• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

Has anyone here with Vaccine Injury tried Homeopathic medicine? *Please tag fellow users of users of Homeopathy*

Mary

Moderator Resource
Messages
17,335
Location
Southern California
THIS THREAD IS BEING REOPENED. I'M GOING TO COPY THE MODERATOR'S NOTE POSTED ABOVE ON DECEMBER 3, 2019 - IT STILL HOLDS TRUE!

This thread has been re-opened. Please try to respect each other and our forum rules (which can be read here) as you continue this discussion.

Our forum rules state, in part, that:
When a member chooses to attack the author of a post rather than the content of the post, that is a personal attack. Please keep your focus on the facts of the topic under discussion - not on the person with whom you disagree.
 
Last edited:
Messages
47
Hormone disruptors such as heavy metals have a u-shaped dose-response curve. These substances can be quite toxic at very trace levels and are actually less toxic at moderate levels. This is because at trace amounts, the body sees these substances as potential messengers in systems such as the endocrine (hormone) system. There is a lot of literature about this topic, which has evolved over the last 40 years or so. Google Scholar is a good way to access this and other scientific literature related to toxic substances and chronic illness.
 
Last edited:

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
Hormone disruptors such as heavy metals have a u-shaped dose-response curve. These substances can be quite toxic at very trace levels and are actually less toxic at moderate levels.

Can you provide any credible sources which have demonstrated this claimed U-shaped response curve to endocrine disruptors? For example, animal studies where low doses of endocrine disruptor chemicals caused more harm than higher doses?

From my quick search on the subject just now, this idea does not seem to have any solid evidence behind it, and is just speculation at this stage.

What you are saying is, in effect, that a pregnant women eating one mercury-containing tuna sandwich daily may be doing less harm to her unborn baby that a pregnant woman who eats a tuna sandwich monthly, because you say lower doses of mercury may be more harmful than higher doses, at least with respect to endocrine disruption. But remember that endocrine disruption is not the only toxic mechanism of a chemical.
 
Last edited:

Hip

Senior Member
Messages
17,824
I am sorry; I am not willing to do that.

If you can provide evidence to support your assertions, then I will examine that evidence in a fair way. The idea of a U-shaped response curve to some chemicals is plausible, but it needs evidence to support the theory.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Fat Viking

Senior Member
Messages
153
If you can provide evidence to support your assertions, then I will examine that evidence in a fair way. The idea of a U-shaped response curve to some chemicals is plausible, but it needs evidence to support the theory.

This Scientific evidence was used in a US Court where the Claimant won:
Four theories possibly explaining how autoimmune diseases arise.
They are: (a) molecular mimicry, (b) bystander theory, (c) polyclonal activation, and (d) a dysregulation in the function of T-cells.
Molecular mimicry might trigger autoimmune demyelination after Hepatitis B Vaccination.
 
Last edited:

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
5,684
Location
Alberta
This Scientific evidence was used in a US Court where the Claimant won:

Court verdicts are not valid scientific evidence. The scientific evidence presented might be valid, or might not be valid. The verdict might be based on incorrect background knowledge, emotions, or other non-scientific reasons, and the jurors might misremember evidence that was presented.
 

Wishful

Senior Member
Messages
5,684
Location
Alberta
I've just finished reading 'Bad Science' by Ben Goldacre. It's about the methods used to mislead people about scientific subjects. It's kind of like pulling the curtain back on the wizard of Oz. It does have a section on homeopathy. The author admits that homeopathy does help people...through the placebo effect. He confirmed my previous theory, that the more impressive the theater (author's word, meaning lengthy questioning, fancy but meaningless charts, anything that makes the patient's belief stronger), the stronger the placebo effect.

I recommend the book. I do admit that the author comes across just a wee bit overbearingly arrogant. ;)
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,251
I've just finished reading 'Bad Science' by Ben Goldacre

Here is a link to a Guardian article on the Homeopathic debunkings of Ben Goldacre.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2007/nov/16/sciencenews.g2

homeopathy is operating on a different principle, an energetic principle. I'm not advocating for it, but there is much in the Universe we DON:T know. And Things that occur that don't compute. So if folks wish to use or try this method for treating something, they should be able to do so.
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,251
Interview with Goldacre- says this about folks concerned about vaccinations -

"JB: Vaccine denialism remains stubbornly in place. Why do you think that is?

BG: Vaccine scares are a really interesting one. They have a natural history. They come and go. And they always have and they always will. It’s such an easy focus for scaremongering because it’s an intervention given to healthy people which makes people nervous. You see same anxiety around statins and blood pressure drugs. It also makes your child cry and it hurts and it's horrible and you feel guilty."

Goldacre- clearly has never discovered that he himself has a severe chronic illness, for which there is no treatment, and you know your own immune system was destroyed BEFORE the age of 1; and a lifetime later- nobody is looking at protecting or screening for SENSITIVE BODIES before they begin injections and Russian Roullette one's immune system.

Hep B: hour one. The day your born. They could test the mother for Hep B, but don't, they just mandate the vaccination for Day 1 on brand new baby.

(We successfully escaped thru the back window on that one)
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

Senior Member
Messages
16,047
Location
Second star to the right ...
And Rupert Sheldrake's Ted Talks are banned. Why? What is so dangerous about: his opinions?
I've been a fan of Sheldrake since the early 90's. My guess is that his theories are so far out, in terms of linear thinking and limited imaginations, that they threaten a whole lotta people. And their incomes. And their research. And their status as gurus. In one of his early works, he turns genetics on it's rotund posterior, among other heresies. Fascinating mind.
 
Last edited:

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,251
My guess is that his theories are so far out, in terms of linear thinking and limited imaginations, that they threaten a whole lotta people. And their incomes.

I'm surprised...they bothered preventing his Speech. But who funds Ted Talks: never thought about it. Follow the Ted Talk $$!

Sheldrake's web site isn't cooperating, nor is Twitter.

But here is an interesting additional person's opinion...and I view Homeopathy as- somewhat like tapping into the Morphic Field. These substances- may leave behind an energetic field. And the energetic part of the body may be able to benefit.....

"Lee Smolin, the theoretical physicist, recently put forward a similar idea, which he calls "the principle of precedence," and perhaps his hypothesis might mesh in better with established science, since it is formulated in the context of quantum physics."... this sounded juicy.

Here: we have from Italy...a discussion of Cohesion Phenomena...and the opportunity to consider these within the context of Quantum Physics.....

This is at least interesting to contemplate...I would NOT DARE rule this out....

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30901775

Abstract
BACKGROUND:
 Every living organism is an open system operating far from thermodynamic equilibrium and exchanging energy, matter and information with an external environment. These exchanges are performed through non-linear interactions of billions of different biological components, at different levels, from the quantum to the macro-dimensional. The concept of quantum coherence is an inherent property of living cells, used for long-range interactions such as synchronization of cell division processes. There is support from recent advances in quantum biology, which demonstrate that coherence, as a state of order of matter coupled with electromagnetic (EM) fields, is one of the key quantum phenomena supporting life dynamics. Coherent phenomena are well explained by quantum field theory (QFT), a well-established theoretical framework in quantum physics. Water is essential for life, being the medium used by living organisms to carry out various biochemical reactions and playing a fundamental role in coherent phenomena.