I’m sure if I read long enough this has been addressed somewhere on the forum. I would love some feedback from anyone who is in the middle of or completed this program. I know for a fact my issues are with my CNS. I feel like a car driving with he oil light on all the time(running hot). While the concept of this rewriting makes sense I always proceed cautiously when it cost money. Thanks in advance.
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ANS rewiring
- Thread starter Jpac
- Start date
I haven’t done the program, but I have read Dan Neuffer’s book, and it seems he pulled himself out of ME focusing on fixing an ANS stuck in allostatic load. He thinks a few very stessful experiences rewired his neurology in the core brain related to the stress response (fight & flight).
I also think a big part of my ME is related to autonomic dysregulation (dysautonimia), things that my ANS usually took care of without me even thinking about it
- like body temp regulation (raynauds), blood pressure (OI, POTS), heart, digestion, immune function, sweating, HPA-axis (energy, metabolism, stress response, blood sugar... the whole endocrine hormonal system out of whack basically), thyroid regulation, heat tolerance aso.
Other related approaches; DNRS, Gupta Amygdala retraining.
Keep us posted if you decide to try Neuffer’s course. I am also considering it, but in the mean time looking into reducing and avoiding stress as much as possible. Trying out yoga, tapping, mindfullness, possibly QiGong later in the spring, also HRV to monitor stress response during the day.
I also think a big part of my ME is related to autonomic dysregulation (dysautonimia), things that my ANS usually took care of without me even thinking about it
- like body temp regulation (raynauds), blood pressure (OI, POTS), heart, digestion, immune function, sweating, HPA-axis (energy, metabolism, stress response, blood sugar... the whole endocrine hormonal system out of whack basically), thyroid regulation, heat tolerance aso.Other related approaches; DNRS, Gupta Amygdala retraining.
Keep us posted if you decide to try Neuffer’s course. I am also considering it, but in the mean time looking into reducing and avoiding stress as much as possible. Trying out yoga, tapping, mindfullness, possibly QiGong later in the spring, also HRV to monitor stress response during the day.
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I am currently in the middle of the program. I really didn't think I would ever turn to a program like this one but after having a couple of bouts of Afib with rvr with a heart rate of 180 and having to go to the emergency room to get IV Cardzem to bring my heart rate down and get my heart back in sinus rhythm I started to rethink things. I knew I had to do something to get my stress levels down. I've been living with ME/CFS for 30 years now and as you know it's a very stressful illness to live with.
I did some research on 3 different programs, the Gupta one, the DNRS one and the ANS Rewire one. After reading about each one and watching some videos, I decided to give the ANS Rewire one a chance. I had already read his book, CFS Unravelled and his story had resonated with me. I figured at this point what have I got to lose. I didn't think it could make me any worse and maybe it would make me better. I am a little over half way through the course now and I'm feeling cautiously optimistic. I'm very happy with the course so far. He attacks things from many different angles and goes into the science behind why he is asking you to do the things he asks you to do. I'm really impressed with what he has done. He comes across as very genuine and I deeply believe that he really wants to help people heal from this illness. I'm very happy with my decision to give this course a chance.
I did some research on 3 different programs, the Gupta one, the DNRS one and the ANS Rewire one. After reading about each one and watching some videos, I decided to give the ANS Rewire one a chance. I had already read his book, CFS Unravelled and his story had resonated with me. I figured at this point what have I got to lose. I didn't think it could make me any worse and maybe it would make me better. I am a little over half way through the course now and I'm feeling cautiously optimistic. I'm very happy with the course so far. He attacks things from many different angles and goes into the science behind why he is asking you to do the things he asks you to do. I'm really impressed with what he has done. He comes across as very genuine and I deeply believe that he really wants to help people heal from this illness. I'm very happy with my decision to give this course a chance.
Hopeful1976
Senior Member
- Messages
- 345
Hey @hopeful2
I'm also considering the ans rewire course. How's it going? I'd appreciate any feedback. Thanks.
I'm also considering the ans rewire course. How's it going? I'd appreciate any feedback. Thanks.
Hi Vicki Cole,
I just finished the last lesson yesterday and I highly recommend the program. You have to keep in mind that it is not a magic bullet fix. You have to really work at it. Some of the things he asks you to do take time to fully implement and other things can be implemented right away. It's a journey. You really have to dedicate yourself to it for at least 6 - 12 months. Just watching the videos every day is not going to heal you. You have to use the tools he gives you and practice them daily. He himself had ME/CFS and was bedbound and barely able to speak at one time so he knows what it's like and he really understands and "gets it". I've read a few other credible stories of recovery over the years and it seems like they followed a path similar to the one Dan followed. I can see a lot of overlap in what people did to recover.
The first day of the program he gives you 4 videos to watch but the first 3 are actually the 3 videos you can watch for free by signing up on his website. After that he gives you one video a day for the next 5 weeks. At first it seems to be moving slowly as he explains the science behind it and lays a foundation for what's coming but then it starts to move faster and becomes a little harder to implement everything all at once. So, after 5-1/2 weeks, I'm starting to see small improvements that are giving me hope to keep on going and fully implement everything to the best of my ability. I'm in it for the long haul. I intend to give it all I've got. I see it as my best chance for recovery. I'm not walking away until I recover or I feel as if I've given it my best shot. I got my husband to start watching the videos a few weeks ago and he is about half way through them now. It's nice to have someone close to you watch the videos so they know what you are trying to do and can support you in your efforts. I hope you have someone like that in your life but if you don't, you can still do this.
Please let me know if you decide to give it a go.
I just finished the last lesson yesterday and I highly recommend the program. You have to keep in mind that it is not a magic bullet fix. You have to really work at it. Some of the things he asks you to do take time to fully implement and other things can be implemented right away. It's a journey. You really have to dedicate yourself to it for at least 6 - 12 months. Just watching the videos every day is not going to heal you. You have to use the tools he gives you and practice them daily. He himself had ME/CFS and was bedbound and barely able to speak at one time so he knows what it's like and he really understands and "gets it". I've read a few other credible stories of recovery over the years and it seems like they followed a path similar to the one Dan followed. I can see a lot of overlap in what people did to recover.
The first day of the program he gives you 4 videos to watch but the first 3 are actually the 3 videos you can watch for free by signing up on his website. After that he gives you one video a day for the next 5 weeks. At first it seems to be moving slowly as he explains the science behind it and lays a foundation for what's coming but then it starts to move faster and becomes a little harder to implement everything all at once. So, after 5-1/2 weeks, I'm starting to see small improvements that are giving me hope to keep on going and fully implement everything to the best of my ability. I'm in it for the long haul. I intend to give it all I've got. I see it as my best chance for recovery. I'm not walking away until I recover or I feel as if I've given it my best shot. I got my husband to start watching the videos a few weeks ago and he is about half way through them now. It's nice to have someone close to you watch the videos so they know what you are trying to do and can support you in your efforts. I hope you have someone like that in your life but if you don't, you can still do this.
Please let me know if you decide to give it a go.
Hopeful1976
Senior Member
- Messages
- 345
Hi @hopeful2
Thank you so much for your reply! What Dan says very much makes sense and is in line with Cortene's recent hypothesis...
I know, even before I start, how meditation positively impacts my symptoms - this is evidence, to me, of a hyper aroused state...
My concerns are only that he recommends Lots of magnesium in his book, which I cannot take (messes up my electrolyte levels)and i am fearful it contains the 'stop' technique (like gupta and lp) which I think are rubbish (what you resist persists!). I haven't been able to discover if it does or not.
Other than these worries I am excited start learning. I'm going to spend today going over a few videos and then I'm hoping to start the program by the end of the week
Thank you so much for your reply! What Dan says very much makes sense and is in line with Cortene's recent hypothesis...
I know, even before I start, how meditation positively impacts my symptoms - this is evidence, to me, of a hyper aroused state...
My concerns are only that he recommends Lots of magnesium in his book, which I cannot take (messes up my electrolyte levels)and i am fearful it contains the 'stop' technique (like gupta and lp) which I think are rubbish (what you resist persists!). I haven't been able to discover if it does or not.
Other than these worries I am excited start learning. I'm going to spend today going over a few videos and then I'm hoping to start the program by the end of the week
Pink
Senior Member
- Messages
- 574
- Location
- Tri state area
I looked at his website and watched some of his intro videos, but ultimately decided it was not for me.
I do think dysautonomia is the main driving factor behind my cfs, but I couldn't accept some of his main beliefs.
I am keeping an open mind though, bec I am pretty desperate, so I would like to hear more stories of ppl who went thru his program.
Also, like @Vicki Cole , I'm wondering about the "stop" method, if he uses it.
I do think dysautonomia is the main driving factor behind my cfs, but I couldn't accept some of his main beliefs.
I am keeping an open mind though, bec I am pretty desperate, so I would like to hear more stories of ppl who went thru his program.
Also, like @Vicki Cole , I'm wondering about the "stop" method, if he uses it.
I did Gupta program. It did nothing for me. I even bought extra recordings with guided meditations. When I did it I was in much better shape. Right now I'm 90% bedbound. If I knew what I know now I would just do pacing with a heart rate monitor, deep belly breathing and LDN. After 6 months doing this program I still wasn't able to relax or sleep and was all the time in the wired mode. LDN helped with it.
I should add that I have autonomic dysfunction (POTS, lack of gag reflex, autonomic GI problems and other symptoms).
I should add that I have autonomic dysfunction (POTS, lack of gag reflex, autonomic GI problems and other symptoms).
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Hi @Vicki Cole & @Pink,
I guess I would have to ask you what you know about the stop technique and what exactly your objection is to it. I have not done the Gupta or LP programs so I don't know what their stop technique entails or how big a part of their program it is. All of these programs have some kind of rewiring of your brain/nervous system as a central core technique in their program. Like I said, I haven't done either of the other programs or the DNRS program either so I don't know how they are structured or what the differences in the programs are. I went into the ANS Rewire program with a completely open mind and was open to trying any and all techniques offered. I've been living with this illness for 30 years now and some of those years were spent bedridden and I'm now pretty much "couch ridden" and rarely leave the house. I am willing to try anything at this point. I look at it this way, nothing he is asking me to do is going to hurt me and it may actually help me. What do I have to lose?
I wouldn't let your inability to take magnesium stop you from doing the program. Dan always says that you should consult with your doctor and follow your doctors advice. He offers a lot of techniques and offers many suggestions for things to do but it is a journey and if you know you can't take something like magnesium then you just don't take it.
I'm still early on in the process but I'm starting to see small improvements already. I don't know if I will be one of the lucky ones who will recover from using this program or not but I'm hanging on to the hope that I will. I've been waiting for a cure for 30 years now and I'm not willing to wait any longer. The fact is that some people have managed to recover using his techniques including himself. Whose to say that I can't be one of those lucky ones too. I'm very happy with my decision to do this program. My husband has been watching the videos every night now too and he is very impressed with the program and says he is looking for ways to incorporate the suggestions in his own life even though he is not ill. He actually has hope that following this program could actually cure me which is something he's never said about anything else I've tried before.
I guess I would have to ask you what you know about the stop technique and what exactly your objection is to it. I have not done the Gupta or LP programs so I don't know what their stop technique entails or how big a part of their program it is. All of these programs have some kind of rewiring of your brain/nervous system as a central core technique in their program. Like I said, I haven't done either of the other programs or the DNRS program either so I don't know how they are structured or what the differences in the programs are. I went into the ANS Rewire program with a completely open mind and was open to trying any and all techniques offered. I've been living with this illness for 30 years now and some of those years were spent bedridden and I'm now pretty much "couch ridden" and rarely leave the house. I am willing to try anything at this point. I look at it this way, nothing he is asking me to do is going to hurt me and it may actually help me. What do I have to lose?
I wouldn't let your inability to take magnesium stop you from doing the program. Dan always says that you should consult with your doctor and follow your doctors advice. He offers a lot of techniques and offers many suggestions for things to do but it is a journey and if you know you can't take something like magnesium then you just don't take it.
I'm still early on in the process but I'm starting to see small improvements already. I don't know if I will be one of the lucky ones who will recover from using this program or not but I'm hanging on to the hope that I will. I've been waiting for a cure for 30 years now and I'm not willing to wait any longer. The fact is that some people have managed to recover using his techniques including himself. Whose to say that I can't be one of those lucky ones too. I'm very happy with my decision to do this program. My husband has been watching the videos every night now too and he is very impressed with the program and says he is looking for ways to incorporate the suggestions in his own life even though he is not ill. He actually has hope that following this program could actually cure me which is something he's never said about anything else I've tried before.
Pink
Senior Member
- Messages
- 574
- Location
- Tri state area
Too sick for lengthy reply; I haven't done these programs but I have serious concerns about the ability of this to actually work. I discussed it with my physician and she agrees with me.
I also have physical issues that prevent me from watching the actual videos, so that's a problem too.
I also have physical issues that prevent me from watching the actual videos, so that's a problem too.
Hopeful1976
Senior Member
- Messages
- 345
Hi @hopeful2
To say 'stop' to thoughts ect is hard to do. 'What we resist persists'. I have experienced this as both lp and gupta expect you to say stop and expect them to stop. It's like saying don't think about the white elephant. ... stop! Stop thinking about the white elephant! What happens? You think about the white elephant!
It's a tricky one. Like you, I'm desperate to try anything (as I lay here at 4am after waking 4 times already)
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Pink
Senior Member
- Messages
- 574
- Location
- Tri state area
Sounds like trying to fight an ocd or anxiety based thought which won't work well.
Aside from which, do you think it's truly possible to rewire our brains to control various hormones (like will meditation influence thyroid output?)
Aside from which, do you think it's truly possible to rewire our brains to control various hormones (like will meditation influence thyroid output?)
Hopeful1976
Senior Member
- Messages
- 345
It''s anxiety type thoughts which gupta and lp argue initiate the stress response and thus m.e symptoms.... even my gp said that he could think of nothing worse (doing the 'stop' to stop thoughts!)
iwillwin1day
Senior Member
- Messages
- 191
This program main goal is to stop all stress from your life and used what little energy you have in work etc. Because mind consume a huge amount of energy by saving energy from reducing stress is what they do I think. This is not real cure and recovery. But will help to manage your cfs life.
Thanks.
Thanks.
- Messages
- 3
Hi @hopeful2 and Oak. I''m thinking of trying this program too. I do have a few reservations, and would like to hear from someone with experience of using it. Financially, I might afford it next month. I guess I can't be completely sure until I try it myself, but it would be really helpful to get an opinion from someone who has tried it. Perhaps it's easy to get stuck, and lose the motivation to continue? I know I do feel better anyway if I am doing something to help myself. I have been ill with M.E. and Fybro for more than 30 years, and getting worse. So at the moment I am motivated to try it Almost
Hi hope I saw you said you were in the middle of the program in april. Would you still recommend it? What is it like?
- Messages
- 13
Hello @hopeful2 @echobravo and everyone else who knows a little about this program, interested if you have used Neuffer's ideas any further i your lives and how they have impacted your health?
I'm also interested in how this in any way is able to differentiate itself from GET and CBT - I was originally treated by doctors contributing data to the PACE trial and know how junky this science is.
My current working theory of my own illness, is that I was gradually get sicking and consistently exceeding my body's capability. However, I didn't have a 'crash' until I had an emotional shock*. The next day I was sick in a way I had never been. The crash is when the dysautonomia symptoms began. They are by far the hardest to deal with and I'm willing to engage with the idea that rewiring could help since an emotional trigger introduced many of them.
I'm assuming my body had been dealing with a virus or metabolic or some other issue before that was slowing itself down.
*My second major relapse in life was gradual and happened from exceeding my body's ability for months on end while working full time. I assume that this would have happened eventually in the first case if it had not been hurried along by an emotional stress trigger.
I'm also interested in how this in any way is able to differentiate itself from GET and CBT - I was originally treated by doctors contributing data to the PACE trial and know how junky this science is.
My current working theory of my own illness, is that I was gradually get sicking and consistently exceeding my body's capability. However, I didn't have a 'crash' until I had an emotional shock*. The next day I was sick in a way I had never been. The crash is when the dysautonomia symptoms began. They are by far the hardest to deal with and I'm willing to engage with the idea that rewiring could help since an emotional trigger introduced many of them.
I'm assuming my body had been dealing with a virus or metabolic or some other issue before that was slowing itself down.
*My second major relapse in life was gradual and happened from exceeding my body's ability for months on end while working full time. I assume that this would have happened eventually in the first case if it had not been hurried along by an emotional stress trigger.
gbells
Improved ME from 2 to 6
- Messages
- 1,494
- Location
- Alexandria, VA USA
I haven’t done the program, but I have read Dan Neuffer’s book, and it seems he pulled himself out of ME focusing on fixing an ANS stuck in allostatic load. He thinks a few very stessful experiences rewired his neurology in the core brain related to the stress response (fight & flight).
I also think a big part of my ME is related to autonomic dysregulation (dysautonimia), things that my ANS usually took care of without me even thinking about it
Other related approaches; DNRS, Gupta Amygdala retraining.
Keep us posted if you decide to try Neuffer’s course. I am also considering it, but in the mean time looking into reducing and avoiding stress as much as possible. Trying out yoga, tapping, mindfullness, possibly QiGong later in the spring, also HRV to monitor stress response during the day.
I visited a psychologist in 2019 who had me work on stress reduction using meditation (Headspace APP) and reading the book "Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers". It was very effective for lowering pain and reduced my pain by half. However the ME remained. I am skeptical that this is a cause or will cure ME. It probably is an ancillary treatment and patients will have a recurrence in the future as the viral infections spread.
I'd love to hear more about this from anyone using it. I am interested, but also cautious ... looking at the web site for the program, I checked out the page saying it was based on science. The science wasn't stated very convincingly. And at the bottom of the page, only a small handful of studies was cited, and they were really old ones! I wonder why more studies, and more recent studies, would not have been cited to "prove" the "science' reasons for the approaches taken in the course material. I also noted that one person posted a comment asking Dan if his course was evidence-based and, if so, he'd published papers on it, but he said no. So is the whole thing a glorified form of CBT? I'd love to know more from anyone who has taken or is taking the course.