• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

IGM HIGH?

Messages
32
Im in the uk & have finally got a print out of all my blood test results that the doctor says are all normal but I have checked & my igm is high from october last year & may this year.
October igm 2.27 May igm 2.49. Lab range 0.50 - 2.00

Mid last year tests show ebv & cmv antibodies in my blood & herpies type 2 for years.

Can anyone please explain what could cause high igm, what high igm means as all the info I have read says this means you have a recent infection but ebv is from years ago & cmv is from may last year?

Igg & iga are all in normal range.

Thanks.
 
Messages
15,786
HI thanks, I have been taking acyclovir from sexual health clinic for 12 months for suppressing herpes 2.! Getting antivirals from GP doctor is virtually impossible here in the UK.
NICE flat out says that doctors should not prescribe antivirals to ME patients.
 

heapsreal

iherb 10% discount code OPA989,
Messages
10,077
Location
australia (brisbane)
HI thanks, I have been taking acyclovir from sexual health clinic for 12 months for suppressing herpes 2.! Getting antivirals from GP doctor is virtually impossible here in the UK.

I guess its why alot of people buy antivirals online??
I would ask the doc for famvir as it seems to have a wide variety of affect and doc likely to prescribe it too??
 

SOC

Senior Member
Messages
7,849
Im in the uk & have finally got a print out of all my blood test results that the doctor says are all normal but I have checked & my igm is high from october last year & may this year.
October igm 2.27 May igm 2.49. Lab range 0.50 - 2.00

Mid last year tests show ebv & cmv antibodies in my blood & herpies type 2 for years.

Can anyone please explain what could cause high igm, what high igm means as all the info I have read says this means you have a recent infection but ebv is from years ago & cmv is from may last year?
-Ig
Igg & iga are all in normal range.

Thanks.
This is a little confusing. :) You've mentioned three herpesviruses -- EBV, CMV, and HSV2. If you had antibody tests, you should have multiple ones for each. Probably IgG and IgM for for CMV and HSV2. For EBV you might have VCA-IgM, VCA-IgG, EA-IgG, EBNA-IgG. Which one or ones are high?

If you have postive IgM for a given pathogen, that means you have a recent active infection of that pathogen. You can have high IgG for a given pathogen if you had a past infection. It doesn't usually mean an active infection, but if it's very high it could be a clue to an active infection.

NICE flat out says that doctors should not prescribe antivirals to ME patients.
True, you can't get antivirals for ME, but a patients should be able to get antivirals for an active EBV, CMV, or HSV infection, right? ;)
 
Messages
15,786
True, you can't get antivirals for ME, but a patients should be able to get antivirals for an active EBV, CMV, or HSV infection, right? ;)
They should, but 1) serological testing is also recommended against, and 2) NICE doesn't list an exception for chronic or reactivating viruses.

If looking at the relevant document (most GPs won't), it elaborates that serological testing might be okay if the GP believes there could be one of a small group of listed infections. There's no elaboration indicating that viral meds are EVER not recommended against in ME/CFS patients.

The NICE guidelines for ME/CFS badly need to be printed out and burned in effigy :cautious:
 

kermit frogsquire

Senior Member
Messages
125
The easiest way to get antivirals in the UK is 1)pay privately and go to one of the many private ME doctors 2)persuade your GP that you don't have ME, but you may have a persistent herpes virus infection.

Possibility 2) above is actually not that difficult, especially if you have positive blood tests. In the UK doctors are trained to think that ME/CFS is psychological, without actually telling the patient, so if you argue that you can't influence your IgM levels through your mind, and therefore something definitely must be going on, your GP will be more likely to listen than trying to argue that "ME is real".

In my view ME is a heterogeneous group of completely different disorders anyway. Chronic viral infection is just that, a chronic viral infection - and it should be treated accordingly. The reason patients suffer is we all get mixed up in one basket called ME - so why try and argue it is ME?

Just a word of caution - if you do go and see one of the private doctors, they will probably send your GP a letter saying that you have "ME and a chronic viral infection", this can in some circumstances cause a lot of problems in that it confirms to your GP that you have what they think of as ME, i.e. merely fatigue.

Hope the above helps - there have been many prejudices throught history, a label of M.E. is one of the worst!
 

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,800
The easiest way to get antivirals in the UK is 1)pay privately and go to one of the many private ME doctors 2)persuade your GP that you don't have ME, but you may have a persistent herpes virus infection.

The easiest way to get antivirals to buy them directly from prescription-free online pharmacies.
 

SOC

Senior Member
Messages
7,849
The easiest way to get antivirals in the UK is 1)pay privately and go to one of the many private ME doctors
Since very few UK ME patients have found a private ME doctor who will prescribe antivirals, it would help if you would name some of those "many".

2)persuade your GP that you don't have ME, but you may have a persistent herpes virus infection.
Has there ever been an ME patient who convinced a GP they don't have ME after the diagnosis is made? How does one prove a persistent herpesviral infection of GPs aren't supposed to test?