Complete Symptom Relief and CFS Remission Since Starting Nitric Oxide Supplement

[parabola]

Isn't NO2 nitrogen dioxide, a pollutant?

 

[MeSci]

Isn't NO2 nitrogen dioxide, a pollutant?

Post 93 points out that what is being talked about here is nitric oxide, not nitrogen dioxide.

 

[sflorence]

I would say try Arginine AKG if you are interested in NO boosting.

My little input on this matter, I would not try NO2 Black because I suspect that a majority of this forum has Mercury poisoning. Even if NO2 makes you feel good for a week eventually all that ALA will start swishing the mercury around your body/brain. I used to take ALA and it make me really sick over the course of a few months, probably caused a lot of damage.

 

[SwanRonson]

I started taking it yesterday and so far so good. By that I mean no side effects I started with half a pill at breakfast and the other half at lunch yesterday. Then a full pill at breakfast and lunch today. I have felt more stable and nothing bad yet. I'll stick with it and increase to 2 pills at each meal after a few days.

 

[sflorence]

Has anyone had successes with citruline? I have been reading on bodybuilding forums that most people there claim citruline works the best when it comes to NO boosting. They say it converts in the kidneys to a more bio-available form of Arginine, which more readily converts to NO.

I have had no success with AAKG or L-Arginine (free form)

To add some fuel to the fire, I read this from an article
"A German study focusing on heart patients found that a 3 gram dose of citrulline malate yielded improvements in vascular function and vasodilation equivalent to a 6g dose of arginine"

 

[knackers323]

I tried the no2 but seen no benefit. I currently take a small dose of parnate, an maoi. now it shouldn't be mixed with certain foods or alcohol because it can raise blood pressure and I guess cause vasodilation.

when I drink a reasonable amount of alcohol, the next day I feel bad from the alcohol but strangely, much clearer headed, lighter. it only lasts about a day.

ive now found that a big dose of oregano oil seems to work similar within an hour or so.

I have read that cfsers seem to have a problem with brain vasodilation. anyone know the theory on the mechanism behind this?

wonder why the no2 doesn't work though?

 

[sflorence]

I advise that you should not take pubmed studies at face value, but they have something to offer. This study below shows that there was no significant increase in NO production using Arginine.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3489573/


In my experience, after two weeks of trying all different forms or Arginine, and even trying Citruline, all at very high doses, I had no sign of NO increase. I am not a firm believer that these products can truly increase NO.

 

[gregh286]

Well I am 6 month mark now and have steadily improved over that period to a point of being CFS free.
I can play golf every day, go to gym after it, no repercussions. In March I had to play every other day as there was a slight "payback" then. Now I have none. It has been a gradual ascendancy.

I do not attribute NO2 black to "curing" me but helped alleviate symptoms during the start of this "recovery period". Now I take only 4 tabs a day, previous was 10. I envisage a point in 2016 where I can stop them,

In addition to NO2 black I have been taking tyrosine and l-dopa supplements combined with high carb diet. High carb diet allowed me to keep cortisol low, helping adrenal rest. It also stimulates insulin release to help vasodilation, I can feel heat increase in feet after carbs at the start,,,now circulation is 100% as feet hot all the time. There has been a substantial circulation and/or blood volume improvement.

Tyrosine and L-dopa was used as I was very low in neurohormones, dopa, epinephine and so on, I posted these results on the forum in another thread. Tyrosine precursor to l-dopa, upchain from epinephine, norepinehine.

From Ron Davies at the 11ME conference
"Davis finished by highlighting one more pathway where he has observed severely abnormal data points in the ME/CFS patients: the GTP cyclohydrolase pathway. GTP looks to be low in ME/CFS, and downstream from that, as a consequence BH4 also seems to be low.

BH4 is used to make dopamine and serotonin, and he’s also seeing low dopamine in the kidney — it seems that his subjects may be unable to secrete salt, which would have all sorts of effects, including low blood volume and restrictions of blood vessels … which could account for a lot of symptoms."

I wish everyone well at PhenixRising as naturally I spend less time on here now...I think the OMF team are damn close to bringing the curtain down on this brutal and forgotten enigma.

I have sent all my files, data and dosages to OMF who have received it with thanks.
Thirst was always a major trait of mine during the worst periods which would sound plausible with the low salt secretion.

Feel Free to PM me with any questions.
If you're going through hell keep going.

 

[sflorence]

Well I am 6 month mark now and have steadily improved over that period to a point of being CFS free.
I can play golf every day, go to gym after it, no repercussions. In March I had to play every other day as there was a slight "payback" then. Now I have none. It has been a gradual ascendancy.

I do not attribute NO2 black to "curing" me but helped alleviate symptoms during the start of this "recovery period". Now I take only 4 tabs a day, previous was 10. I envisage a point in 2016 where I can stop them,

Thanks for reporting back, we all really do appreciate it.

did you ever get a chance to try AAKG alone? Many here were curious to whether AAKG is the magic bullet in NO2 black. I cannot take NO2 black because of the ALA in it.

I have tried up to 10g of AAKG a day (equal to 10 pills of NO2 black) and I saw no boost in my NO levels. The only other factor could be that the AAKG was time-released, which I happened to find two other products that have the same thing.
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swan...real-akg-arginine-alpha-ketoglutarate-90-tabs
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swan...rginine-sustained-release-tab-1000-mg-90-tabs
Anyone tried it?

 

[gregh286]

Thanks for reporting back, we all really do appreciate it.

did you ever get a chance to try AAKG alone? Many here were curious to whether AAKG is the magic bullet in NO2 black. I cannot take NO2 black because of the ALA in it.

I have tried up to 10g of AAKG a day (equal to 10 pills of NO2 black) and I saw no boost in my NO levels.

Hi. No i stuck on no2 black. Believer of if it aint broke dont fix it.

 

[panckage]

@gregh286 very happy to hear about your return to the land of living. If you can find any time to do some advocacy we will be forever indebted. Please don't forget us!

 

[SwanRonson]

I started taking it yesterday and so far so good. By that I mean no side effects I started with half a pill at breakfast and the other half at lunch yesterday. Then a full pill at breakfast and lunch today. I have felt more stable and nothing bad yet. I'll stick with it and increase to 2 pills at each meal after a few days.

As a followup, I stopped taking this a couple of days ago. It started making me feel very strange. Itchy skin, headache, general odd feeling. It got unpleasent enough that, in the absence of more pronounced improvement, it wasn't worth it. I may try it again soon, as I like to give things a fair shot, but I didn't really see much help from it for the 5 days I was on it.

 

[sflorence]

As a followup, I stopped taking this a couple of days ago. It started making me feel very strange. Itchy skin, headache, general odd feeling. It got unpleasent enough that, in the absence of more pronounced improvement, it wasn't worth it. I may try it again soon, as I like to give things a fair shot, but I didn't really see much help from it for the 5 days I was on it.

Sounds like you could be reacting to the ALA. If you have any mercury in your body ALA will pick it up and dump it in the next spot 3 hours later.

 

[Biarritz13]

I don't know if you saw but the price has decreased on Amazon.co.uk. I ordered one!

 

[Biarritz13]

I think the NO2 is "force opening" the smaller vessels.

Kdm was of opinion that the lyme biofims attached to inner vessel wall inhibiting vessel flexibility and clogging up microcirculation.

NO2 black is only masking the underlying issue.

Personally i think i have some bacterial overgrowth on small vessels keeping them rigid....in hot humidity they become flexible again.....much like when you heat glue it softens.

Maybe kdm is right all this time and its a lyme issue.

Biofilms in Infection Prevention and Control: A Healthcare Handbook

"The structure of medical biofilms is substantially influenced by the interaction of particles of non-microbial components from the host or environment. In the human body, biofilms on native heart valves provide a clear example of this type of interaction, in which the biofilm’s bacterial micro-colonies develop in a matrix of platelets, fibrin and EPS..."

Disseminated Intravascular Coagulation

"The sticky fibrin matrix promotes platelet disposition in capillaries and arterioles leading to thrombosis and ultimately causing small vessel occlusion. Clots or thrombosis within blood vessels lead to decreased perfusion thus decreased supply of oxygen and other vital nutrients to tissues distal to the clot. The decreased perfusion leads to ischemia, injury and without treatment, loss of cell function. The ischemic cells revert to anaerobic metabolism with resulting increase in lactic acid causing metabolic acidosis and eventually necrosis/cell death."

Nitric Oxide and the Cardiovascular System

"NO suppresses platelet adhesion to the endothelium thereby preventing platelet recruitment and aggregation, as well. When stimulated with bradykinin, endothelial cells release NO in amounts sufficient to inhibit platelet adhesion. Immediately downstream from where NO is released, platelet aggregation is diminished…"


KDM may be right.

 

[gregh286]

Biofilms in Infection Prevention and Control: A Healthcare Handbook

"The structure of medical biofilms is substantially influenced by the interaction of particles of non-microbial components from the host or environment. In the human body, biofilms on native heart valves provide a clear example of this type of interaction, in which the biofilm’s bacterial micro-colonies develop in a matrix of platelets, fibrin and EPS..."

Disseminated Intravascular Coagulation

"The sticky fibrin matrix promotes platelet disposition in capillaries and arterioles leading to thrombosis and ultimately causing small vessel occlusion. Clots or thrombosis within blood vessels lead to decreased perfusion thus decreased supply of oxygen and other vital nutrients to tissues distal to the clot. The decreased perfusion leads to ischemia, injury and without treatment, loss of cell function. The ischemic cells revert to anaerobic metabolism with resulting increase in lactic acid causing metabolic acidosis and eventually necrosis/cell death."

Nitric Oxide and the Cardiovascular System

"NO suppresses platelet adhesion to the endothelium thereby preventing platelet recruitment and aggregation, as well. When stimulated with bradykinin, endothelial cells release NO in amounts sufficient to inhibit platelet adhesion. Immediately downstream from where NO is released, platelet aggregation is diminished…"


KDM may be right.

its interesting thanks.
maybe we are just prone to biofilm buildups.
@Elph68 was an advocate of biofilm buildups....plaque like formations.

 

[Biarritz13]

its interesting thanks.
maybe we are just prone to biofilm buildups.
@Elph68 was an advocate of biofilm buildups....plaque like formations.

But some have tried and there is only 2 successes so far, including you.

I can't know for sure but maybe you are in a different subgroup.

 

[gregh286]

hi.
yea but was also noticed by fluge and mella using NO. they must have had decent responders.
i can still dip very quickly taking lots of sugar..........NO2 black or not. i am in remission but i am aware of "known" triggers at the same time.....hence would never use term cured.

 

[Biarritz13]

hi.
yea but was also noticed by fluge and mella using NO. they must have had decent responders.
i can still dip very quickly taking lots of sugar..........NO2 black or not. i am in remission but i am aware of "known" triggers at the same time.....hence would never use term cured.

Right, I forgot them. Do you know if they will publish something in the near future?

You are not on a ketogenic diet, are you?

 

[kangaSue]

But some have tried and there is only 2 successes so far, including you.

I can't know for sure but maybe you are in a different subgroup.

There are others getting a benefit from prescription nitrate vasodilators, it amounts to the same thing as using these supplements, they all act as potassium channel openers.
http://cvpharmacology.com/vasodilator/nitro