How many of you have been exposed to pesticides?

Messages
70
Likes
100
This can include pesticides or insecticides - roundup, bedbug killing pesticides, pyrethoids, carbamates, organophosphates, organochlorines, etc.

During the whole bedbug mania about 10 years ago, I was exposed to pyrethoids and other bedbug insecticides - how much, I'm not sure. I'm also not sure about the 'breakdown products' of the insecticides that may have developed and contributed to further toxicity in my home. Pyrethoids were thought to be relatively harmless to humans but evidence of immune dysfunction and neurodegenerative diseases being caused by them has been found.

It's possible that exposure has caused immunosuppression which left me susceptible to bacteria/viruses that I wouldn't ordinarily have had a problem with.

Wondering how many of you would have also been exposed. Seems like a credible mechanism.

The odd thing is I think it's pretty hard to prove conclusively, as I'm not sure existing medical tests can determine whether you've taken damage from pesticides/insecticides.
 

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
4,537
Likes
8,271
Location
Alberta
I think a better question is: how many of you have definitely not been exposed to pesticides? I grew up in a fruit-growing area, so I often saw clouds of pesticides blowing around. Even if we aren't exposed to pesticide application, we eat fruits and veggies with residues. Animal fodder can have pesticide residue too. Grains and legumes get sprayed too.

It's possible that exposure has caused immunosuppression which left me susceptible to bacteria/viruses that I wouldn't ordinarily have had a problem with.
Lots of things are possible or at least not impossible. The question is: how likely is it to be a cause? I consider it highly unlikely to be the cause of my ME.

If ME was due to pesticide, there should be a strong correlation between ME cases and locales with differing pesticide regulations and usage. I haven't encountered any such reports.
 
Messages
70
Likes
100
I think a better question is: how many of you have definitely not been exposed to pesticides? I grew up in a fruit-growing area, so I often saw clouds of pesticides blowing around. Even if we aren't exposed to pesticide application, we eat fruits and veggies with residues. Animal fodder can have pesticide residue too. Grains and legumes get sprayed too.



Lots of things are possible or at least not impossible. The question is: how likely is it to be a cause? I consider it highly unlikely to be the cause of my ME.

If ME was due to pesticide, there should be a strong correlation between ME cases and locales with differing pesticide regulations and usage. I haven't encountered any such reports.
I know most people are exposed to trace levels of pesticides on produce. I'm interested in more explicit exposures like my own. You seem to fit the bill as well.

I think we should get away from saying things like "the" cause. Probably safer to assume that many things can be contributory to the risk of getting ME.

It's hard to do a geographic analysis because people move around, and the effects can surface many years later after exposure.
 
Last edited:

ljimbo423

Senior Member
Messages
4,620
Likes
12,454
Location
United States, New Hampshire
I think we should get away from saying things like "the" cause. Probably safer to assume that many things can be contributory to the risk of getting ME.
I agree completely. I think for most of us, there are many contributing factors. I think pesticides are one of probably thousands of toxins that can contribute to ME/CFS. I'm not aware of any single big exposures to pesticides that I've had.

Although I'm sure I've been exposed to many at low levels, as well as countless other toxins.
 

lenora

Senior Member
Messages
3,637
Likes
6,279
Pesticide use began in earnest after WWII and most baby boomers were exposed to them at some point or another. It wasn't uncommon for those applying them to dump large amounts at the end of the day, so it's hard to know exactly how many people were harmed by them.

Also, we have to take into account the strength of an individual's immune system and indeed other systems in the body. Some of us are just genetically weaker to begin with....it just the way we came out. Yes, things like maternal diets and much later alcohol use were implicated, but what if was something as simple as two weak gene strains that produced a child?

Yes, I think insecticides and pesticides are implicated in the worsening of our illness at the very least. I've seen firsthand how dangerous pesticide poisoning is, lived through it (my husband) and we're now totally organic. When did we take leave of our senses all those years ago?
 

Davsey27

Senior Member
Messages
473
Likes
548
I'm starting to think that Me may be epigenetic.Perhaps a toxic agent(s) virus/bacteria/,pesticide/mold/bad air/certain prescription meds,etc that messes with dna sequencing/gene expression.
 
Messages
10,201
Likes
24,625
Perhaps a toxic agent(s) virus/bacteria/,pesticide/mold/bad air/certain prescription meds,etc that messes with dna sequencing/gene expression.
the latest interview with Dr. Ron Tomkins at OMF- he mentioned...almost every gene in our bodies turns on during sepsis.

That we have a "genetic storm" like we have cytokine storms. It does really make you wonder.
 

lenora

Senior Member
Messages
3,637
Likes
6,279
Dr. John Richardson wrote about the effect of pesticides in his book:
https://me-pedia.org/wiki/Enterovir..._Fatigue_Syndrome_and_Other_Organ_Pathologies

He also wrote this paper:
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/threads/richardson-2002-toxins-and-immunity-in-cfs.10933/
(only available to Phoenix Rising members with at least 100 posts)

Well I read the above including Snow Leopard's pdf from 2007. Very interesting as I have witnessed firsthand the effects of what later turned out to be pesticide poisoning in a very healthy male of approx. 50 yrs. of age at the time. I won't repeat this incident,, b/c I have done so approximately twice and I don't want to bore people who are aware of the story. To say it was scary, is a total understatement.

If I hadn't been the type of person I am, we'd still not have an answer (this was in the days before info was readily available on computer....I obtained all info from different university research depts. across the country and, later, anesthesiologists who were most interested in the chemical combinations). I also had two brothers in Vietnam who suffered from distinct after-effects of Agent Orange....so I seriously take pesticide and insecticide use to heart.

Also, pesticides were commonly used on railway tracks, near riverbanks....anywhere that weeds grew. Blackberry bushes were commonly sprayed, but grew anyway, wild blueberries and even wildflowers that were considered "pests".....ones commonly used in gardens today. One only had to stroll along in shorts or a bathing suit to be exposed to these villains.

When there are no earthworms it's a pretty good indication that these materials have been used. All in the name of neatness and a good looking lawn (?). Today we're far more open to imperfection in nature, most people have at least a basic understanding of the synergy between insects and plants, but there are still far too many of these agents being used.

True, we suffer from things like bedbugs, lice and a few other problems b/c of the lack of use of DDT, but at one time it was commonly used for as much as possible. And this was after WWII when someone should have at least been questioning these matters.

The first person, that I recall at least, was Rachel Carson in her book 'Silent Spring." Little did she know what she was on to....and little did we know. Definitely a woman ahead of her time. Yours, Lenora.