Can an autoimmune diet lower autoantibody titers?

[ChookityPop]

The arguebly best way to eat if you have autoimmune disease is a straight carnivore diet or an animal based diet including organ meats like liver and low toxic plant foods.

I wonder if diet can lower autoantibodies?

I read a story about a 13 year old that had TS-HDS autoantibodies at 17000. A year after diet change, b12 and other supplements, dealing with heavy metals/chemicals her titers were at 0!

Isnt that unheard of? A that big of reduction in titers?

Here is the post.

 

[JES]

I suspect ketosis might be a reason why the carnivore diet works since ketosis alters the metabolism and immune system in profound ways. The problem with these diets is the commitment you need and the long-term risk with staying on them. A lot of people feel great at the beginning of such diets, but they rarely stick to them for very long. I had the same experience. Nice improvements at the beginning, but eventually I lost all the benefits and regressed from my baseline.

Jordan Peterson and her daughter had various autoimmune diseases that they felt cured from with this diet, but it's very unclear to me if they are still cured. Most people are not that committed, they try new diets for a couple of weeks or months, but eventually go back, so long-term data is lacking.

I would probably just stick to the standard ketogenic diet as it seems safer long-term than eating just meat.

 

[wabi-sabi]

I seriously doubt it and I'd sure like to see some data.

You know a trial where one arm takes their normal meds and whatever they normally eat, one arm does meds and anti-inflammatory diet, one arm gets meds and a placebo diet and then we compare titers and disease progression at the end. If we want to be mean, one arm gets anti-inflammatory diet and no meds.

 

[Nuno]

Im also interested in this aswell. I tried 8 days strict carnivore (just meat and fish) and I was feeling really weird.

My digestion and POTS was getting much better tho, but weirdly enough I was feeling random vertigos and depressed (?). I wonder if it was Herx, and I also wonder what would happen if I continued on it..

I wish there was more studies on a stict Carnivore and CFS/ME, all this antinutrient stuff from plants its really interesting and something that I never before had thought of, but it makes some sense.

 

[nerd]

Very difficult to tell. Everything makes a difference, for better or worse, much or less. I have made my own keto diet experience and I wouldn't recommend it anymore in general because it can have reactivating effect on latent/abortive viral reservoirs, as I found out later.

I'm still on the keto diet and declined from the initial very positive effects, progressively declined on and on. And that despite the low dose of Valtrex I also take. As always, this can have many reasons because I have changed so much within the last months.

But I've never noticed anything bad from reducing/eliminating sugars. Sugars like table sugar and all the sweeteners. That's something I can personally recommend without hesitation. High protein I can also recommend. Amino acids can be helpful in different ways. Heathy fats like olive oil aren't bad either. The gall bladder needs some diet impulses to allow the liver to detoxify. All of this might actually help without having to go to ketosis.

Ketosis itself could be tested by supplementing BHB without any diet changes, but I wouldn't recommend it for the moment. I'm not a physician or dietitian though, don't take my words for medical advice.

 

[Learner1]

I'm still on the keto diet and declined from the initial very positive effects, progressively declined on and on.

Might you be missing folate, vitamins C and E, and/or phytonutrients, which aren't too plentiful on a keto diet and might contribute to fatigue.

 

[nerd]

Might you be missing folate, vitamins C and E, and/or phytonutrients, which aren't too plentiful on a keto diet and might contribute to fatigue.

Thanks for your input. I take these vitamins separately. But it's difficult to manage the electrolytes, especially when ME pathology also dysregulates calcium, potassium, and sodium. This on top of dysautonomia makes it a challenge, especially during the heat. Maybe it's just that. Because since the keto diet, I don't feel cold anymore. I think my body is burning more energy and creating more warmth than before, which I'm not used to during sommer. Perhaps, I need more electrolytes.

 

[Learner1]

Thanks for your input. I take these vitamins separately. But it's difficult to manage the electrolytes, especially when ME pathology also dysregulates calcium, potassium, and sodium. This on top of dysautonomia makes it a challenge, especially during the heat. Maybe it's just that. Because since the keto diet, I don't feel cold anymore. I think my body is burning more energy and creating more warmth than before, which I'm not used to during sommer. Perhaps, I need more electrolytes.

How do you take your phytonutrients separaty? How do you know your folate dose?

Electrolytes are great to replace sweat lost through exercise.

 

[nerd]

How do you take your phytonutrients separaty?

Some of my supplements contain phytonutritions, like Resveratrol. Vegetables are part of the ketogenic diet regardless. I can even eat fruits in small quantities, like berries. The only thing that is missing during the ketogenic diet are carbohydrates, a typical source of potassium. I still have products with yeast, so copper shouldn't be an issue either.

Interestingly, my intercellular selenium levels are too high. Thiamine is also too high because I intentionally overdose it. Omega-3 is too low. Vitamin E is fine. Folic acid as well. Iron is too low. I've been vegetarian for quite some time, so I don't have red meat as an iron source.

On my liposomal multi-vitamine, the folic acid content is declared, 400 mcg per dose.

 

[Viala]

Nice improvements at the beginning, but eventually I lost all the benefits and regressed from my baseline.

I had similar experience with ketogenic diet. I am now on a low fat, high carb diet and feel better than on keto. These are whole and healthy carbs, so not much flours, no sugar or bread. It took me a while to readjust to digesting carbs again, but with this diet I get less CFS symptoms than on a high fat diet. Fats are generally proinflammatory, we never ate so much fats in our history, it is similar with meat. I don't think carnivore diet can be healthy long term, especially that it is high in animal protein. It may help with some symptoms, same as ketogenic diet, but long term I doubt it supports health.

I am familiar with Peterson and his daughter going carnivore which helped them a lot, but he didn't recommend this diet and if he eats anything outside of the very short list he feels very bad, which is not a good thing. So I understand it as a coping mechanism, but without solving underlying issues. I am curious though what long term effects carnivore diet can have on the body, considering data we get from Eskimos.

 

[Henrik]

Might you be missing folate, vitamins C and E, and/or phytonutrients, which aren't too plentiful on a keto diet and might contribute to fatigue.

The Carnivore diet has been very positive for me, but I share your concerns. While supplement for some of the more obvious ones like the ones you mentioned I think supplementing is not an exact science. And I'm sure there are nutrients we don't even know about that I might be missing.

 

[Henrik]

Thanks for your input. I take these vitamins separately. But it's difficult to manage the electrolytes, especially when ME pathology also dysregulates calcium, potassium, and sodium. This on top of dysautonomia makes it a challenge, especially during the heat. Maybe it's just that. Because since the keto diet, I don't feel cold anymore. I think my body is burning more energy and creating more warmth than before, which I'm not used to during sommer. Perhaps, I need more electrolytes.

I have CFS + POTS and at least for me the electrolytes do help. I know a lot of people in the Carnivore community like to claim that all you need is meat, but a lot of people with a research background seems to think some electrolytes such as potassium are too low in the Carnivore diet.

Btw if you found anything else that helped with your POTS while on Carnivore I would love to know.