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Horrible reaction to Bacillus Coagulans. Beware!

Sophiedw

Senior Member
Messages
383
About 1 month ago I took a single capsule of Bacillus Coagulans, I'd taken a few probiotics in the past without bad reaction so thought nothing of it. Let me start by saying this was a terrible idea as I immediately reacted very badly to it and definitely do not recommend this probiotic to anyone, ever.

The reaction has been very strange and after reading what seems like every single piece of relevant info on the web about it I am only slightly closer to understanding. It was somewhat similar to what Maximillion on Reddit describes as his reaction to Prescript Assist (another spore forming probiotic) but slightly less severe. The main symptom was stiff burning muscles, immediately about 1 hour later and much increaser brain fog. The worst of this had passed in 4 days. It also caused some die off... Annoying! I realise now this has probably impacted my gut flora by reducing diversity.

The weird thing was that I don't think I had particularly fragile gut flora before as I've never had any gut problems and no one else really on the internet describes similar severe reaction to bacillus coagulans. So first question would be why have I reacted so badly?

The symptoms persist with hair loss, reduced energy temp sensitivity raynauls food sensitivity. I tried mutaflor to compete them out and this made the 'lactic acid' type symptoms, stiff burning muscles, much worse. Even though this is normally not a highly lactic acid producing bacteria.

Clostridium Butriciyum (butyrate producing) didn't really make an impact on the symptkms but did give me inflammation after a couple of days.

Culturelle didn't have a bad reaction and maybe it relieved the 'lactic acid' symptoms of stiff muscles.

Now Gutpro infant initially increases the lactic acid feeling then it decreases and makes me feel a bit euphoric /doped up (always nice haha) then in the middle of the night with no exterior input the lactic acid gets much worse, then subsides.

It's so weird! Does anybody have any specific insights as to what this muscular lactic acid thing might represent? I'm thinking due to the nature of it on the gutpro infant perhaps it's getting bad when the horrible sporey bacillus coagulans are perishing? That's what I'd like to think anyway.

My take home message is stay away from Bacillus Coagulans basically. And hoping I can eventually clear it from my system as there has been waxing and waning in the symptoms.

Any specific recommendations for reincreasing diversity/ ridding spore forming bacteria/ reducing lactic acid also welcome.

Also any info on what nutrients might be depleted by increased lactic acid.

Thank you
 

JES

Senior Member
Messages
1,320
Bacillus coagulans is a type of lactic acid bacteria. From my understanding and reading of Ken Lassesen's blog and other sources, lactic acid bacteria in almost all cases do not end up colonizing the gut. In other words, they are not persistent and get flushed out of your system within around 72 hours. It may be that this is not the case with bacillus coagulans, but I doubt it. It seems rather more likely to me that the probiotic set off some kind of immune reaction.

I've had triggering of pro-inflammatory symptoms from most lactic acid bacteria including coagulans and I also had a horrible reaction to prescript assist. But even this horrible reaction left me with no permanent damage thankfully. But it is definitely the case that people with ME/CFS can react with unexpected side effects from things like probiotics, which would normally cause no issues for a healthy person.
 

Crux

Senior Member
Messages
1,441
Location
USA
One thing that happens when a lot of lactic acid is produced is that nitric oxide is then produced to clear it.

Nitric oxide is good for clearing lactic acid, but too much of it can cause a similar pain profile unfortunately.

There are many triggers for nitric oxide production. Liver inflammation looks to be a big one.
 

IThinkImTurningJapanese

Senior Member
Messages
3,492
Location
Japan
@IThinkImTurningJapanese will it change the microbiome in a good way?

It has for me and I'm only doing keto for half the day. Keto changes the environment, now whether that will give you the relief you need remains to be seen.

Adjustments to the microbiome are challenging. I take Miyarisan daily and am not going to stop, but initially that was a very rocky road.

We need Doctors to assist with such changes, but the majority of them are trained by companies that aren't in this business.
 

Sophiedw

Senior Member
Messages
383
Really battling with this but strangely enough found that vitamin K and E alleviated some of the symptoms but then I think induced a magnesium deficency! What a battle. Either way that might be helpful for anyone else who has poisoned themself on Probiotics. Thanks everyone for all the info always! Best wishes.
 

S-VV

Senior Member
Messages
310
Thanks. I too have "posioned" myself with probiotics (prescript assist) and have exactly the same lactic acid symptoms. I suspect it's due to an inmune response to the probiotics.

I have yet to find a solution for them. Daily B12 (hydroxocobalamin) shots, inosine to maintain high uric acid, and l-Carnitine help.

Curse the "soil based" s**t
 

Sophiedw

Senior Member
Messages
383
Thanks. I too have "posioned" myself with probiotics (prescript assist) and have exactly the same lactic acid symptoms. I suspect it's due to an inmune response to the probiotics.

I have yet to find a solution for them. Daily B12 (hydroxocobalamin) shots, inosine to maintain high uric acid, and l-Carnitine help.

Curse the "soil based" s**t


Hey S-VV,

What are the symptoms of your poisoning? As I hopefully emerge from mine I wonder if it's a nutritional deficency incurred by sudden change in gut flora or immune response, rather than a sustained immune response.

Best wishes,

Sophie
 

Sophiedw

Senior Member
Messages
383
I'm just trying to work out the balance but vit K had a profound impact but at 15mg was far too much and immediately depleted something else I think now is vitamin E/A/b2. All very confusing just searching the forums now to see if there is something else I am missing as although 100x better still not gone! Perhaps I just need to wait a few days for the k to build up.

Anyway if this were the case would make me think perhaps people who respond very badly to probiotics have marginal fat soluble vitamin status (or potentially b2 status) to begin with and it throws the whole balance right out of whack.

Just a guess! Good luck!
 

S-VV

Senior Member
Messages
310
Hey S-VV,

What are the symptoms of your poisoning? As I hopefully emerge from mine I wonder if it's a nutritional deficency incurred by sudden change in gut flora or immune response, rather than a sustained immune response.

Best wishes,

Sophie

My main symptom is that lactic acid feeling in the muscles. I bought a lactate meter to confirm, and indeed, there is sometimes a very high lactate peak for minimal exertion.

If it turns out to be a deficiency caused by the microbiota, I would be extatic, as that is much easier to fix. Although it's also true that fat soluble vitamins can change the microbiome.

I'll keep you posted if I make any new discovery. Best of luck in your journey!!
 
Messages
2
I too experienced an adverse reaction to Bacillus Coaglans. Additionally, I took a product called RestorFlora which contains some other Bacillus species and I had an even worse reaction.

Soil-based probiotics/spore-forming probiotics (which are often Bacillus species) don't agree with me at all. Lactobacillus and Bifidobacteria definitely have much better effects.