Duration of fatigue

[sming]

I'm new to CFS so forgive the potential duplicate question, it's not easy an easy topic to search for.

Is it possible for CFS to exhibit the following symptoms during the day:
0500-0900: fatigue
0900-1500: little/no fatigue
1500-1800: fatigue
1800 onwards: little/no fatigue

Thanks, Pete

 

[minkeygirl]

There is no rule to how this works. Whatever happens to you is what happens. I feel like crap when I get up. Rally for a bit, then crash for most of the day and then perk up around 4.

It's pretty common for us to feel better later in the day but there are some who feel better in the morning.

Whatever is happening to you is what it is.

 

[Dr.Patient]

I'm new to CFS so forgive the potential duplicate question, it's not easy an easy topic to search for.

Is it possible for CFS to exhibit the following symptoms during the day:
0500-0900: fatigue
0900-1500: little/no fatigue
1500-1800: fatigue
1800 onwards: little/no fatigue

Thanks, Pete

This biphasic curve is seen in many patients. I too have it...

 

[sming]

There is no rule to how this works. Whatever happens to you is what happens.

I get your sentiment. However I'm new to the potential diagnosis of CFS. For many years I've been treated as IBS+depression but I've always felt something else was going on. I'm still trying to work out if CFS is a viable diagnosis - and will probably ask a bunch of n00b questions in the process...

I feel like crap when I get up. Rally for a bit, then crash for most of the day and then perk up around 4.

sounds like the inverse of my day. 4pm at work is my most dreaded period. I go and nap on a park bench for 30 mins when possible and/or just try and look like I'm doing something and not fall asleep...

 

[minkeygirl]

The only way you're going to know if you have CFS is to get some tests run and see where you stand. Just having varying levels of fatigue during the day is not a diagnostic tool. And having this diagnosis is not something you want.

@Hip just started a great thread. Maybe this will help you.

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...-cfs-testing-and-treatment.31641/#post-486089

 

[optimist]

I can relate to that, except I don't get to the point of no fatigue. I am like a YoYo without a fixed pattern. Somtimes morning is good, sometimes night, sometimes mid day. Sometimes a few good days continually, sometimes bad days continually, sometimes one good, one bad, a good again...

 

[minkeygirl]

I also don't know what DrPatient means about biphasic curve. You have multiple phases.

 

[Dr.Patient]

I can relate to that, except I don't get to the point of no fatigue. I am like a YoYo without a fixed pattern. Somtimes morning is good, sometimes night, sometimes mid day. Sometimes a few good days continually, sometimes bad days continually, sometimes one good, one bad, a good again...

Yes, same with me too, totally unpredictable!

 

[Dr.Patient]

There is no rule to how this works. Whatever happens to you is what happens. I feel like crap when I get up. Rally for a bit, then crash for most of the day and then perk up around 4.

It's pretty common for us to feel better later in the day but there are some who feel better in the morning.

Whatever is happening to you is what it is.

Fatigue in the morning and evening, with some energy in the afternoons and nights is sometimes referred to as biphasic- two upward curves in energy...

 

[optimist]

My only way of getting some stabilizing effect to the YoYo is being very strict about what i eat, though not always successful.

 

[minkeygirl]

@sming What you have is a Duophasic curve. If you want to call it anything. It just is.

 

[SOC]

I've stopped the yoyo thing for me by pacing better. Without HR monitoring to stay below my AT, I was always in that unpredictable state. Now I can predict what I can do 90% of the time. It's certainly not everything I want to do, but I can do more overall by keeping a steady low level of activity instead of doing the roller coaster thing.

Sometimes that bad morning, good afternoon, bad evening problem is related to OI, especially if you have low blood volume as a number of PWME do. You get dehydrated overnight so you feel crappy in the morning. You rehydrate sufficiently once you're awake to feel better for a while, but don't manage to get your blood volume up enough to stay feeling okay.

 

[taniaaust1]

My energy levels are lower in the morning probably due to the coexisting POTS and I dehydrate some during the night. I pick up in the afternoon but if I do anything on my feet, Im then exhausted by evening. (the only way I can avoid that is to not be doing on my feet things in the arvo when Im feeling at my best).

If you only have fatigue, depression and IBS, I'd suggest not really considering much ME/CFS as usually one has many other symptoms too, few symptoms may lead to wrong diagnoses. If you do feel depressed, that alone can cause bouts of fatigue. Depressed people may follow cycles to things too.

Fatigue cycles could also be caused by issues to certain foods you regularly eat.

 

[Dr.Patient]

My only way of getting some stabilizing effect to the YoYo is being very strict about what i eat, though not always successful.

Please look at my thread Eating easy to digest food, maybe it'll help you...

 

[sming]

If you only have fatigue, depression and IBS, I'd suggest not really considering much ME/CFS ...

I'm not sure what you mean here. Either way I have nearly all the symptoms listed on most CFE definitions, except for joint & muscle pain.

 

[sming]

AT = (at rest something?), OI = Orthostatic Intolerance?

 

[sming]

I can relate to that, except I don't get to the point of no fatigue. I am like a YoYo without a fixed pattern. Somtimes morning is good, sometimes night, sometimes mid day. Sometimes a few good days continually, sometimes bad days continually, sometimes one good, one bad, a good again...

that's familiar... I have a seeming x-weekly cycle. x weeks of terrible IBS pain, fatigue and depression (~ 1/10 life quality) and then x weeks where it recedes to the milder daily cycle in my initial post (~ 7/10 life quality). Not many IBS'ers have this pronounced cycle, which lead me towards investigating CFS.

 

[SOC]

@sming
Exactly right on the OI=orthostatic intolerance

AT = anaerobic threshold. It is determined using a CPET test (an exercise test on a bike). Most, probably all, ME/CFS patients have abnormal CPET tests indicating problems with aerobic metabolism so that we are doing anaerobic exercise during activities of daily living. That is, our bodies use anaerobic glycolysis for most daily activities (metabolic equivalent to hardcore training for most people) instead of the normal aerobic metabolism. This causes many difficulties with physical activities so many of us are unable to work and largely housebound. Some of us are bedbound.

If you have ME/CFS and are still working, I strongly suggest you get yourself into the care of a top ME/CFS specialist so that you stay that way. Many of us started with mild symptoms like yours and deteriorated over the years because we weren't getting the right medical advice and treatment. Proper pacing is critical slowing the downward slide. Patients who get the right care within the first 3-5 years of the illness have a much greater chance of remission than patients who don't. No sense in missing that golden window.

There are only a handful or two of top ME/CFS specialists -- very, very few in most parts of the world -- so most of them have long waiting lists. I suggest you get on several waiting lists now.

 

[sming]

The only way you're going to know if you have CFS is to get some tests run and see where you stand. Just having varying levels of fatigue during the day is not a diagnostic tool. And having this diagnosis is not something you want.

@Hip just started a great thread. Maybe this will help you.

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...-cfs-testing-and-treatment.31641/#post-486089

thanks for the info. In one way I do want CFS as a dx since it may alleviate some of the blame I inflict on myself for being tired all the time. And besides, I already have two chronic debilitating conditions so a third is just a 50% increase

 

[minkeygirl]

I'm not sure why you beat yourself up over something you have no control over. A waste of energy IMO.

You don't want a disease that has no treatment.