Best brands/forms of chlorella, silica and other detoxing agents

[musicchick581]

I've been researching quite a bit on detoxing agents (as my doctor wants me to do calcium chelation IV urine testing and I don't feel good about it).

I am drinking Fiji water for the silica for aluminum. I am ordering bentonite clay for detoxing other things and now I'm reading that chlorella detoxes as well.

Can someone provide me with a list of what each of these things:
1. detoxes for (ie which metals?)
2. how to best detox from metals using these forms (ie foot bath, topically on skin, bathing in or drinking)
3. which brands are best and uncontaminated? and
4. Do these products detox from bone and fat tissue where metals are mostly stored?

I used Amazon reviews and such, but I'm cross eyed from all this internet research and could use some help.
Thank you!

This is what I'm looking at on Amazon:
Source Naturals chlorella
Organic Tradition chlorella powder
Fiji water for silica
Perfect Body Harmony healing clay for face or bath

 

[Ema]

This is the brand my doctor uses. I've used a lot of the products but am by no means an expert. I don't use them anymore since I take antibiotics and antivirals.

http://www.vitalityherbsandclay.com...-1-lb.-1-month-supply/garden_flypage.tpl.html

I think chlorella needs to be broken cell wall.

 

[Violeta]

@musicchick581, did he say why he wants to chelate calcium?

 

[musicchick581]

@Violeta , he wants the edta calcium chelation test because he says that when his other treatments don't work for his patients, this one usually does. I'm not convinced though, since he doesn't seem to want to treat my CBS, COMT, or other Snps. I got him to sign for an OAT and Amino Acid urine test and I'm going to try to convince him to sign and order a comprehensive stool test, since certain foods cause bloating in me. This is one I've been looking at:
http://www.metametrix.com/test-menu/profiles/gastrointestinal-function/dna-stool-analysis-gi-effects

 

[Violeta]

Okay, that's for chelating out metals, right? Not chelating out calcium, which is what I thought at first.

Your symptoms sound a lot like people on the mastocytosis MCAS facebook page, if you want to check that out.

Link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/486532874778463/

It's a closed group, but it doesn't take long for them to respond to a request to join.

 

[Sushi]

@musicchick581

You might want to read here on Microsilica.

Sushi

 

[musicchick581]

Thank you @Violeta and @Sushi !

 

[ahmo]

@musicchick581 Mike Adams, Natural Health News, has been reviewing toxins in things like chlorella. I've been using a broken cell chlorella marketed here locally by an Australian naturopath.

Re detox, I've been on GAPS diet for 2+ years. Natasha Cambell-McBride recommends first line detox via juicing. I added footbaths w/ bicarb, clay, charcoal after about 6 months. When I got results for high aluminum I switched from plain bentonite to "magnetic clay". These clays come w/ a sachet that you mix in according to whether you order for aluminium, mercury, others. I now believe the magic, magnetic ingredient may well be fulvic and humic. These are combined in an Enzymatic Therapies product called Metal Magnet, not sold by iherb. Iherb does have other fulvic and humic products.

After about 2 years GAPS, still experiencing bloating and constipation, I decided to push things along. I began eating clay, found an ebay supplier from Calif selling calcium bentonite, which is preferable form for oral. And added diatomaceous earth, from a local Aus supplier. I'd been afraid of these in my gut, but my body has loved them.

And because of the constipation, I began coffee enemas. there's a symbiotic link between bacteria and metals, they exit together. I was unwilling to start Cutler protocol, which needs dosing thru the night, because my sleep was so fragile. Also unwilling to use cilantro, as I have remaining crowns which might have mercury underneath. All my hair tests and the one urine toxic metals test showed no hg, but I still worry about hg to the brain. I began using an oil combo to fight biofilm, initially from Klinghardt suggestions: lemongrass, clove, oregano, tea tree oil, 1 part each, w/ 3 parts eucalypt oil. Also using olive leaf, in caps and adding oliveleaf and oregano to teas added to footbaths.

And then I began coffee enema detox protocol. I had no idea at the outset how long it would take, 4 months of 4 dasy on, 2 days off to feel that I've had a major clearing. I'm happy to send you more details on how I did that. I'm linking Klinghardt vid and docs re detox protocols. What I've been doing is pretty much aligned w/ him, tho I don't use garlic, can't tolerate sulfur, except chlorella. cheers, ahmo

Klinghardt: Autism, Lyme, Pyroluria
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-z3kRDYcvhA

Short Version (36pg) Pyroluria/Lyme protocol. From Powerpoint doc used during Klinghardt presentation: Lyme Induced Autism
http://www.lymeinducedautism.com/images/1_KlinghardtKPU_09_PX.pdf

A Treatment Guide: Lyme and Other Chronic Infections (92 pgs) D. Klinghardt MD, 2009
http://www.klinghardtacademy.com/images/stories/powerpoints/treatinglyme 2010.pdf

Lyme Induced Autism 80 pg doc; comprehensive discussion, charts, thermal images
http://www.lymeinducedautism.com/images/KlinghardtLIA_II.pdf

 

[musicchick581]

@ahmo I have to look into those links. My main issue two years ago was midrange aluminum. I also am having trouble bringing sulfates down. They are consistently >800->1200. I had to stop all b12 and methylfolate except my multivitamin tablets. (400 MCG methylfolate and 50 MCG methyl and adenosylcobslmin mixed). I'm trying to diminish sulfates because of anxiety and panic issues. If I can get the darn bh4 working, hopefully things will look more calm. I really need a good doctor. Mine I like but he is pushing chelation testing EDTA calcium with urine test and supplementing me with bh4. Totally not what yasko suggests. He thinks she's a quack. Big sigh.

 

[musicchick581]

Now I read that chlorella is high thiol? If this ruins my low sulfate diet, I won't be happy. Grrr

 

[ahmo]

Yes, chlorella is high thiol. It's the only thing I consume that is, and I tolerate it really well. Re BH4: I'd thought about it a few times, but due to the cost, never ordered it. Now I don't need it. I've had terrific results w/ a variety of things for reducing ammonia/sulfur: (I hope it wasn't you to whom I just posted this a few days ago...) butyrate w/ meals + ornithine, arginine, citrullline. Also yucca, which I used as a tincture to avoid starch, but tasted yucky. So once I found ornithine, switched to that. What about histamines. ...Did we already have this conversation??? Sorry, my memory's really sieve-like.

MAO++ suggests histamines. Both ammonia and histamines can lead to the panic, anxiety. Mast cells + histamines re congestion. I also use Yasko's CBS drops. Have been able to decrease the drops over the year. And 1-2 weeks ago started Theoharides' Neuroprotek. It's been wonderful for me, calmed my brain. I was able to drop several supps, lower doses of others, just from low doses of this, even tho he suggests it will take weeks to take effect.

Not eating gluten are you? That was the beginning of calming my way out of control nervous system.

Brain Allergy’ and ASD - T. Theoharides, MD, PhD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=9QbZp3WcC1Q

Mastocytosis with Theoharis C. Theoharides, MS, PhD, MD, FAA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CplxXGpFeKQ

Neuroprotek http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=pNQsK9PQL3c

 

[musicchick581]

Can you tell me, in your opinion, why I've been low thiol for a few weeks now and my levels aren't coming down? I am eating less chicken (maybe once a day or every other day in small amounts) and cut all other thiol foods. I also stopped NAC and probiotics. No change. I'm confused.

MAO++ is histamines? I thought that was DAO ++. Hmm. I will have to look more into that. I've been doing low histamine diet for months now. My congestion cleared up but still have LPR reflux issues and digestion issues. Enzymes didn't help. I haven't eaten gluten in a long time. My diet is low thiol, low histamine, low acid and no grains or dairy. I eat chicken, flounder or whiting fish, just added bison, potatoes, sweet potatoes, carrots, celery, cucumber, coconut, olive oil, sunflower seed butter, apples, pears, zucchini mostly. That's been my diet for 3 months now. I had to cut out kale, salmon, asparagus, honey, almonds, almond butter and peas last month when I stopped thiols and sensitive foods that registered on the IGg test. I'm drinking PH water and Fiji water (for the silica to detox aluminum) and I just want to eat normally again. I'm going to try a sodium bentonite clay mask tonight to detox as well. I read the aluminum in it stays in the clay and doesn't adhere in the body.

 

[ahmo]

I don't know the exact relationship betw DAO and MAO, but MAO definitely predisposes to histamine issues. I see you have both of them. And you've already been taking care of that. The only place in your diet that I can see a histamine possibility is the fish. sorry. As I heard someone tell it, the only way to eat fish is if you're there with a hot pan when the fish comes out of the water. I don't think it needs to be that literal, but the histamines apparently increase according to how long it takes to be gutted. Sorry to be the messenger. Beef? seems to be lower sulfur for me than chicken.

You can also use the clay + charcoal in footbaths. Another source of silica is diatomaceous earth.

Otherwise, I can't see that your diet is driving the sulfur or histamines. Something else is, maybe it's the aluminum or other metals. Are you taking molybdenum? ...OK, I've just looked at my notes from Yasko re sulfate see the Yasko quote below. The second quote, seemingly from the same thread as the first, might be a clue. The commenter is referring to mastocytosis in the gut. That's a possible explanation relating both histamine and sulfate issues.

I was looking through some of Klinghardt's detox info today. These might be more to the point than the other links I posted earlier. Chlorella and garlic feature heavily. I don't use garlic, reason that oregano oil is my substitute. Also linking a different version of his lyme protocol. He closely links and treats lyme and metals. Around pg 53 of the lyme doc, 1st link, he's talking about metals. This is a good layout, easy to read and comprehend.

http://www.klinghardtacademy.com/images/stories/powerpoints/treatinglyme 2010.pdf

http://www.klinghardtacademy.com/images/stories/neurotoxin/NeurotoxinProtocol_Jan06.pdf

http://www.ch3nutrigenomics.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=26260

“1)Sulfate levels may be used as a way to assess sulfite processing. Sulfites are converted to sulfates by SUOX which uses B12 and molybdenum in the reaction. If sulfate levels are high it may indicate that sulfite levels were too high and you want to be sure that you have enough B12 and molybdenum support in place such that the levels of molybdenum and B12 are not depleted in the process of converting sulfites to sulfates. Also high sulfites (by default high sulfates) is an indication that you may have too much activity via the transulfuration pathway and so you do not yet have the methylation cycle in balance.

2)There are three enzymes in the body that need molybdenum: sulfite oxidase (SUOX), xanthine oxidase, and aldehyde oxidase. Xanthine oxidase helps to convert intermediates to uric acid. Milk that has been homogenized increases the level of xanthine oxidase in the milk. This may be a more subtle aspect of dairy free diets to limit excess xanthine oxidase in the system. Too much xanthine oxidase, like increased sulfite oxidase activity runs the risk of depleting molybdenum. Finally aldehyde oxidase is involved in addressing yeast (Candida) in the body. The net effect of homogenized milk + Candida + high levels of sulfites is to increase the activity through these three molybdenum containing enzymes and potentially deplete levels of important intermediates.

3) High levels of overall sulfur in the body can trigger the cortisol stress reaction. There are entire PPTs I have given on the topic of stress. Also high levels of sulfur groups in general can exacerbate other situations in the body with excess glutamate and throw off the epinephrine/norepineprhine ratio. As I spoke about when reviewing the methylation cycle this past Oct (see that DVD/PPT too) one way to look at the methionine portion of the methylation cycle is that it serves as a way to have sulfur and ammonia groups tied up or complexed in molecules. As you work your way through the transulfuration pathway it frees up sulfites and ammonia that the body then needs to deal with and eliminate.


To summarize, in my opinion the issue with high sulfates is three fold, one it indicates high levels of sulfites and excess transulfuration activity, two it suggests that molybdenum and B12 may be depleted from the system and three that the cortisol reaction and imbalances in norep/epi may be a factor due to high total levels of sulfur containing groups.

I think the sulfur snag for me is Mastocytosis. I have mast cell proliferation throughout my GI tract. The other night I read the article ”Methionine and Methylation: Chicken or the Egg“ by Yasko and Mullen. In short, they say:

”Immune system activation and/or bacterial infection increase the inflammatory cytokine TNF-alpha, which also increases CBS activity, as will any oxidizing condition or cause of inflammation.“

In addition to Mastocyotosis, I also have Th1 Systematic Inflammatory disease. Both involve chronic systematic inflammation for which I take a number of natural anti-inflammatories and TNF-alpha inhibitors including two herbal formulas containing tumeric and/or curcumin.

Furthermore, in those of us w/high cysteine who have sulfur problems, curcumin, a constituent of turmeric, further raises plasma cysteine or sulfur levels. ( Amalgam Illness, Diagnosis and Treatment : What You Can Do to Get Better, How Your Doctor Can Help Andrew Hall, Ph.D. Cutler, 1999.) Yikes!

I, therefore, have discontinued both formulas: Curamin and HHI’s Cox-2. In sync, my urine sulfate levels are finally starting to go down and my urine and sweat no longer have a strong that dirty kitty litter odor. 

As far as mast cell stabilization and reactivity goes, I continue avoidance and have upped my dose of Neuroprotek LP to 2 gelcaps a day from 1. So far so good.

 

[acrosstheveil]

how does microsilica compare to pascalite clay or high dose chlorella? i definitely cannot afford the microsilica product that klinghardt recommends

 

[ahmo]

I'm getting my silica from diatomaceous earth. Pretty cheap. It also helps 'scrape' parasites from gut walls. I was very about starting this, but after 1.5 years on GAPS diet, it's been fine, my body likes it. It works differently from chlorella, I can't tell you how. When I looked at another product Klinghardt uses, and which I've used, but which is expensive, Biosil, it includes silica and collagen. I had Dr's Best collagen on hand, it's relatively cheap, so added it as well during my detox intensive.

 

[musicchick581]

@ahmo Wow! I'm so glad you are finding out what is going on. It sounds like you are on the right track. I think the best thing is never give up, even though it feels like a rat race.

As for me, my sulfites are ok via urine testing. Sulfates are still 800-1200 and I eat fish probably once or twice a week some weeks and others, not at all. I didn't have SUOX tested but again, sulfites are fine.

My multivitamin has 400 mcg methylfolate, 50 mcg methyl/adenosylcobalmin mixed and 100 mcg molybdenum. It has niacin as well which eats methyl groups but my doctor said I need to stay on the multi. I don't know if 100 mcg molybdenum is enough. When I took more methylb12 in liquid form, I couldn't handle it well. I was up to 600 mcg and having more panic and anxiety than usual.

The cortisol reaction and norep/epi balance sounds more promising in my case and I am very positive my BH4 isn't working properly, hence my panic/anxiety issues. But, Yasko didn't say how to handle that in your post above. I'm questioning if Yasko even knows these things as I haven't read about many who found her protocol helpful. My doctor thinks she is a "quack." (he's a DO and treats autistic kids mostly)

How did you find out about your MAST cell issue? I read that it's not detectable through saliva so 23 and me can't detect it. I looked up rs numbers that matched and none that 23 and me tested were listed, so it looks like it's true that they didn't test for the disorder, although the snp is there under many positions.

I'm really scratching my head as to what could be keeping my sulfates so high and am unsure of the next step. I'd like to be able to tolerate more B12 and folate if necessary. I'm kind of in a hurry to get my reflux, food sensitivities and panic/anxiety healed as the research after all these months with dead ends is beginning to make me crazy. Lol. (and I love research!) Hopefully I can find a doctor to help me. I'm at a loss.

 

[ahmo]

Hi @musicchick581 I looked through the pr mast cell forum and have enough signs/symptoms to make me look further. The Canadian mast cell organization offered some help. Then I watched the first of the 2 linked vids from Dr. Theoharides. There's much in here that applies to me. He talks about a spectrum of disorders before full-on Masto, and vastly undiagnosed problem. The only definitive testing is bone marrow, so I won't be going there!

When I added supps recommended by lowhistaminechef my histamine issues calmed. I no longer have outbreaks, after more than a decade of always being on the brink, or involved in an outbreak. I added rutin and royal jelly to the quercetin recommended by Yasko. However, since discovering mangosteen, I quit the quercetin, which seems to be high thiol (haven't researched this, just my body's messages...) And since I started Dr. Theoharides' Neuroprotek a couple weeks ago, which contains rutin, I'm not taking rutin on it's own.

Re Neuroprotek: I wasn't initially going to go for this, as it's not cheap, and the postage doubles the price. But when I came to a point of doing all that could be done, and saw the extent of my mind's ongoing chatter, I decided to try it. Wow! It's had a huge benefit in just the area I wanted. And, I immediately self-tested to quit the pituitary and hypothalamus glandulars, which have been my life-support for a couple years. Also lowered carnitine, a few other things. very impressive!

After reading the piece I posted to you yesterday I decided to look again at all the masto literature. Dr. Theoharides has a mountain of papers at his site http://mastcellmaster.com/ The comment re gut has really piqued my curiosity. I'd been having real urinary urgency recently, but, truthfully to some degree all my life. And it seems to be nearly gone now. I came across a reference to masto in bladder. I feel there's a significant role that masto is playing in my life. The pr mast cell forum was initiated by a post asking, Could CFS/ME be a mast cell disorder? It seems to be part of a complex that underlies my health issues. I'll be spending today looking further. Good thing you like to research!

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?forums/mast-cell-disorders-mastocytosis.126/

Mastocytosis with Theoharis C. Theoharides, MS, PhD, MD, FAA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CplxXGpFeKQ

‘Brain Allergy’ and ASD - T. Theoharides, MD, PhD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=9QbZp3WcC1Q

Neuroprotek http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=pNQsK9PQL3c

Dr Janice Joneja Histamine Intolerance Interview Transcript http://lowhistaminechef.com/
"Could you please give us an idea of how histamine intolerance, mast cell activation and mastocytosis are different; if in fact they are?"....

http://www.mastocytosis.ca/signs.htm

http://www.histamine-intolerance.info/

Mast cells/histamines diagram
http://www.histamine-intolerance.in...-Mast-Cell-Activation-cascade-of-symptoms.pdf

 

[SickOfSickness]

If anyone with amalgam fillings is considering detox, be sure to research. They say do not use chlorella and some others if you have amalgams.

 

[ahmo]

@SickOfSickness My understanding is that it's not chlorella that's a problem, but cilantro. No?

 

[SickOfSickness]

@SickOfSickness My understanding is that it's not chlorella that's a problem, but cilantro. No?

Both of them are, from what I read.