, that are all non-prescription things that helped me.

Here is a study that might be of interest which covers a few of those natural treatments:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4030608/

Regarding food I follow a roughly primal style ( or what my grandparents would have just called food):
  • As little processed, packaged, canned, non-organic as possible
  • Avoid toxins where possible: preservatives, additivies, coloring, food glue, flavoring, chemicals, herbicides, pesticides, plastic chemical leaching, etc.
  • Many types and colors of vegetables, preferably local organic
  • Healthy proteins: happy pastured chickens, grass fed beef, non-farmed fish, hemp, etc.
  • Healthy fats: nuts, olive oil, seeds, grass fed butter, fish, avocado, etc.. High fat dairy in moderation with grass fed and full fat preferred, unsweetened of course, aged and fermented also good options.
  • Avoid unhealthy, highly processed, partially hydrogenated GMO oils (canola, corn, soy, etc.) and trans-fats. This is used almost everywhere these days: restaurants, cafes, processed food, condiments, etc.
  • I do not drink any calories (just unsweetened tea, coffee and water).
  • Regarding starches, potato, rice, legumes, pasta, grains, cereals, bread, the quality is extremely important and in very limited amounts. Organic wheat only (to avoid more glyphosate exposure) for bread.
  • Real fresh fruit limited and more seen as a treat, but never liquid, dried, processed, preserved, canned. It was a seasonal thing even when I grew up. Some berries, perhaps a kiwi or 1/2 banana, but not every day. Avocado is an exception as it is low sugar and high healthy fat.
I track my ketones to be in nutritional ketosis (0.5-3mmol), which is a great indicator of excess sugar and carbohydrates. HbA1c blood test (5.2% or less) is also a good indicator of how much damage sugar has been doing to your cells through glycation and I use it as an indicator of my carb intake. Usually ~100 or fewer grams per day.

A little side note, have you had your water supply tested? Is it chlorinated? Water quality is often overlooked as possible causes of microbiome dysbiosis and chronic health issues.
 
Last edited:
Messages
39
If you have fatty stools (yellower, sticks to the bowl, smellier) that is not something to take lightly and indicates you are not breaking down food properly, in particular fat. This can be gallbladder related with inadequate bile salts being produced and delivered and/or exocrine pancreatic insufficiency (EPI), where you are not producing or delivering enough pancreatic enzymes to break down food. This causes nutrient deficiencies, dysbiosis and slowly breaks down the body. Please have a look at the following thread for EPI (and SIBO, Candida):

https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...y-epi-and-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-cfs.62997/

Please ask your doctor for a pancreatic elastase and 24 hour fecal fat stool tests for EPI. Or you can do the Genova stool test I mentioned earlier.

Although I use prescription pancreatic enzymes (Creon), you can get over the counter versions as an immediate stop gap, as the doctors will unlikely prescribe it until confirmed. They will need to be taken with each meal or snack in order to get more of the nutrients from food by breaking it down properly. Undigested food particles can cause autoimmune reactions, overgrowths of bacteria and yeast in areas where they should not, systemic inflammation, etc.

It might be best to find a functional/integrative medicine doctor who has experience with SIBO and Candida treatments. In my experience Rifaximin alone is not effective for methane related SIBO. You will also need supplements to attack the biofilm, pre- and pro-biotics. I took a 10 day course of both Neomycin and Rifaximin together along with all the other steps. For Candida yeast overgrowth some of the steps are similar, but the anti-fungal I used was Nystatin (From a compounding pharmacy, 1 million units per day for a month is what I did) along with things like botanical agents, enzymes, molybdenum, probiotic yeast, biofilm attacking supplements. But you have to also tackle food and beverage intake and be quite strict for a few months to not overfeed the critters whilst trying to rebalance the microbiome. I dedicated a chapter to the SIBO and Candida steps I had to take to rebalance as it requires a multi-pronged approach. Temporarily stricter on yeast containing products (if you have Candida overgrowth), no milk, very limited fruit, no juices, no sodas, no alcohol, no deli meat (sugar), no gluten, etc. Have a look at what Mark Sisson or Chris Kresser mention about food, SIBO, Candida. There are herbal anti-microbial drops like Biocidin, oregano oil, molybdenum, Serralase (enzymes), Interfase Plus (biofilm disruptor), coconut oil (MCT), cinnamon, garlic, mustard, thyme, that are all non-prescription things that helped me.

Here is a study that might be of interest which covers a few of those natural treatments:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4030608/

Regarding food I follow a roughly primal style ( or what my grandparents would have just called food):
  • As little processed, packaged, canned, non-organic as possible
  • Avoid toxins where possible: preservatives, additivies, coloring, food glue, flavoring, chemicals, herbicides, pesticides, plastic chemical leaching, etc.
  • Many types and colors of vegetables, preferably local organic
  • Healthy proteins: happy pastured chickens, grass fed beef, non-farmed fish, hemp, etc.
  • Healthy fats: nuts, olive oil, seeds, grass fed butter, fish, avocado, etc.. High fat dairy in moderation with grass fed and full fat preferred, unsweetened of course, aged and fermented also good options.
  • Avoid unhealthy, highly processed, partially hydrogenated GMO oils (canola, corn, soy, etc.) and trans-fats. This is used almost everywhere these days: restaurants, cafes, processed food, condiments, etc.
  • I do not drink any calories (just unsweetened tea, coffee and water).
  • Regarding starches, potato, rice, legumes, pasta, grains, cereals, bread, the quality is extremely important and in very limited amounts. Organic wheat only (to avoid more glyphosate exposure) for bread.
  • Real fresh fruit limited and more seen as a treat, but never liquid, dried, processed, preserved, canned. It was a seasonal thing even when I grew up. Some berries, perhaps a kiwi or 1/2 banana, but not every day. Avocado is an exception as it is low sugar and high healthy fat.
I track my ketones to be in nutritional ketosis (0.5-3mmol), which is a great indicator of excess sugar and carbohydrates. HbA1c blood test (5.2% or less) is also a good indicator of how much damage sugar has been doing to your cells through glycation and I use it as an indicator of my carb intake. Usually ~100 or fewer grams per day.

A little side note, have you had your water supply tested? Is it chlorinated? Water quality is often overlooked as possible causes of microbiome dysbiosis and chronic health issues.
Thank you very much for your answer. My doctor saw my pancreas very carefully....elastase is normal....checked several times....My doctor didnt know why I didnt absorb fat.....7 years ago....I didnt come back because he hadnt a clue....

Maybe SIBO or candida could produce fat malabsortion itself...?....


Regards
 

BeADocToGoTo1

Senior Member
Messages
536
Thank you very much for your answer. My doctor saw my pancreas very carefully....elastase is normal....checked several times....My doctor didnt know why I didnt absorb fat.....7 years ago....I didnt come back because he hadnt a clue....

Maybe SIBO or candida could produce fat malabsortion itself...?....


Regards
7 years is a long time for things to change, not to mention the sometimes false negatives. Do you still have the results from the pancreatic elastase? Was it around 200 or lower? Did you try taking enzymes for a while to see changes in symptoms? Some doctors will do this as a confirmation through symptom reduction as opposed to just a test.

And yes SIBO and Candida can also cause malabsorption.
 
Messages
39
7 years is a long time for things to change, not to mention the sometimes false negatives. Do you still have the results from the pancreatic elastase? Was it around 200 or lower? Did you try taking enzymes for a while to see changes in symptoms? Some doctors will do this as a confirmation through symptom reduction as opposed to just a test.

And yes SIBO and Candida can also cause malabsorption.
I dont think I have them but they were tested several times and they were in range. Yes, I have been taken enzymes and diarrhea is not that explosive. However I would like to know about OAT results in case they could point to something that indicates fat malabsortion or some disbiosis...


Maybe the best thing to do is try to normalice those values (I thing they point dysbiosis) and after that recheck my heces fat.....

But I would like to know what OAT really means because I cant understand them very well...

I live in Madrid, Spain, a big city. So I suppose the water has chlorine in it....Wjhat would you do to eliminate? I have heard that if you leave the water 1 minute without drinking....the cholrine is evaporated



Regards
 

BeADocToGoTo1

Senior Member
Messages
536
I dont think I have them but they were tested several times and they were in range. Yes, I have been taken enzymes and diarrhea is not that explosive. However I would like to know about OAT results in case they could point to something that indicates fat malabsortion or some disbiosis...

Maybe the best thing to do is try to normalice those values (I thing they point dysbiosis) and after that recheck my heces fat.....

But I would like to know what OAT really means because I cant understand them very well...

I live in Madrid, Spain, a big city. So I suppose the water has chlorine in it....Wjhat would you do to eliminate? I have heard that if you leave the water 1 minute without drinking....the cholrine is evaporated

Regarding water, a water filter like the Berkey system will work. My guess is that Amazon can deliver it to Spain as well. If you have fluoride added in the water, like sadly in the US and Canada, you would want to get the fluoride filter addition. Or a reputable mineral water source is another option. In the US ammonia as part of chloramines, another disinfectant, is also added to the water. They all can affect the microbiome.

https://www.amazon.es/s?k=berkey+water&__mk_es_ES=ÅMÅŽÕÑ&ref=nb_sb_noss_2

Anything that has been sprayed with glyphosate, which is an antimicrobial, can also affect the microbiome. In Northern Europe they get a 'Bio' label. Not sure whether there is something similar in Spain. Reduce the insults through toxins as much as you can.

Regarding your OAT results, I think that has been answered by multiple people. There was a summary section in my last one, which specifically mentioned "need for priobiotics" or "need for pancreatic enzymes" in Digestive Support. Did yours not have that?

What kind of enzymes do you take? What quantity of lipase, amylase and protease are in those pills, and how do you take them?
 

Nanni

Senior Member
Messages
148
I have sent them to you....you can see them here too now...
I have heard that a strict anticandida diet is not that good....wouldnte be better fruit diet?...Besides...I would like to be sure that this test indicates candida ...


Regards

Thanks

I just got my OATS test back and i have a similar problem. I have very high Arabinose But I have been on botanical anti microbials for two months. I am better overall. The other markers for yeast and bacteria are very low so I think there’s some diet issues that I’ve got to understand. Chris Kresser has great information on all these kinds of gut issues. He suggests the FODMAP diet is best for Candida. He says too few carbs can throw off a healthy balance and also create an environment that bugs thrive on.. My OATs results show that I’m in ketosis which matches with my doing intermittent fasting. I felt like that helped but I think maybe I have gone overboard, as usual.

I think the fasting did help initially and then maybe because I was off some foods I eat. I’m actually suspecting the goat yogurt I eat daily even though it’s very low in lactose. I think FODMAP is pretty good and he also suggested taking a good probiotic. I got the brand Bio-Kult from Sara Myhills site. I just started taking it so we’ll see. I also take a pancreas bile supplement by Vital that I have to take since I have no gallbladder. That’s helped me a lot. This is like solving a mystery novel. Good luck
 

Learner1

Senior Member
Messages
6,305
Location
Pacific Northwest
Araninode is a Candida marker, I think. I was put in a low carb anti-candida diet and given a rotation of Nystatin and Diflucan over about 6 weeks, and beat it. Alcohol is not allowed...
 
Messages
14
You can get an OAT test in Spain. More useful might be the Metabolomix+ test by Genova Diagnostics - they have an office in London that serves Europe.
Hello. I have already consulted with Genova, to carry out the test I would have to travel outside the country, it is not feasible to send the samples from here. Also, I'm interested in knowing what my sam-e/sah levels are, and the metabolomix doesn't measure it. Thanks for answering
 

Marylib

Senior Member
Messages
1,158
Just a thought: Joshua Leisk is really good at reading this kind of thing. He is a kind and generous person, in my experience, and he may have some input for you. You can find him through his website and his group on discord. https://bornfree.life/