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UK: Department Work & Pensions Assessors Training Guide to ME/CFS Published - 28 May 2014

Esther12

Senior Member
Messages
13,774
It's been reported many times, since they got that contract in 1994.

http://biomedicalmecfs.blogspot.com/search?q=UNUM Some of the links in this blog have disappeared, such as the BBC article on what they called a "rogue company." See more links in the comment section

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unum See the last paragraph where it mentions that UNUM has had that contract since 1994.

I know that they've been advising the govt, but I don't think that they have any contract to do so.

From their point of view, they're having to compete with the state welfare system, so they have a strong incentive to do all they can to gut it without needing any contract to do so. I could be wrong, but I think that it's unlikely that they do have any such contract.
 

Iquitos

Senior Member
Messages
513
Location
Colorado
The news that they got that contract was big in disability activist circles at the time. It's a fact. A lot of the references to it have since been disappeared on the internet.

Did you not read that at the end of the wiki entry? They got that contract in 1994. Maybe the contract is up for renewal and that's why the big propaganda campaign has been started.

See also:

http://disabilitynewsservice.com/20...dvisors-to-work-secretly-for-insurance-giant/
 

Esther12

Senior Member
Messages
13,774
The news that they got that contract was big in disability activist circles at the time. It's a fact. A lot of the references to it have since been disappeared on the internet.

Did you not read that at the end of the wiki entry? They got that contract in 1994. Maybe the contract is up for renewal and that's why the big propaganda campaign has been started.

See also:

http://disabilitynewsservice.com/20...dvisors-to-work-secretly-for-insurance-giant/

That paragraph doesn't say anything about them being contracted in as advisors.

Advising the United Kingdom government on claims since 1994, Unum has been involved with the UK's controversial Welfare Reform Bill.[50][51] Unum was investigated by the BBC in England[52] and were described by critics as a 'rogue firm'.[53][verification needed]

I know that Unum having being advising the government on these things, but don't think that they are being paid to do so, or have being contracted to do so. They would want as much influence in this area as possible, regardless of whether they were being paid or not.
 
Messages
106
I know that they've been advising the govt, but I don't think that they have any contract to do so.

From their point of view, they're having to compete with the state welfare system, so they have a strong incentive to do all they can to gut it without needing any contract to do so. I could be wrong, but I think that it's unlikely that they do have any such contract.
There was a financial deal with a member of the UNUM board back in 1994, and the restructuring of disability benefits by the then Tory Government was undoubtedly influenced by the Insurance Industry. It's likely that UNUM or other comparable businesses have provided technical services to the DWP and its predecessor departments though there's no evidence of a single 20 year contract for UNUM - short term technical services/advice can be provided by subcontracts and thus hidden from public view via commercial confidentiality clauses. A 20 year rolling contrct would be evident.

The 1994 deal:

http://www.meassociation.org.uk/201...and-income-protection-cover-11-november-2011/

Behind the scenes it [UNUM] has been helping Tory and Labour governments slash the benefits of disabled and sick people for years – going right back to Peter Lilley’s social security “Incapacity for Work” reforms of 1994. Lilley hired John Le Cascio, then vice-president of Unum, to advise on “claims management”. Le Cascio also sat on the “medical evaluation group”, which – according to Professor Jonathan Rutherford in the academic journal Soundings – was set up to design and enforce more stringent medical tests.
 

Esther12

Senior Member
Messages
13,774
Yes, and also Mike O’Donnell was Unum's CMO before moving over to Atos. I'm not at all saying that there aren't lots of worrying links and associations - Unum have bragged about their influence: http://disabilitynewsservice.com/20...rnment-thinking-on-incapacity-benefit-reform/

It's just that this claim was new to me, and I thought could be inaccurate:

Don't forget that UNUM has a contract with Works and Pensions to "limit disability awards."

PS: I didn't mean to seem critical of @Iquitos - it can be hard to get all the phrasing of things strictly accurate, so just wanted to double-check it.
 
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Messages
106
Yes, and also Mike O’Donnell was Unum's CMO before moving over to Atos. I'm not at all saying that there aren't lots of worrying links and associations - Unum have bragged about their influence: http://disabilitynewsservice.com/20...rnment-thinking-on-incapacity-benefit-reform/

It's just that this claim was new to me, and I thought could be inaccurate:
Agreed - UNUM has a contract with Works and Pensions to "limit disability awards." just doesn't make sense. It could be that UNUM or a subsidiary is involved in training DWP 'decision makers' but the idea that somehow UNUM is covertly processing ESA and PIP claims alongside the DWP staff seems far fetched to say the least.
 

Iquitos

Senior Member
Messages
513
Location
Colorado
OK, maybe "contract" is too specific a word, although that IS the word used by BBC in UK and in Scotland at the time UK government members HIRED a vice-president of UNUM to advise the government on "welfare reform." Those news stories can no longer be found so I can't provide what has been disappeared. UNUM's own internal memos at the time said they had such a contract and it was for the purpose of limiting liabilty. This they told to investors, the same investors who have a lot of money in ATO, an equally evil company that has such a contract now.

UNUM also worked both sides of the issue by putting out a media campaign to scare people about the cuts coming from DWP and to seduce people to buy UNUM disability insurance to counter those cuts!!!
 

Iquitos

Senior Member
Messages
513
Location
Colorado
Agreed - UNUM has a contract with Works and Pensions to "limit disability awards." just doesn't make sense. It could be that UNUM or a subsidiary is involved in training DWP 'decision makers' but the idea that somehow UNUM is covertly processing ESA and PIP claims alongside the DWP staff seems far fetched to say the least.

No one said they were working with the employees of DWP. They, at least one of their vice-presidents, were hired to advise DPW on how to limit liability -- to establish policy and methods. Once policy and methods are established, they don't need to be onsite doing the denials.
 
Messages
106
No one said they were working with the employees of DWP. They, at least one of their vice-presidents, were hired to advise DPW on how to limit liability -- to establish policy and methods. Once policy and methods are established, they don't need to be onsite doing the denials.
Having lived through the impacts of 30 years of welfare changes, from having a young family to approaching the propospects older age benefits, I think I have a small degre of understanding of what happened in the past and what is happening now. Advice given to a UK Government Department under a different administration 20 years ago is at best tangentially relevant to what is happening now. The notion of 'limiting liabilty' does not easily transfer to the UK disability benefits set up, certainly there has as part of the current Government's belief system, and under the guise of controlling Government spending, been a wholesale reduction in entitlement to benefits. But UNUM weren't needed for that and the methodology of the new more onerous system was largely provided by ATOS under contracts started nearly ten years ago: http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/ne...uter-controlled-nurses-to-replace-dla-doctors

Of course one can look for conspiracy and malign influence anywhere, but why make things complicated when our political setup provides all the necessary impetus for limiting Governmental support for chronically ill and disabled people ? Businesses operate for profit, and other than the requirements of the Law we can't expect anything other than businesses exploiting of opportunities - it's politicians we need to hold to account.
 

Esther12

Senior Member
Messages
13,774
I find that referring to things as a 'conspiracy' can now just be a rather cheap way of dismissing legitimate concerns. The BPS model has played a key role in justifying the recent benefit changes - this has been promoted by Unum and by researchers associated with them: it has been explicitly used by Atos (whose CMO came from Unum), it has been used by Aylward while he was at the DWP and when he moved to Unum's centre for Psychosocial research, used by Freud in the House of Lords, used to affectthe way CFS patients are treated... I think that the BPS model has been a malign influence, and whether you chose to class the people promoting and making money from it as a 'conspiracy' or not really doesn't alter the fact that they have had a profoundly negative impact upon the way the sick and disabled are treated in this country.
 
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Messages
106
I find that referring to things as a 'conspiracy' can now just be a rather cheap way of dismissing legitimate concerns. The BPS model has played a key role in justifying the recent benefit changes - this has been promoted by Unum and by researchers associated with them: it has been explicitly used by Atos (whose CMO came from Unum), it has been used by Aylward while he was at the DWP and when he moved to Unum's centre for Psychosocial research, used by Freud in the House of Lords, used to affectthe way CFS patients are treated... I think that the BPS model has been a malign influence, and whether you chose to class the people promoting and making money from it as a 'conspiracy' or not really doesn't alter the fact that they have had a profoundly negative impact upon the way the sick and disabled are treated in this country.
Cheap or economical ? Taking a whole set of different elements, separated by time and context but which have a sort of connecting ‘meme’ and making that into a consistent story is quintessential conspiricism. Few posters here accept that kind of thinking when it comes to justifying the BPS, so surely it’s not acceptable in building a rational treatment of how the BPS plays out in politics and Government policy ?

Politicians seek out advisors and contractors who confirm their particular biases, there’s obvious failings in this practice but it’s how most modern states work. So Peter Lilley 20 year ago sought advice from a director of UNUM – no surprise there, was Lilley especially enthralled by the BPS model, there’s no evidence of that but it is irrelevant in that by 1997 Lilley was out of Government and the next set of Benefit changes were brought in by Blair and Brown. Of course Mansel Aylward was in post for both the Major and Blair Governments and clearly he was able to match his enthusiasm for the BPS model with providing satisfaction to Governments of both right and left. This isn’t actually surprising because the amorphous nature of the BPS model allows the Right to find value in the self reliance small state memes that the BPS supports, while the Left finds the association of life circumstance with health outcomes an appealing analysis.

What isn’t needed in any of this is an Illuminati of a BPS cult acting as puppet masters controlling governments. A leader in UNUM getting a better contract in ATOS isn’t sign of some transfer of influence – it’s just the usual round of executive ladder climbing. Yes ATOS has been a feature of benefits administration since the early years of the Blair Government, but the current Government’s implementation of ESA is a long way from what the Blair/Brown Governments were presenting ESA as intended to be.

The BPS model (probably disguised in other terminology) will continue to be attractive to UK and US Governments of all persuasions because it ticks so many political boxes. In the UK the BPS provides a cosy squaring of circle that all parties struggle with, that is - the cost of a directly funded health care system. Despite the fact that on numerous measures the NHS is the most efficient, cost effective and on the sheer volume of health care delivered, the best national system in the world, it still sits as a big item in the Government’s current account and modern economic theory as policed by the Banks doesn’t like that. A founding principle of the NHS was that once universal healthcare was in place, health care costs would FALL ! For a whole raft of reasons that no one in 1948 could reasonably have grasped, the opposite was true, but every Government since then has struggled to either contain costs or justify increases with a notional deferment of Government spending elsewhere.

Health and social costs are where BPS fits in, UNUM, ATOS, and the whole Psychiatric profession are at best enablers or mere screens for politicians to rationalise swapping between or reducing health spending and disability benefits. The Blair Government achieved the largest increase in health care spending since1948, but the cost was in part to be borne or at least justified by reducing disability benefits. ATOS was an agent employed to achieve the reduction, but the political drive was wholly independent of ATOS, of UNUM, of Aylward, Sharpe, White or anyone else assumed to be part of the BPS priesthood. The current Government dislikes the State as a provider of services but is stuck with an electorate that is strongly wedded to the NHS – cutting welfare is the political cost of keeping NHS spending unchanged ( aside from the actual £20 billion in cuts !). A BPS model no doubt still alibis thinking in the both Department of Health and the DWP – but ‘austerity’ and a ‘smaller state’ are the guiding principles, anything else is just fluff, including the BPS.
 

Esther12

Senior Member
Messages
13,774
What isn’t needed in any of this is an Illuminati of a BPS cult acting as puppet masters controlling governments.

Does that contradict anything anyone here has said?

Most of your reply seems unrelated to the prior discussion. You seem to be debunking claims no-one has made.

but the current Government’s implementation of ESA is a long way from what the Blair/Brown Governments were presenting ESA as intended to be.

The Labour government's implementation of ESA was a long way from what they had presented it as intended to be. The implementation of rehabilitative therapies for CFS is a long way from what they are commonly presented as being. That's not surprising given the level of quackery to be found in BPS approaches.

ATOS was an agent employed to achieve the reduction, but the political drive was wholly independent of ATOS, of UNUM, of Aylward, Sharpe, White or anyone else assumed to be part of the BPS priesthood.

There were political pressures aside from those promoting the BPS approach, but the drive that actually occurred did have their theories and misrepresentations built in as a core part of the reforms.

The BPS lot are a key reason why politicians think that spending more on their treatments is going to empower and enable the sick and disabled into competing in the modern labour market (or at least, being ineligible for further welfare benefits) - they're now coming face to face with the data showing that this doesn't work, and don't really seem to know what to do about it. Most likely imo, blame the sick and disabled.

A BPS model no doubt still alibis thinking in the both Department of Health and the DWP – but ‘austerity’ and a ‘smaller state’ are the guiding principles, anything else is just fluff, including the BPS.

It's an important alibi, that has played a really important role in shaping how political parties and many in the media view and discuss these cuts. In a democracy, alibis used by politicians really matter, and really affect what they can get away with. It's not 'just fluff', it's important and dangerous fluff. Lots of politicians genuinely want to make life better for sick and disabled people, and the BPS model has played an important role in distorting that instinct.
 
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106
There were political pressures aside from those promoting the BPS approach, but the drive that actually occurred did have their theories and misrepresentations built in as a core part of the reforms.
Even if BPS theories and misrepresentations are in the core of the structure of ESA and PIP (I'd like to see some evidence that this is uniquely so) they are there because they serve a political pupose, not because politicians were fooled into acceptance or blind to the implications.

The BPS lot are a key reason why politicians think that spending more on their treatments is going to empower and enable the sick and disabled into competing in the modern labour market (or at least, being ineligible for further welfare benefits) - they're now coming face to face with the data showing that this doesn't work, and don't really seem to know what to do about it. Most likely imo, blame the sick and disabled.
Again I'd like to see evidence for the BPS model being a 'first cause' in political thinking on UK benefit changes. There's certainly nothing that stands out in Hansard where where a search gives just 34 responses, 29 of which are from the Commons or Lords and about half concerning ME, only one of which, from 1998, is approving in a misunderstood sort of way. If BPS has had any influence on UK government policy, it is only (as with pretty much any other idea) because it confirms exisiting political prejudices. TheTories don't need insurance companies and psychiatrists to tell them that cutting benefits is a good thing, any more than Labour and Lib Dems need to be persuaded to believe that social inclusion and employment are of near religiously redemptive value. If BPS is in the package it's because it fits with the reigning political paradigm, not because the paradigm has been formed arround BPS.

And who says it doesn't work ? From the Tory perspective, several £billion has been diverted from the dead end of economically inactive poor people, to the private sector (an economic gain) and the value of the Welfare State has been diminshed in the eyes of the electorate (a political gain). Of course the outcomes are not what was promised, and of course the feckless poor will be blamed for not getting with the programme, but the Tories aren't talking to the part of the electorate that will be concerned about any of that. It's true that for Labour there's a conundrum but there always will be while the Party clings to a myth of full employment and a notion that there can be zero descrimination against sick and disabled people. Labour doesn't need the BPS to get itself into a policy cul de sac over health, disability and employment, it's been there for fourty years.
It's an important alibi, that has played a really important role in shaping how political parties and many in the media view and discuss these cuts. In a democracy, alibis used by politicians really matter, and really affect what they can get away with. It's not 'just fluff', it's important and dangerous fluff. Lots of politicians genuinely want to make life better for sick and disabled people, and the BPS model has played an important role in distorting that instinct.
I really don't think that more than about fifty MPs or Lords could explain BPS or recognise anything related to it without going to Wikipedia first. Politicians want lots of things, yes many of them 'care' but few are ever forced to face up to the contradictions of their own positions. I've seen Tory councillors and MPs who've supported massive destruction of the social housing sector, when faced with one of their own constituents who is urgent need of housing just can't understand why their demand that something should be done, can't be met. Labour MPs weren't ignorant of what the effects of ESA would likely be (even under best of all possible worlds it was clear from 2008 that many disabled peoples lives would be made more miserable) Labour MPs simply chose to believe it would all be good, they didn't need to have some new nostrum like the BPS to persuade them, their existing belief system was quite enough to encourage such crass optimism.
 

Esther12

Senior Member
Messages
13,774
Even if BPS theories and misrepresentations are in the core of the structure of ESA and PIP (I'd like to see some evidence that this is uniquely so) they are there because they serve a political pupose, not because politicians were fooled into acceptance or blind to the implications.

I'm not too sure what you mean by this. Do you not think that there are politicians who do believe the exaggerated claims made about the psychosocial determinants of disability, and the ability of the state to alter policies in a way which is in accordance with the BPS model will improve the lives of the sick and disabled and save the government money at the same time?

As for wanting evidence of the importance of the BPS approach, your Hansard search should have found Lord Freud citing Aylward's pamphlet promoting the BPS model as an explanation of the underpinnings of their approach to disability for Welfare reform.

There was some discussion of this here, and the White book on BPS which I think is important: http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...cial-model-paper-from-2004.17783/#post-271134

Aylward was a key figure at the DWP when the foundation for these reforms was laid (and the reason the DWP helped fund PACE), and is about as clear as one can be about his desire to promote a BPS approach when talking to Atos:

"I was very taken by what was discussed today at the
conference about pyschosocial issues and vocational
rehabilitation. I've been working hard to get this on the agenda
and to get the bio-psychosocial model adopted by those in
power."

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...some-disability-protestors.19463/#post-298015

Atos's website described their assessments as being biopsychosocial.

While we cannot know exactly what minister's mean when they endlessly claim that welfare reforms were necessary to account for our 'new understanding of disability', it seems that there has been some breakthrough in our understanding which fits pretty closely to the biopsychosocial model.

Again I'd like to see evidence for the BPS model being a 'first cause' in political thinking on UK benefit changes.

What do you mean, 'again'? Has anyone claimed that they were a 'first cause'? With political changes as significant as this, there are always going to be a number of different factors shaping policy. The promotion of the BPS model has been very important, but I'm not even sure what it would mean for it to be a 'first cause'. That there was no desire to reduce spending on disability benefits prior to the development of the BPS model?

If BPS has had any influence on UK government policy, it is only (as with pretty much any other idea) because it confirms exisiting political prejudices.

I disagree. Where do you think that all of these existing political prejudices come from? They can be shaped by ideas like the BPS approach, particularly if it's being promoted by those who can claim to be indpendent experts and they are telling politicians what they want to hear.

If BPS is in the package it's because it fits with the reigning political paradigm, not because the paradigm has been formed arround BPS.

It's not either/or. The BPS model has successfully shaped and altered the political consensus partly because it fit with a number of pre-existing desires and interests.

And who says it doesn't work ?

In terms of moving sick and disabled people into paid employment, it is now starting to be accepted that it does not work, as that is what the data shows. If you remove the claims about empowering and energising people rather than abandoning them, and the reforms need to be more honestly sold as a way of saving money by pushing many sick and disabled people into poverty, then I think that's a healthy thing for democratic debate in this country.

Labour doesn't need the BPS to get itself into a policy cul de sac over health, disability and employment, it's been there for fourty years.

The BPS model helped it pretend otherwise, and avoid making difficult choices honestly.

I really don't think that more than about fifty MPs or Lords could explain BPS or recognise anything related to it without going to Wikipedia first. Politicians want lots of things, yes many of them 'care' but few are ever forced to face up to the contradictions of their own positions. I've seen Tory councillors and MPs who've supported massive destruction of the social housing sector, when faced with one of their own constituents who is urgent need of housing just can't understand why their demand that something should be done, can't be met. Labour MPs weren't ignorant of what the effects of ESA would likely be (even under best of all possible worlds it was clear from 2008 that many disabled peoples lives would be made more miserable) Labour MPs simply chose to believe it would all be good, they didn't need to have some new nostrum like the BPS to persuade them, their existing belief system was quite enough to encourage such crass optimism.

I'm not saying that they have any depth of understanding, but if they have reassuring sounding independent experts telling them that these reforms will be good for the sick and disabled, then that is going to affect their view of these sorts of reforms.

You seem to keep arguing against exaggerated versions of what I've actually said.
 
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shahida

Senior Member
Messages
120
can someone please tell me how this guidance compares to the last- will it now be harder for PWME to obtain state support? thanks
 

Bob

Senior Member
Messages
16,455
Location
England (south coast)
Slightly off-topic, but Lady Mar asked a question in the UK parliament on 27 November 2014...

The Countess of Mar (Crossbench)
To ask Her Majesty’s Government how many claimants for Employment Support Allowance who have degenerative conditions for which there is no possibility of improvement have been placed in the Work-Related Activity Group; how many have found employment; how many have had their benefits reduced for failing to find employment; whether the position of those claimants will be reviewed; and, if so, when.
The reply was quite telling...
Lord Freud
The information as requested is not available.
 

alex3619

Senior Member
Messages
13,810
Location
Logan, Queensland, Australia
In my view BPS is in danger of becoming the new Eugenics movement. I think the economic direction changed in the late 70s and this combined with BPS led to changes in how things are viewed. The insurance industry took advantage of that, and helped push the new way of thinking. It is however a synergy of different historical forces, all reinforcing each other. No conspiracy is needed, but its certainly a good environment for conspiracies to flourish.

What I call economic rationalism, also known as Thatcherism and Reagonism (though each is a little different I think) combined with the BPS push to view disease as psychological and societal, and the normal economic imperative for some insurance companies to deny benefits if they at all can.

Its all connected. Its also embraced by most political parties, as the new economic movement, a reaction to a minor failure of Keynesianism, was adopted by most economists and most politicians in the Western world. Its also a modern twist on elitism or class warfare. Eugenics was a driving force in pre-WW2 Germany.