An Open-Label, Pilot Trial of HRG80™ Red Ginseng in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Fibromyalgia, and Post-Viral Fatigue (Teitelbaum et al, 2021)

[godlovesatrier]

I forgot to mention the side effect actually.

Worth trying by the way.

But most people report bad anxiety, difficulty sleepy and difficulty relaxing. Potentially making the ME worse not better.

Saying that worth a try. I used to take Siberian ginseng. But I did read that Siberian is more immune stimulating than red ginseng. So if that's true then depending on how your ME is. One or the other might be better.

Ginsengs effects are cumulative. Hence the 5 week cycling. However if you get used to the energising effects you could do too much and this is why I don't take it anymore. My ebv reactivates now under very little stress. Ginseng sort of hypes the body up so it can do more, but ebv seems to love this. Mind you if it's actisting my immune system ebv would wake up anyway. Which isn't a bad thing if you can kill it in the process. That's what Joshua's protocol is supposed to do and I swear it has worked well for me.

But yes even so just be careful with ginseng. Adaptogens are very strong herbs. They could make some dormant viral or bacterial infections worse and others better. That's really the bottom line I guess.

 

[seamyb]

I tried (red Korean) Ginseng and felt better - I was actually hoping this is because of other stuff I started taking.

I had to stop the ginseng because of terrible heart palpitations. I'm no stranger to a palpitation, but these were the most brutal I've ever had.

I was on it maybe a week. Started low and because I didn't notice any negative effects moved quickly up to 400mg extract (equivalent to 8,000 mg ginseng).

Edited to add: palpitations were definitely a result of the ginseng and this is a common side effect. It has been shown to both raise and lower blood pressure as well as other cardiac side effects.

 

[Rebecca under the papyrus]

I am taking White Korean Ginseng for nearly six months now, in combination with other herbs. Formula by my TCM practitioner.

The ginseng + astragalus combination leads to more days on the upper end of my energy spectrum.
Sleep is no problem if I stay under 3grams per day (otherwise extremely vivid dreaming), and don't take it later than 4pm (otherwise wide awake till 2am).
Stimulation is no problem either (Sympathetic activation, anxiety and so on. No ecstasy effect ). But I had to stop caffeine.

The different ginsengs have quite different properties. E.g. as godlovesatrier said, Siberian (Eleuthero) is an immune tonic, whereas Panax ginseng (Korean/Asian) and American are more immune amphoteric. Asian (especially Red) is more stimulating than Siberian and American.... And other things...

 

[Violeta]

And interesting thing about panax ginseng is that it is a CRFR1 antagonist. Ginkgo biloba helps, too.

From Suzanne Vernon's article about ME/CFS:

Acute Corticotropin-Releasing Factor Receptor Type 2 Agonism Results in Sustained Symptom Improvement in Myalgic Encephalomyelitis/Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnsys.2021.698240/full

Interesting that both CRFR2 agonists AND CRFR1 antagonists seem to relieve symptoms.

However, it is recommended to not take panax ginseng, ginkgo biloba, and several other herbal remedies while taking psychotropic drugs.

 

[Oliver3]

I can't believe this is as far as some researchers have got. I mean I appreciate the effort but surely we should be further advanced than this. As any m.e. sufferer can tell you, they help a bit

 

[BrightCandle]

I can't believe this is as far as some researchers have got. I mean I appreciate the effort but surely we should be further advanced than this. As any m.e. sufferer can tell you, they help a bit

There is just no funding to do better. Its really not helped by the fact that in Europe 99% of all the funding is still going into exercise, CBT and lightning process "research". There is just so little money to do real biological research and trials that progress is ridiculously slow. Patients are poor and struggle to even fund the OMF as much as it needs let alone many such organisations to speed up research. Until governments start funding biological research into ME/CFS the situation will remain the same.

 

[Oliver3]

There is just no funding to do better. Its really not helped by the fact that in Europe 99% of all the funding is still going into exercise, CBT and lightning process "research". There is just so little money to do real biological research and trials that progress is ridiculously slow. Patients are poor and struggle to even fund the OMF as much as it needs let alone many such organisations to speed up research. Until governments start funding biological research into ME/CFS the situation will remain the same.

Sure, I hear ya. It's still disappointing tho isn't
I just posted smthg about thiamine deficiency as a root cause of cfs.plus the b complex and all it's co factors. The guy I linked says CFS is a sub clinical form of berri berri

 

[Oliver3]

There is just no funding to do better. Its really not helped by the fact that in Europe 99% of all the funding is still going into exercise, CBT and lightning process "research". There is just so little money to do real biological research and trials that progress is ridiculously slow. Patients are poor and struggle to even fund the OMF as much as it needs let alone many such organisations to speed up research. Until governments start funding biological research into ME/CFS the situation will remain the same.

I also heard 1.2 billion got out into long covid. It's obviously a sister, if not identical disease. Surely we will start reaping rewards there.
I hope the omf take up the gauntlet of drawing money in from there somehow

 

[Faith2007]

Thanks so much for this thread. This is another study on Korean Red Ginseng and deficiency syndrome, which I can only conclude means immune deficiency syndrome based on the first sentence. But please correct me if you know otherwise. Unfortunately it also is only a month long study, and I was looking for something longer term. But it shows the results on 3 test groups of placebo, 1.8 g KRG, and 3.6 g KRG, showing reduction in fatigue of the 3.6 g group as twice that of the placebo group.

I have immune deficiency as part of my CFIDS and have decided to discuss this treatment with my holistic doctor that has an MD educational background. I am determined to try it under her care, though I will be adding a protective liver supplement in addition since I have an elevated liver enzyme, and there are risks with ginseng.