• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

Itchy head, face, neck, and shoulders

Crux

Senior Member
Messages
1,441
Location
USA
Have you had personal experience with calcification from phosphorus?

I believe I have had calcification experience, though not proven with scans. I had already begun calcium supps. before measuring blood serum. It was normal, but many researchers believe that phosphorus over 3.5 mg/dl
increases all cause mortality. Mine was above that.
I brought it down to low normal.

I was a very stiff child, couldn't touch toes. Had many pains in joints, then kidney area later. During this past year ( now taking calcium ), I've had transient pain in joints, neck, head, fingers, and flank. Each time the pain and stiffness is milder. It seems that I'm improving. Much less dental plaque, hygienist commented.

Couldn't tolerate vitamin D until recently. Vitamin D enhances calcium and phosphorus uptake. ( I use it transdermally. )

Boxed foods and fast foods have been inundated with phosphates. We don't even know how much.
Fertilizers are loaded with it. The run off is part of the cause of toxic algae blooms.

btw, I've had skin lesions, acne like , for about 6 years. They've been moving around from arms to shoulders, now chest. They seem to be lessening.

You may want to test PTH, and FGF 23 to see if calcium is high .. If they're high, then phosphorus may be low in blood serum, but not deficient.
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

Senior Member
Messages
16,047
Location
Second star to the right ...
Couldn't tolerate vitamin D until recently. Vitamin D enhances calcium and phosphorus uptake. ( I use it transdermally. )
I'm assuming that both you and @vision blue are also taking MK-7 and if you want to be super cautious, also MK-4, which is the form that performed so well in the Japanese studies ....


I couldnt tolerate Vit D (along with almost every other vit and mineral) for about 3-plus years, and finally had to use baby drops to re-introduce it. I found the MK-7 and 4 to be tremendously helpful ....
 

Crux

Senior Member
Messages
1,441
Location
USA
I'm assuming that both you and @vision blue are also taking MK-7 and if you want to be super cautious, also MK-4, which is the form that performed so well in the Japanese studies ....

I haven't been able to tolerate any type of K2 supplement in recent years. Not sure if it's mobilizing calcium or what. Incredible pain and numbness in feet and legs. May tolerate in future.
Now I have a lot of butter, eggs, and cheese.
I'm still a paradox, so it's hard to describe my own experience with out sounding like an obstreperous old coot !
 

vision blue

Senior Member
Messages
1,877
I also cannot find any Vit K i can tolerate and since tolerance of vit d was minimal anyway (even with baby drops) i gave up those supplements.

(my calcium is 9.8 which is same as it was 3 years ago when i last checked. haven't had phosptorhus for a long time, so don't know. but i guess blood values so tightly regulated anyway that it wouldn't show up changes in tissues bones etc.)
 
Last edited:

Violeta

Senior Member
Messages
2,895
I believe I have had calcification experience, though not proven with scans. I had already begun calcium supps. before measuring blood serum. It was normal, but many researchers believe that phosphorus over 3.5 mg/dl
increases all cause mortality. Mine was above that.
I brought it down to low normal.

I was a very stiff child, couldn't touch toes. Had many pains in joints, then kidney area later. During this past year ( now taking calcium ), I've had transient pain in joints, neck, head, fingers, and flank. Each time the pain and stiffness is milder. It seems that I'm improving. Much less dental plaque, hygienist commented.

Couldn't tolerate vitamin D until recently. Vitamin D enhances calcium and phosphorus uptake. ( I use it transdermally. )

Boxed foods and fast foods have been inundated with phosphates. We don't even know how much.
Fertilizers are loaded with it. The run off is part of the cause of toxic algae blooms.

btw, I've had skin lesions, acne like , for about 6 years. They've been moving around from arms to shoulders, now chest. They seem to be lessening.

You may want to test PTH, and FGF 23 to see if calcium is high .. If they're high, then phosphorus may be low in blood serum, but not deficient.
How did you bring your phosphorus level down?
 

Husband of

Senior Member
Messages
313
So the doc said she thinks the rash is fungal. So we are trying antfungal and steroid creams.

will see how that goes.

As for the lump, well that was annoying. Asked what the x ray results meant and she said they meant there was nothing wrong. I can’t remember what I said but I got her to feel the lump again and she made up some nonsense about thinking it was something different - that there was a lump on her clavicle bone , as if she never knew about the actual lump above her bone (she did, she felt it at the time) . It was weird and now she is saying we need to do an ultrasound which is what I thought we had to do all along. But she thinks it’s a lipoma. But if it’s actually lymphoma we’ve just gone three weeks plus now another three before we can get the ultrasound plus probably one or two before getting a further doctors appointment .

and she want much helpful with the MECFS.

and then time kinda ran out and I didn’t ask for old bloods or autoimmune tests (it’s hard to ask a doctor to do things at the best of times) . And I’ve felt ashamed about that since.
 

Pearshaped

Senior Member
Messages
580
@Husband of
the pattern and location you describe and the more or less round blotches make me think of pytriasis versicolor. it often starts on the scalp and „wanders“ to nec, shoulder, arms, chest and further down.
Shampoos with ketoconazol would hep if it is that.
If the blotches themseves are red very dry and flaky compared to the surrounding skin, then its probably something else.

Like lenora, I thought of the sheet, or rather the laundry deregent ir favric softener. They sometimes change the formula. Or bodylotion ? if it is an allergy it can be almost everything.
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

Senior Member
Messages
16,047
Location
Second star to the right ...
and then time kinda ran out and I didn’t ask for old bloods or autoimmune tests (it’s hard to ask a doctor to do things at the best of times) . And I’ve felt ashamed about that since.
It almost literally makes my blood boil when, on top of doing nothing productive regarding the lump you and your wife are worried about, you're left feeling ashamed that you were more or less time-bullied into not asking for something the Dr should have volunteered, given the circumstances and your concerns.

She's clearly doing some CYA work regarding the lump that she more or less ignored or dismissed, and if you hadn't pushed her, believe me, she wouldn't have offered additional tests. Be proud of that. Believe me, getting a Dr to do ANYTHING beyond their initial dx is a triumph ....
 

Violeta

Senior Member
Messages
2,895
I took Calcium chelate for some months. It binds phosphorus and excretes it. Magnesium also binds phosphorus. Vitamin C does too as does niacinamide.

I took a parathyroid glandular for a time. It lowers phosphorus.
Thank you very much.
 

Violeta

Senior Member
Messages
2,895
I took Calcium chelate for some months. It binds phosphorus and excretes it. Magnesium also binds phosphorus. Vitamin C does too as does niacinamide.

I took a parathyroid glandular for a time. It lowers phosphorus.

Wow, phosphorus. I been reading the homeopathic materia medica for years and when I saw you mention Vitamin C, I remembered that phophorus has something to do with scurvy. I never found what exactly the relationship was but now I am thinking that too much phosphorus causes scurvy. Vitamin C deficiency was one of my earliest symptoms. But I don't know what was causing too much phosphorus. I am fairly sure phosphorus was involved because I also was prone to caries. My siblings did not have these symptoms. So I wonder what would make someone prone to having too much phosphorus.

Do you know why niacinamide helps?

Thanks again
 

Crux

Senior Member
Messages
1,441
Location
USA
So I wonder what would make someone prone to having too much phosphorus.

Do you know why niacinamide helps?

If you have renal insufficiency, phosphorus can accumulate. CKD.
If you have low parathyroid function , phosphorus will elevate because calcium uptake will be low. Calcium deficiency alone can increase phosphorus uptake.
Magnesium deficiency causes elevated phosphorus.

Niacinamide is a phosphorus binder. It's not as strong as phosphate binding drugs, but it's mentioned in medical papers.
 

vision blue

Senior Member
Messages
1,877
I had that too. When kids sat on the floor and could put their heads to their knees, I never could. I have sometimes wondered when I read discussions here regarding tethered cord syndrome if that could be a factor.

Sane for me on the stiffness.
So the doc said she thinks the rash is fungal. So we are trying antfungal and steroid creams.

will see how that goes.

As for the lump, well that was annoying. Asked what the x ray results meant and she said they meant there was nothing wrong. I can’t remember what I said but I got her to feel the lump again and she made up some nonsense about thinking it was something different - that there was a lump on her clavicle bone , as if she never knew about the actual lump above her bone (she did, she felt it at the time) . It was weird and now she is saying we need to do an ultrasound which is what I thought we had to do all along. But she thinks it’s a lipoma. But if it’s actually lymphoma we’ve just gone three weeks plus now another three before we can get the ultrasound plus probably one or two before getting a further doctors appointment .

and she want much helpful with the MECFS.

and then time kinda ran out and I didn’t ask for old bloods or autoimmune tests (it’s hard to ask a doctor to do things at the best of times) . And I’ve felt ashamed about that since.

Hi. Came back here to see how it went

On fungal, one of my hypothesis i posted on list above was that it was ringworm. (Which is fungal) so i will give myself half a point altho i think i said it was a long shot. Let us know if the antifungal cream works- would sure be a relief if that

Agree with you thst an ultrasoind makes more sense than an xray and so typical they created hoops to jump thru just for an ultrasound.
I guess youll need to look up if lipoma or lymphoma will lroduce any changes on ultrasound. Ive had a swelling on my tbigh for long time. I asked for an ultrasound. It showed nothing. Asked a rheum what it is, he had no idea (at keast admitted it) i suspected a lipoma but do t know

Yeah thats sucky there was no time for AI testing. What if you called the office and made it as simple fir them as possible saying. I forgot to ask: can i have a bllod test for ANA and then add whatever you want
So maybe also ESR, CRP, immunoglobulins, even Hep C or ANCA or RF.
Would that work?

Are there any other symptoms at all for guidance: night sweats, fever, joint pains or swelling, abdominal pain, new GI issues?

And does she have a mast cell issue?

I assume high platelets not from something obvious like heavy periods?
If not also look up
PV
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

Senior Member
Messages
16,047
Location
Second star to the right ...
@Husband of

Here are some of the salient symptoms of lymphoma ...

  • Drenching night sweats would be a dead giveaway for lymphoma, either Hodgkins or non-Hodgkins.
  • Also extremely easy bruising with no recollection of having bumped into something, or experienced anything that would have caused that.
  • Pronounced lymph node swellings usually come later in the progression, but something to watch out for
  • Extreme fatigue, different from the kind of PEM that we're all familiar with, more a bone-deep weariness that may be somewhat alleviated by sleep, but not for a full day. Kind of like the way you feel after an extended period of heavy mental or physical activity without enough rest, if you're normative
  • Insomnia is another one, even before the drenching night sweats make a good nite's sleep almost impossible. And by drenching, I mean running off your body in rivulets and soaking your sheets, blanket, mattress, cat, and spouse ....
  • Intermittent low grade fevers
  • Sometimes low back pain, also poor gut function and constipation or diarrhea
  • Shortness of breath with even mild exertion
  • Unexplained rashes and itchy skin
  • Swollen spleen and bone pain, as opposed to joint pain
  • Often, a persistent non-productive cough
  • Gradual, relentless weight loss
For what it's worth, Im not sure your spouse's rash is fungal, but time will tell, and please do post back and let us know. Assuming the Dr responds to requests for info re why the cream isn't working .... did she give you a time-frame within which the cream should alleviate the rash, assuming it's fungal in nature?
 

Booble

Senior Member
Messages
1,390
Photos 2 and 3 definitely look fungal. Fungal rashes display with that characteristic darker ring around the outside. I've ones that look exactly like photos 2 and 3. I mean exactly.
The fungal cream works well but it does take time.

The overall itching and redness makes me think the body reacting to the large fungal presence. And depending on timing, a lymph node may increase in size in order to try and help with recovery.
 

Husband of

Senior Member
Messages
313
@YippeeKi YOW !! thanks that’s really helpful. She hasn’t had any sweats. But she has had weight loss, maybe the fatigue but it’s hard to say if it’s different (she got to a point where she was saying things didn’t seem real a few nights ago), definitely insomnia, rash and itchiness. But hopefully these are all coincidences. And the lump is rubbery, although there is soft swelling of some sort next to it now . It also grew quite quickly.

@vision blue unfortunately i don’t think I can ask for tests like that. As far as I understand Only the doctor can order tests and only if they think the tests are warranted. And I’d need an appointment to try convince them of that. I live in New Zealand with mostly government funded health and maybe it’s different where you are from.