7 Day NAD+ Infusions (Severe ME/CFS Recovery, Neurological / Mitochondrial / Genetic Repair) + POLL

[Hopeful2021]

There are two compounding pharmacies- but almost any can make for you.
I get the liquid vials of NAD for the IV from
ones in Colorado and in Louisiana. A doctor can only order them but with a prescription you can get the nasal spray. It's two sprays per nostril so I like getting her strongest dose the pharmacy allows (each one is different).
a doctor can order a dry mix vial of NAD and this is substantial lower in price.
The nasal spray can get me out of crisis but it doesn't help me go long haul like the IV does.

 

[Hopeful2021]

I believe the dose is 200 mg but I wonder if even that would be too much given my situation. However I’m also wondering if the risks of crashing are a little overhyped, I only heard one horror story about it.
I have a hard time keeping on top of all of this stuff and there’s no Way I’d get it iv, yet I do try and stay on top of it at least a littl, especially riboflavin as Chris masterjohn says methylation issues often caused by low riboflavin
I have intranasal glutathione, which is kind of expensive and I’m not sure it helps much or is bioavailable. I wonder if hydroxyb12 injections could serve a similar purpose of free radical scavenging. But it seems like lots of detox strategies for mold/mycotoxins don’t work well until one is out of the bad environment. SOme of the shoemaker protocol shows promise, but none of it seems worth doing without addressing the environment first, and I am now working w a biotoxin doctor about that. My concern is more that revving up the engine without even having been out of mold much would be a problem, but maybe I’m overthinking it as I’m just curious about trying the IV NAD+ once, at a moderate dose. I’m going to Be leaving the area for probably at least a month and maybe two, so I won’t necesaarily be able to access this treatment in an affordable manner (eg not through a scammy addiction clinic ) after the next week or so. Although from what people have posted it seems like sublingual or intranasal NAD+ is bioavailable and it’s worth trying this first anyway?

*****
**** hello @debored13 - could you share a link about your intranasal glutathione and was it helpful? Thks

I have intranasal glutathione, which is kind of expensive and I’m not sure it helps much or is bioavailable.

 

[Lieselotte]

Hello.
I found that it was consecutive days.
I was too weak to travel to a clinic that offers the ten day protocol.

It took me weeks to build up strength to get to 3 day consecutive IV NAD.
I'm now months into getting it at least 2x a week. But it was my first 4 day consecutive that gave me the strength to do my first 5 day consecutive. Then later I did two 5 day consecutives. That was amazing.
I'm now in maintenance mode. Sometimes I do a small dose like 300mg and others 1,000mg.
my protocol now adds glutathione IV dropped slower than the NAD.
We also experimented with the co-nutrients before the NAD and mixed in. Now we just decide on how I feel / what my progress has been.
About every 3 weeks, I do need to put in the time and often nauseated feeling to do a long 5 hour 1,000mg drip. Sometimes the next 1,000mg is so easy breezy.

my brain is back to before this disease.
Sorry for the bold. I keep turning it off and it won't. I'm new to forum and often can't find same post again. So didn't want to lose your comment. Thx

@Hopeful2021 I have since done multiple days of NAD IVs. I did 3 days of 250mg, then 2 days of 500mg, then one day of 1000mg. The 500 and 1000 mg were too much for me. Not during the IV (that is always hard because I feel 'carsick' the whole time), but afterwards. I would get headaches and night sweats after the 500 & 1000. I ended up settling in to 250 only. Along with vitamins, a few days of aminos, low doses of glutathione and chelation IVs, I have slowly gained some ground.

 

[Hopeful2021]

@Hopeful2021 I have since done multiple days of NAD IVs. I did 3 days of 250mg, then 2 days of 500mg, then one day of 1000mg. The 500 and 1000 mg were too much for me. Not during the IV (that is always hard because I feel 'carsick' the whole time), but afterwards. I would get headaches and night sweats after the 500 & 1000. I ended up settling in to 250 only. Along with vitamins, a few days of aminos, low doses of glutathione and chelation IVs, I have slowly gained some ground.

@Lieselotte
That's awesome.
Wow. Hey.... improvements are improvements.
I because of frustration with social distancing problems decided I wanted to spend less time hooked up. I can drip 300-350 pretty fast. So we did that a few times followed by glutathione IV. Still great great results.
What are chelation IVs?
yes... aminos are so important often for me too even though I'm mainly carnivore and have good amino acid blood profile.

 

[junkcrap50]

So we did that a few times followed by glutathione IV.

What's the rational with following NAD with glutathione IV? Does NAD cause a lot of inflammation? Is that why it burns your muscles?

 

[mitoMAN]

Would NAD+ be superior to NADH infusions?

I'm interested to try this soon and curious on how it would compare to oral NMN or NADH.
I havent felt any improvement from 1000mg NMN nor 100mg NADH orally.

And would it be possible to replace 8 hour I.V with several smaller SubQ dosages?

I am not really into doing I.V myself, but would be able to obtain pretty reasonably priced NAD+ / NADH for SubQ injection.

 

[Hopeful2021]

I am now getting just 1 NAD IV a week and am giving myself 2 NAD suBQ shots more often.
They make me really sleepy. Do spreading them out means more time groggy.

Depends on how I feel. I'll do a 1000 or a 750 or a 300mg IV. But with shots it's just two with combined amount 200mg.

It's the shot or drip of glutathione that has really helped my brain feel super. I'm also doing hbot and O2 training. Now have a decent level of activity

 

[Hopeful2021]

Would NAD+ be superior to NADH infusions?

I'm interested to try this soon and curious on how it would compare to oral NMN or NADH.
I havent felt any improvement from 1000mg NMN nor 100mg NADH orally.

And would it be possible to replace 8 hour I.V with several smaller SubQ dosages?

I am not really into doing I.V myself, but would be able to obtain pretty reasonably priced NAD+ / NADH for SubQ injection.

@mitoMAN yes ... I think it's the next day when you feel the shots giving a 1/2 benefit of what IV gives about 2 hours later of same day of drip. Hope you let us know

 

[gbells]

Would NAD+ be superior to NADH infusions?

I'm interested to try this soon and curious on how it would compare to oral NMN or NADH.
I havent felt any improvement from 1000mg NMN nor 100mg NADH orally.

And would it be possible to replace 8 hour I.V with several smaller SubQ dosages?

I am not really into doing I.V myself, but would be able to obtain pretty reasonably priced NAD+ / NADH for SubQ injection.

Nicotinicamide Riboside is oral and does the same thing. No need for expensive infusions.

 

[mitoMAN]

Don't think oral NR would give me any benefit when oral very high hosed NMN and NADH did nothing.

Questions I discussed with @junkcrap50 via PM but might be interesting for everyone:
mitoMAN said:

I read that you also tried NAD+ Infusions. Your maximum was 500mg?

Yes, I tried NAD+ infusions. I did two sets of 10 infusions, with 5 infusions/week (M-F). My highest dose was 1,000mg. The NAD+ comes in 500mg vials. And the various protocols have different number of vials per day (starting higher then tapering towards the end.)

mitoMAN said:

Do you happen to know if NADH would be more potent? From what I understand, contrary to NAD+, it is able to enter the cell membrans directly
I do not know the difference between NADH and NAD+ infusions, frankly. They're two sides of the same coin. NADH infusions existed before NAD+ infusions came around and became popular. Reports of success with NADH exist. There is a remarkable youtube video of an italian patient with parkinsons who has all symptoms resolve with NADH. NAD+ infusions are also claimed to resolve parkisonian symptoms (and the original NAD+ clinic in Louisiana has a patient on video make this claim.)

The difference would, I guess, depend on the Oxidation-Reduction balance of the patient and what he/she needed. NADH and NAD+ are the redox of each other. Also, it is said that the ratio of NAD+ to NADH is what is important. But the research literature shows that NAD+ is the active, key molecule and has far greater therapeutic effects. Perhaps this article may help: https://www.elysiumhealth.com/en-us/science-101/whats-the-difference-between-nad-and-nadh

mitoMAN said:

He has the raw materials on hand and could even create subq administrations for me at raw material costs (close to none). I was wondering if you ever heard any information about subq application?
Is there a reason why it is adminstrated in very slow I.V infusion? Up to 8 hours?
Or would for example splitting the dosage into 4x SubQ injections throughout the day create a similar effect?
The absorption from belly fat would provide some kind of delayed buffer anyways?

I have never heard of subq NAD+. I would be wary of doing that, unless you take very, very small doses.

NAD+ infusion are NOT a pleasant experience and is very dependent on the rate of infusion. It's actually quite miserable. Some side effects are: malaise, nausea, shortness of breath, feeling of skin and muscle burning, and diarrhea. There may be others, but those are what I experienced. You control the infusion rate to a level where the side effects are tolerable, which leads to very long infusion times (~4 hours per 500mg NAD+). I believe my slowest rate was 8 drops/drips per minute. And my longest infusion was over 10 hours. I was VERY sensitive to the rate of infusion. So much so, that if I switched from my desk chair to the couch (so height from heart to drip increased, thus faster infusion rate due to lower venous pressure), I would get sudden side effects.

However, the infusion rate is different for every person. For instance my sibling could tolerate ~30 drops/minute. I think I remember hearing it depends on the relatively health of each patient. A healthy person can tolerate a high rate of infusion. A sicker person, a slower rate. Also, it depends on degree of addiction, when used in an addiction treatment setting.

As such, a subq injection sounds like a bad idea. You have no control over how fast the NAD+ gets absorbed. If you inject a very small dose, say <50mg, then maybe you won't get side effects. But I, personally, would not risk it. Unless there was already alot of experience of patients doing it.

mitoMAN said:

A friend of mine (a practitioner himself) suggested trying NAD+ or even NADH infusions directly. He suffers from a mitochondrial dysfunction himself but not CFS but a different disease. (floxxed due to an antibiotics)
He has the raw materials on hand and could even create subq administrations for me at raw material costs (close to none).

That's great. NAD+ is so expensive! I raw cost from a compounding pharmacy, which I think I've stated in the public threads, is cheap compared to what you pay. How does he have the raw materials? Or get it so cheap?

I will attach some NAD+ protocols I have found, just for you info.

PS: You can ask me all these questions publically in the threads. That way the knowledge is shared for anyone who may search for it later.

 

[mitoMAN]

I am now getting just 1 NAD IV a week and am giving myself 2 NAD suBQ shots more often.
They make me really sleepy. Do spreading them out means more time groggy.

Depends on how I feel. I'll do a 1000 or a 750 or a 300mg IV. But with shots it's just two with combined amount 200mg.

Do you feel like you could do higher dosages of SubQ self administration? Do you split them between the days?

Also: @junkcrap50 @Lieselotte @Hopeful2021
from what I understand you all felt worse during I.V and a while after.

---- DID you notice any BENEFIT or improvement? And how "fast" did these occur?

 

[Hopeful2021]

Do you feel like you could do higher dosages of SubQ self administration? Do you split them between the days?

Also: @junkcrap50 @Lieselotte @Hopeful2021
from what I understand you all felt worse during I.V and a while after.

---- DID you notice any BENEFIT or improvement? And how "fast" did these occur?

.....
....
I feel great and SUPER lucky to have dramatically improved as a result of NAD IV.
My brain is so so much better. Can feel how a decrease in inflammation really can be accomplished.
I recommend it highly.

 

[Hopeful2021]

Do you feel like you could do higher dosages of SubQ self administration? Do you split them between the days?

Also: @junkcrap50 @Lieselotte @Hopeful2021
from what I understand you all felt worse during I.V and a while after.

---- DID you notice any BENEFIT or improvement? And how "fast" did these occur?

....
As to rate.... it took many months.... it was only when i had consecutive days of IVs that my progress was rapid.

 

[mitoMAN]

3rd day for me on NADH s.c. injections.

1st day 150mg split in 3 dosages (50 - 50 - 50mg) 2hours gap between each
2nd day 150mg mornings
3rd day 150mg mornings - 150mg nights.

So far it gives GREAT mental energy boost, no brain fog anymore - I would say my brain is back to normal.

BUT very little impact on physical fatigue

Will take for 1-2 weeks till my supply is empty and then probably switch to NAD+ to compare.

 

[pattismith]

I started Nicotinamide Riboside 300 mg PO and got immediate energy boost (I also take corticosteroids).

I will see how it goes on a longer basis.

 

[Hopeful2021]

3rd day for me on NADH s.c. injections.

1st day 150mg split in 3 dosages (50 - 50 - 50mg) 2hours gap between each
2nd day 150mg mornings
3rd day 150mg mornings - 150mg nights.

So far it gives GREAT mental energy boost, no brain fog anymore - I would say my brain is back to normal.

BUT very little impact on physical fatigue

Will take for 1-2 weeks till my supply is empty and then probably switch to NAD+ to compare.

What great news...!!!
I've tapered the frequency and amount of NAD IVs I am doing. My subQ shots plus shots of glutathione (as doing NAD IV followed by glutathione IV or glutathione shots gave me my brain back to normal too).
I do still need maintenance.
It's nice not having to be at the doctors office for hours and hours to drip IV.

I've also started doing low oxygen with high oxygen training and will soon add NAD IV and glutathione IV on those days. One doctor has seen incredible reaults with this. Since adding this "adaptive contrast" O2 training, I've been able to do more physical activity. And my connective tissue/hyper mobility issues are much less of issues/ slightly bothersome compared to frightening and debilitating.

I'm really happy to hear of your success with these shots. I hope that others can get success too.

 

[dahsar]

What great news...!!!
I've tapered the frequency and amount of NAD IVs I am doing. My subQ shots plus shots of glutathione (as doing NAD IV followed by glutathione IV or glutathione shots gave me my brain back to normal too).
I do still need maintenance.
It's nice not having to be at the doctors office for hours and hours to drip IV.

I've also started doing low oxygen with high oxygen training and will soon add NAD IV and glutathione IV on those days. One doctor has seen incredible reaults with this. Since adding this "adaptive contrast" O2 training, I've been able to do more physical activity. And my connective tissue/hyper mobility issues are much less of issues/ slightly bothersome compared to frightening and debilitating.

I'm really happy to hear of your success with these shots. I hope that others can get success too.

This is so good to hear!!

How many weeks / drips of IV NAD+ infusions did you do?

 

[junkcrap50]

Also: @junkcrap50 @Lieselotte @Hopeful2021
from what I understand you all felt worse during I.V and a while after.

---- DID you notice any BENEFIT or improvement? And how "fast" did these occur?

I did not see any benefit or improvement from doing IV NAD+. But I still think it was worth doing because it does help on a cellular and DNA level. I sometimes wonder if perhaps my 2 sets of 10 days of infusions were just not enough. That my NAD+ levels were so low that I just needed to do more infusions. But from the anecdotes and protocols online, most people see a response very quickly. There may be a proglem with NAD+ recycling as it does get consumed quickly and needs to be recycled. Perhaps that is why it didn't work. But I didn't really investigate NAD+ recycling. I'm taking oral NAD+ and NMN daily now.

@Learner1 also responded well to NAD+ infusions. You can ask her how quickly her response was.

I feel great and SUPER lucky to have dramatically improved as a result of NAD IV.

As to rate.... it took many months.... it was only when i had consecutive days of IVs that my progress was rapid.

Many months? How many infusions did it take? How many infusions per week (per month) were you doing? Interesting that it took so long for you. How did you know to keep going? Many protocols keep it to 10 days (10 infusions). Do you feel that the glutathione infusions are essential following NAD+ infusions? To get the benefits of NAD+?

 

[junkcrap50]

I've tapered the frequency and amount of NAD IVs I am doing. My subQ shots plus shots of glutathione (as doing NAD IV followed by glutathione IV or glutathione shots gave me my brain back to normal too).
I do still need maintenance.
It's nice not having to be at the doctors office for hours and hours to drip IV.

What are the dosages for the glutathione subq shots and IVs? Glutathione shots were once popular around here ~8-10 years ago. But many said it required ATP to be in the shot as well, to get the glutathione intracellularly.

 

[mitoMAN]

I didn't even know there is direct ATP supplementation... does that help at all? Or just for the transport

If NAD+ didn't help. You should try NADH

both substances cost close to nothing from laboratories. The US health clinic prices are probably due to the many hours per IV.

1500mg NAD+ costs about 20USD max in bulk orders from licensed labs (as a doctor)

as private person you can source from China and have it 3rd party lab tested yourself in the USA.
1500mg NAD+ for about 10USD and 250USD lab testing once for the whole supply

i wouldn't suggest to do this without a doctor or nurse that is qualified to filter the substance and constitute it etc.!!!!