Acupuncture

[bertiedog]

I regularly have acupuncture and a pretty strong massage on my head, neck, shoulders and back from a Chinese doctor, it has never failed me to feel better especially if I have a run of severe migraines that don't respond to medication. I don't always feel better straight away it can take a couple of days when I realise I am feeling a lot better and have better energy, plus of course the migraines will disappear. However the benefits never seem to last longer than a few weeks if that and I wonder how typical this is with other sufferers of this illness.

It would be good to hear from others who benefit from Acupuncture plus massage and how often then need a "top-up". BTW If I have just a massage or just Acupuncture I don't get anything like the benefits I get when they are combined.

Pam

 

[PoetInSF]

Acupuncture/CFS study:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17997936

I wouldn't trust the conclusion unless it's validated. There was also a general acupuncture study with sham needles on controls and they found sham needles were equally effective.

 

[Dreambirdie]

I've used acupuncture a lot over the past 20 years or more, and consulted with about 10 different practitioners for it. Their styles can differ A LOT. It takes someone who is both smart and intuitive (tuned in to my body) to give me a good treatment.

Acupuncture has worked well for certain things--like toxic (MCS) reactions to foods and chemicals, headaches, hormonal imbalances, back pain, and has been moderately helpful for my recent bout of (doctor induced and iodine caused) cardiac arrhythmia. It's great for cooling my nervous system down and helping me sleep. On the other hand, it hasn't worked very well for active infections of any kind, though the relaxing effects of it seem to help give my immune system a bit of a boost. And it can be very expensive if you get a treatment regularly, which I need to do for it to really work, as in my case the effects usually don't last more than a couple days.

When I'm in a crisis I always turn to acupuncture, because it offers me AT LEAST SOME RELIEF, even it's only temporary... and it has NEVER MADE ME WORSE.... in 20 years ever. That is significantly different from the doctors I've seen, who have been quite adept at making a lot worse.

 

[creekfeet]

I've used acupuncture a lot over the past 20 years or more, and consulted with about 10 different practitioners for it. Their styles can differ A LOT. It takes someone who is both smart and intuitive (tuned in to my body) to give me a good treatment.

I've only been to two acupuncturists but they bore out what Dreambirdie says: They differed completely. The first one had me feeling so much better I thought I was well and went to work nearly full-time... in the hot July sun... standing most of the day... and yes, I crashed. Alas, by then I was unable to return to the acupuncturist who had helped me so much.

I was able to arrange for some more acupuncture about a year later, but experienced no improvement and the treatments felt different, too. None of the amazing deep calm and rest I got during treatments with the first practitioner.

I don't know if I'll be able to find acupuncture I can afford again, but for those who like me have a hard time paying for it, check the Community Acupuncture Network and see if there's a participating practitioner near you. My wonderful first acupuncturist belonged to this network; they charge on a sliding scale. http://www.communityacupuncturenetwork.org/

 

[bertiedog]

Yes the cost can be a problem but I am lucky that here in the UK my practioner only charges 25 for an hour's treatment.

I also agree that it is definitely down to the skill of the individual practioner, I have also been to many different ones and the results can vary hugely. I am just so relieved that I have somebody who can help me and who is only about 10 minutes away from where I live.

Dreambirdie is right when she says how it benefits the nervous system it calms it down and helps to stop all the overreactions I can get but I have also found that it has benefited my energy levels as long as I am sensible when I am feeling better and don't start doing too much.

In some physiotherapy departments of the NHS they have Acupuncturists so it is always worth asking. I believe there are many studies that have proved it is great for helping with pain, hence the NHS using it now. Although I don't have Fibromyalgia I run a support group and many of the members get a series of acupuncture treatments from the Chronic Pain Team run by the PCT department of the NHS so I don't think there is any question that it is an effective treatment for pain relief. With some of the horrendous migraines I get that go on for days I am not sure how I would have coped without it.

Pam

 

[Jenny]

I went into an 8 year remission after treatment over a couple of years with acupuncture and Chinese herbs. I can't say definitely that it caused this remission, as I was getting slightly better when I started, but I was extremely impressed by how the acupuncturist could identify my ever-changing symptoms without my telling him how I was feeling, just on the basis of feeling my pulses and looking at my tongue.

Sadly, this practitioner moved to California (I'm in the UK), so I can't see him now. I've been to three others in London, but not got much benefit.

If anyone has the chance to see Giovanni Maciocia, in Santa Barbara, I strongly recommend him.

Jenny

 

[dannybex]

I agree. I was going to a local non-profit acupuncture clinic for years, but haven't been able to get in very much recently, and have definitely gone downhill. It never seemed to last more than a day, but the difference going in, compared to after I left each appt, was amazing. Felt almost 'normal'.

Finally got an appt for Tues. Can't wait. Definitely helps unstick the blocked 'energy', which helps pain, muscle spasms, weakness, mood...etc.

But Rony is right...there are good practitioners and bad ones...just as in any profession.

 

[Michael Dessin]

Good luck DB

Yea, Ive found the level of success really depends on the practitioner.

Acupuncture has worked wonders for me!

 

[serenity]

i'm about to try my 2nd. first one did no good at all, but you all say a good one can make a difference & my friend swears to me she has a good one. she has INS & IC & he seems to be helping her.

 

[DavidJ.]

i'm about to try my 2nd. first one did no good at all, but you all say a good one can make a difference & my friend swears to me she has a good one. she has INS & IC & he seems to be helping her.

can you go to the practitioner of your friend's?

 

[serenity]

yes, i am going to. but - no one is the same. the Gaba he gave her did wonders for her & she has bad anxiety, & i tried it today & it did nothing for me. so while i am willing to try, i dont' frankly really expect it to work.

 

[aquariusgirl]

I just stumbled on this post by accident...but I wanted to tell you taht I read on Dr amy yasko's forum that not all forms of gaba are created equal.
She recommends Douglas brand.
I have found gaba and sam-e v. helpful for sleep. the trick is getting the quantity of gaba right I think.
Of course, I am also doing methylation type supplements and that helps with sleep.. the gaba and sam-e is the cherry on the cake.
Sorry if i got off topic.

 

[serenity]

no not off topic, i appreciate it. but herbals have never worked for me, they work for some - but i have had no success.
i admit i am extremely skeptical, but i hear you don't have to believe in acupuncture for it to work so i am willing to try - again.

 

[aquariusgirl]

I agree acupuncture can be really helpful as an adjunctive therapy.
I think your doc is on to something there Mike & when I started seeing benefits I thought of you and your doc's protocol and how he was putting the pieces together, & using acupuncture to build patients up.
Wish my acupuncture guy could talk to your acupuncture guy, but...in any event thanks for sharing.
Your knowledge and experiences are the gift that keeps giving! .

 

[bertiedog]

I thought I would post again to say that I am still responding very well to having a treatment every other week. It stops the horrible migraines I can get but I also notice the increased energy and sense of well-being.

However the day after the last one I had a severe throat infection which needed antibiotics so it doesn't seem to be very effective regarding my weak immune system. I had had a sore throat for a few days before the treatment and had taken some herbs for this but obviously not sufficient.

I find that I look forward to the sessions now because I am very confident in how they help me. I still notice the very strong massage my Chinese doctor does on my head, neck and shoulders is essential for the beneficial effect. He says that it all helps to unblock the stagnation that seems to happen to my circulation and it does feel like this to me.

I also agree success is dependent on the practitioner.

Pam

 

[DavidJ.]

do gaba and sam-e work together?
cause i am always afraid of the serotine syndrome. i had several ones because my st.johns wort is a serotonin inhibitor and whenever i tried supplements that stimulate serotonin i would get this syndrome.

but i guess its all good as long as you do not combine them with an antidepressant right?

 

[aquariusgirl]

My understanding is that gaba promotes slow wave sleep & sam-e is a methyl donor that helps with the conversion of serotonin to melatonin. I'm sure you could find more info by googling.
However, I do wonder whether if either of these things would work if the underlying methylation cycle is shot, as I believe it is in most of us.
I owe my understanding of this to amy yasko and Rich van konynenburg, but I have personally tried the sam-e/gaba sleep cocktail and if I get the amount right it really helps. Of course, I am also doing the rest of the methylation protocol . ..or bits of it at least.
Sorry, can't help u with serotonin syndrome. Don't know much about that.

 

[Victoria]

but i guess its all good as long as you do not combine them with an antidepressant right?

Definitely don't combine St Johns Wort with any anti-depressant......

It may also cause photosensitivity (which results in a general weakness & skin eruptions on exposure to sunlight). So don't spend lots of time in the sun when using St John's Wort.

It should be avoided in cases of liver damage & depressive conditions.

 

[Sunday]

I agree with aquariusgirl that it may be crucial to have at least some methylation going for effects. I've been on the methylation protocol (Freddd's) for 6 months, and while my improvements have been less that I have wanted (I wanted 95%, but I have gone from about 10-20% to 40-50%), I do feel there are basic things being addressed by it that no other treatment has addressed. I also haven't played with all possible elements, so it may be that another supplement would radically improve the situation. Or not. Everyone's different on this of course but I have tried supplements before doing methylation protocol and they affected me differently and I think less.

I would not judge any supplement on the basis of one day's trail - except of course if it made me really sick, then I would stop it. But even the "making sick" thing is not always a guideline. The B12 protocol exacerbated all my symptoms for about 2 months, and this often happens. I did come out the other side with at least some improvements worth having.

Even for folks healthier than we are, the effects of supplements or herbs take place over time - unlike the massive effects of most pharm drugs. For us, I think it's even more important to be patient and see what effects are over time.

 

[Misfit Toy]

I love acupuncture while I am having it and even later in the day, but I feel like there is too much going on with me that it only works or helps temporarily. It's interesting because the acupuncturist I am going to believes that there are reasons for that. For example, heavy metal issues or gut issues or bigger issues. He is a Chinese Acupuncturist and I like that he sees that it isn't a cure all and doesn't help long term unless the illness isn't as severe.