Coronavirus Vaccine(s)

[Booble]

It's challenging because from a public health perspective, how transparent can they be without scaring everyone off?

 

[andyguitar]

I do think we should vaccinate as many people as possible, but I'd rather have more complete information.

It will take years to get a clear picture of what the long term effect of these vaccines will be.

how transparent can they be without scaring everyone off?

I think it would be helpful if the medical profession stopped pretending they are certain about things and just said they dont know.

 

[Booble]

I think it would be helpful if the medical profession stopped pretending they are certain about things and just said they dont know.

I think the scary part is what they DO know, but can't say.

 

[andyguitar]

I think the scary part is what they DO know, but can't say.

One thing they do know, but has been forgotten about, is that the numbers of subjects in the clinical trials of the vaccines was in the 10s of thousands which is not going to show up rare side effects.

 

[Booble]

One thing they do know, but has been forgotten about, is that the numbers of subjects in the clinical trials of the vaccines was in the 10s of thousands which is not going to show up rare side effects.

That's so true. And think about the types of people that would sign up for trials. Certainly not any of us!
It's likely that most are those with the least reactive physical conditions.

 

[hapl808]

It will take years to get a clear picture of what the long term effect of these vaccines will be.
I think it would be helpful if the medical profession stopped pretending they are certain about things and just said they dont know.

I agree 100%. I'd feel much better if they said more often, "We have seen no evidence that vaccines cause any long term damage, but we continue to collect data."

Instead, I think the medical profession thinks feigned absolute certainty makes everyone feel better, but it just makes a lot of us feel that they're lying about everything. As we've unfortunately experienced many times the, "Oh, this definitely won't have a bad effect." And then being gaslit when we have a bad effect and are told it's in our head because there's no way they could ever be wrong about anything.

The medical profession may change their advice and opinion, but their arrogance and certainty never change even if they start giving different advice than they gave six months ago.

 

[hapl808]

It's challenging because from a public health perspective, how transparent can they be without scaring everyone off?

I do think this is a real challenge. The medical establishment and the press shouldn't be tweeting out everything in real time and scaring people needlessly. However, I'm not convinced they're even collecting good data themselves since they already have a preconceived conclusion (vaccines are safe for everyone) and don't want to do anything that could theoretically challenge it. Therefore, they modify what they report to make everything sound 100% safe, when we all know that pretty much nothing is 100% safe.

And same for all of us. Most of the medical establishment doesn't take us particularly seriously to begin with, so obviously they're not collecting serious data. If you think your patient has a psychological issue, then you're pretty much ignoring any physical manifestations. Easier to write them off as a psych issue than to admit that there's a physical illness affecting many people with no easy fix or even diagnosis. They've obviously been trying to figure out a way to do that with long Covid, but so many people got it that it's been difficult to say it's all in their heads (but they're trying).

 

[Booble]

I agree 100%. I'd feel much better if they said more often, "We have seen no evidence that vaccines cause any long term damage, but we continue to collect data."

I'm pleased to say that in my local area our country health director has said exactly that. She explained to us how she went about making the decision for herself and her family regarding the vaccine. She admitted that there are lots of unknowns, but the reason she chose to get it and urges others is that there is a 1-2 chance in 100 that you will die if you contract COVID-19 (and a 2-5 out of a hundred that you will be hospitalized) versus a 1 in 1 million (+) chance that you will die from the vaccine. But she was very clear that the data is still coming in and we are learning as we go.

 

[Booble]

I do think this is a real challenge. The medical establishment and the press shouldn't be tweeting out everything in real time and scaring people needlessly. However, I'm not convinced they're even collecting good data themselves since they already have a preconceived conclusion (vaccines are safe for everyone) and don't want to do anything that could theoretically challenge it. Therefore, they modify what they report to make everything sound 100% safe, when we all know that pretty much nothing is 100% safe.

And same for all of us. Most of the medical establishment doesn't take us particularly seriously to begin with, so obviously they're not collecting serious data. If you think your patient has a psychological issue, then you're pretty much ignoring any physical manifestations. Easier to write them off as a psych issue than to admit that there's a physical illness affecting many people with no easy fix or even diagnosis. They've obviously been trying to figure out a way to do that with long Covid, but so many people got it that it's been difficult to say it's all in their heads (but they're trying).

I don't agree that they have a preconceived notion that the vaccines are safe for everyone. I think those deep in the field are well aware of the challenges and risks.
It's just that the benefits to the society are so great that all they can do is try to minimize them.
The reality is that without vaccines for all the things we vaccinate there would be much more sickness and death.

 

[PhoenixBurger]

OK so I got the Pfizer vaccine on March 9.

Quick background: I hung out here for a couple years when I was extremely sick with symptoms identical to most of yours. I just had the hepatitis B vaccine, but also a new CMV infection, and I even went to see the doctor at nova southeast University. She did the full immune testing on me and told me my immune system was on overdrive. I had months of fatigue, bodywide muscle twitching, exercise intolerance, leg neuropathy, tingling and buzzing feet, sleep problems, muscle cramping, arthritic painful joints, brain fog, frozen and burning hands in shower, and at 39 years old (slim fit male) basically felt like a 90-year-old.

As time went on, I’m mostly recovered. With ongoing sensitivities to basically everything which I can mitigate with lifestyle. But I’d say I am back to 100% as long as I stick with some basic diet and lifestyle habits.

So I don’t know where I fit in this group now, but I think it’s important that people know the posters health status as they review their COVID vaccine reactions.

PFIZER VACCINE - MAR 9

At time of shot: Left hand pins and needles for 10 mins.
Day 1: Sore arm like an extremely hard punch.
Day 2: Fatigue kicked in. Lower back pain/inflammation at base of spine. And anger. I have not been so unbelievably agitated for no reason in years. Late in the day that lower spine inflammation did what I haven’t experienced in years - my leg started neuropathy again. Buzzing and vibrating foot.
Day 3: Bouts of mild fatigue. Had a nap or two. Leg neuropathy lingered. Mild muscle twitching. Definitely would say an uptick of My personal immune inflammatory symptoms had returned fire the first time in 8 years.
Day 4: Back to normal. Thankful the autoimmune symptoms seemed to stop.
Day 5: mild Aching armpit glands and general body weirdness. Highly helped with a whole body mild workout with weights. Stayed careful though as I know that when you’re immune system is in overdrive, the last thing you need to do is wear yourself down at the gym. It can backfire.

Day 6 forward: Fine. Periodic achy armpit glands. I understand that the vaccine continues to develop antibodies until about day 14 anyways so I assume there’s ongoing low-grade immune activity in my body. Taking it easy at the gym, but definitely helps to naturally suppress any unnecessary immune system craziness.

TLDR: It’s my conclusion that if you have suffered from any of the many symptoms which come along with a taxed or hyper immune system, you will probably see an uptick for the first week. Thankfully, it does seem to completely stop quickly after.

By the way: I strongly believe vaccine reports need to be discussed here. Maybe a thread that only allows vaccine shot reports from people. No casual conversation.

This thread is full of thoughts, comments, and general discussions. But a thread where people just post reports and no other content, would be really valuable for folks here.

This way you can look at each person‘s current health status/symptoms, and how they fared with each shot. Maybe the moderators can consider creating such a thread.

 

[Booble]

OK so I got the Pfizer vaccine on March 9.

Quick background: I hung out here for a couple years when I was extremely sick with symptoms identical to most of yours. I just had the hepatitis B vaccine, but also a new CMV infection, and I even went to see the doctor at nova southeast University. She did the full immune testing on me and told me my immune system was on overdrive. I had months of fatigue, bodywide muscle twitching, exercise intolerance, leg neuropathy, tingling and buzzing feet, sleep problems, muscle cramping, arthritic painful joints, brain fog, frozen and burning hands in shower, and at 39 years old (slim fit male) basically felt like a 90-year-old.

As time went on, I’m mostly recovered. With ongoing sensitivities to basically everything which I can mitigate with lifestyle. But I’d say I am back to 100% as long as I stick with some basic diet and lifestyle habits.

So I don’t know where I fit in this group now, but I think it’s important that people know the posters health status as they review their COVID vaccine reactions.

PFIZER VACCINE - MAR 9

At time of shot: Left hand pins and needles for 10 mins.
Day 1: Sore arm like an extremely hard punch.
Day 2: Fatigue kicked in. Lower back pain/inflammation at base of spine. And anger. I have not been so unbelievably agitated for no reason in years. Late in the day that lower spine inflammation did what I haven’t experienced in years - my leg started neuropathy again. Buzzing and vibrating foot.
Day 3: Bouts of mild fatigue. Had a nap or two. Leg neuropathy lingered. Mild muscle twitching. Definitely would say an uptick of My personal immune inflammatory symptoms had returned fire the first time in 8 years.
Day 4: Back to normal. Thankful the autoimmune symptoms seemed to stop.
Day 5: mild Aching armpit glands and general body weirdness. Highly helped with a whole body mild workout with weights. Stayed careful though as I know that when you’re immune system is in overdrive, the last thing you need to do is wear yourself down at the gym. It can backfire.

Day 6 forward: Fine. Periodic achy armpit glands. I understand that the vaccine continues to develop antibodies until about day 14 anyways so I assume there’s ongoing low-grade immune activity in my body. Taking it easy at the gym, but definitely helps to naturally suppress any unnecessary immune system craziness.

TLDR: It’s my conclusion that if you have suffered from any of the many symptoms which come along with a taxed or hyper immune system, you will probably see an uptick for the first week. Thankfully, it does seem to completely stop quickly after.

By the way: I strongly believe vaccine reports need to be discussed here. Maybe a thread that only allows vaccine shot reports from people. No casual conversation.

This thread is full of thoughts, comments, and general discussions. But a thread where people just post reports and no other content, would be really valuable for folks here.

This way you can look at each person‘s current health status/symptoms, and how they fared with each shot. Maybe the moderators can consider creating such a thread.

Thanks very much for sharing!
I'm glad you made it through your week of side effects without any long lasting issues.
That is a GREAT idea to make a vaccine report forum area. That would allow the bravest of us (who have access to vaccine) to report back. Speaking for myself I'm OK with having a week of added crap feeling if I'm confident it won't kill me or add never ending complications.

 

[pattismith]

french Health Autority publication on March 19th

HAS recommendations

In view of the data provided by the EMA, the HAS believes that vaccination with the AstraZeneca vaccine can be resumed without delay.

However, the EMA has identified a possible increased risk of Cerebral Veinous Trombosis / Disseminated Intravascular Coagulation in people under the age of 55.
Given the progress of the vaccination campaign, which will concern elderly populations over the next two months and the existence of alternatives for the youngest, the HAS recommends at this stage to use the AstraZeneca vaccine only for people aged 55 and over, who constitute the vast majority of current priority people. Pending further data, HAS therefore recommends the use of mRNA vaccines in persons eligible for vaccination under the age of 55.


The HAS recalls that the real-life efficacy data of the AstraZeneca vaccine observed in a large cohort show a prevention of hospitalizations linked to Covid-19 of 94% (confidence interval [73-99]), between 28 and 34 days after the first dose; this vaccine having been administered mainly to those over 65 years of age.

For people under the age of 55 who have already received a first dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine, the HAS will very soon adopt the methods of administering the second dose. HAS recalls that an interval of 12 weeks must be observed between the two doses. Indeed, the efficacy and immunogenicity data available show a positive impact of the lengthening of the duration between the two doses and the persistence up to 12 weeks of the protection conferred by the first dose.

This opinion will be reviewed soon, in close collaboration with the ANSM, depending on the pharmacovigilance data to come, with more hindsight on the AstraZeneca vaccine, in particular in people under 55 years of age.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Please keep us posted. I am wondering if he had any pre-existing conditions (specifically any autoimmune disease)?

I'm hoping to find out more....he is in Mexico City and got either Pfizer or maybe Sputnik. So just finding that out would be helpful to know.

These are very rare event...we have to keep that in perspective.

 

[Strawberry]

I finally heard back from dr k’s nurse today. She said take any vaccine I can get.... My brother got his first shot yesterday, and was told j&j isn’t available in Washington state yet...

@Gingergrrl


edit to add I’m desperate to get back to work, I can’t live off zero income. I’m still afraid to get Phizer or moderna, but no idea when I can get j&j. I know someone with our disease that died last week. I can’t remain unvaccinated!

 

[Booble]

I finally heard back from dr k’s nurse today. She said take any vaccine I can get.... My brother got his first shot yesterday, and was told j&j isn’t available in Washington state yet...

@Gingergrrl

That's pretty much the standard line.

I don't think they know enough yet to distinguish between who is more at risk for which type.

 

[Strawberry]

Yikes. Just read the other thread too. I’ll be broke and homeless before I get the shot.

 

[Gingergrrl]

I finally heard back from dr k’s nurse today. She said take any vaccine I can get.... My brother got his first shot yesterday, and was told j&j isn’t available in Washington state yet...

@Gingergrrl

Thanks for tagging me and what they told you matches. That is why I was confused when you said that their office (and the masto society) said not to get Pfizer or Moderna. It doesn't change my own personal plan but I was just very curious from your prior post (in this thread) and I appreciate your clarifying. I hope that you will be able to get the vaccine that you want.

 

[PisForPerseverance]

How was your second shot? I'm up the night after my first shot waiting to take more Tylenol so I could sleep.

OK so I got the Pfizer vaccine on March 9.

Quick background: I hung out here for a couple years when I was extremely sick with symptoms identical to most of yours. I just had the hepatitis B vaccine, but also a new CMV infection, and I even went to see the doctor at nova southeast University. She did the full immune testing on me and told me my immune system was on overdrive. I had months of fatigue, bodywide muscle twitching, exercise intolerance, leg neuropathy, tingling and buzzing feet, sleep problems, muscle cramping, arthritic painful joints, brain fog, frozen and burning hands in shower, and at 39 years old (slim fit male) basically felt like a 90-year-old.

As time went on, I’m mostly recovered. With ongoing sensitivities to basically everything which I can mitigate with lifestyle. But I’d say I am back to 100% as long as I stick with some basic diet and lifestyle habits.

So I don’t know where I fit in this group now, but I think it’s important that people know the posters health status as they review their COVID vaccine reactions.

PFIZER VACCINE - MAR 9

At time of shot: Left hand pins and needles for 10 mins.
Day 1: Sore arm like an extremely hard punch.
Day 2: Fatigue kicked in. Lower back pain/inflammation at base of spine. And anger. I have not been so unbelievably agitated for no reason in years. Late in the day that lower spine inflammation did what I haven’t experienced in years - my leg started neuropathy again. Buzzing and vibrating foot.
Day 3: Bouts of mild fatigue. Had a nap or two. Leg neuropathy lingered. Mild muscle twitching. Definitely would say an uptick of My personal immune inflammatory symptoms had returned fire the first time in 8 years.
Day 4: Back to normal. Thankful the autoimmune symptoms seemed to stop.
Day 5: mild Aching armpit glands and general body weirdness. Highly helped with a whole body mild workout with weights. Stayed careful though as I know that when you’re immune system is in overdrive, the last thing you need to do is wear yourself down at the gym. It can backfire.

Day 6 forward: Fine. Periodic achy armpit glands. I understand that the vaccine continues to develop antibodies until about day 14 anyways so I assume there’s ongoing low-grade immune activity in my body. Taking it easy at the gym, but definitely helps to naturally suppress any unnecessary immune system craziness.

TLDR: It’s my conclusion that if you have suffered from any of the many symptoms which come along with a taxed or hyper immune system, you will probably see an uptick for the first week. Thankfully, it does seem to completely stop quickly after.

By the way: I strongly believe vaccine reports need to be discussed here. Maybe a thread that only allows vaccine shot reports from people. No casual conversation.

This thread is full of thoughts, comments, and general discussions. But a thread where people just post reports and no other content, would be really valuable for folks here.

This way you can look at each person‘s current health status/symptoms, and how they fared with each shot. Maybe the moderators can consider creating such a thread.

 

[sometexan84]

Then they talked about a special kind of B-cell that they discovered in both mice and humans (usually females) who have autoimmunity including RA, Lupus, Scleroderma, Sarcoidosis, Sjogrens, Crohns, MS, Hashimotos, Myasthenia Gravis, Type 1 Diabetes, and many other autoimmune diseases. They called it "ABC cells" or "Autoimmune B-cells". They said at present, there are no drugs that target ABC cells (but they mentioned later in the video that Rituximab has been successful in many cases). They were not sure, however, if this was because Rituximab specifically targets and destroys ABC cells or because Rituximab destroys ALL B-cells. This part was very interesting to me (separate from my research on the COVID vaccines) b/c Rituximab is what brought about my personal remission.

You know what's interesting about this?

Those conditions have all been linked to Enterovirus.